https://www.foxnews.com/media/ccp-government-intentionally-released-covid-19-over-world-chinese-virologist

posted by QuakerOats

Dr. Li Meng Yan stands by her claim that the CCP released the virus intentionally.  Pursuing the truth should be a high priority and should not stop until we have it.  Then we should pursue damages if appropriate. 

Regardless of what the "truth" actually is, the human race is so f*cked, either side will continue to pursue "THEIR" truth, and only listen to evidence that supports their truth.

posted by gut

Govt has been shown to lie over and over and over.  But, c'mon guys, it's not cool to question authority.  

I will never understand this.  Ever.  I'm not saying that everything the government tells me is a lie, but I will be damned if I ever trust a single word that comes from the government.  They treat their citizens as "guilty until proven innocent," and I will reciprocate that to them.

Ptown needs this…

posted by jmog

Ptown needs this…

I didn't pick up on it back then, but it's funny how uncomfortable and at a loss for words Colbert is.  He doesn't know if it's a bit, or if it's serious, or a combination of both.  Ends up awkwardly trying to downplay it.

Colbert was hilarious on the Daily Show.  But like a lot of people, Trump broke him.

posted by gut

I didn't pick up on it back then, but it's funny how uncomfortable and at a loss for words Colbert is.  He doesn't know if it's a bit, or if it's serious, or a combination of both.  Ends up awkwardly trying to downplay it.

Colbert was hilarious on the Daily Show.  But like a lot of people, Trump broke him.

Oh you can definitely see it in Colbert’s face he was like “dude, we aren’t supposed to say that out loud!”

Good to see this thread back thriving at the top. Everyone in agreement now I assume.

posted by jmog

1. Occam’s razor. A coronavirus started in Wuhan China where there is a major coronavirus research lab located. Occam’s razor leaves all rational people to say “this new respiratory virus that has way weirder symptoms than regular respiratory viruses…it had to come from that lab right down the road…NOT FROM A FOOD MARKET”. 

Come on Ptown, drop the act.

2. Knowing it came from a lab is not the same as proving it beyond a reasonable doubt in criminal court.  The evidence suggests it, even a preponderance of evidence (>50/50) but not “beyond a reasonable doubt” required for criminal jail time. Yet it would pass muster in a civil case.

3. Your dense belief that we need to wait for declassified verification is intriguing yet you don’t follow that same reasoning/requirement when it’s a subject you already agree with on your side of the aisle.

We are arguing over semantics here. My standard for something like this is the how confident is the evidence that the intelligence community is providing. 

In a formal governmental setting like this, in order to prove something, have to show the evidence. You use the court argument, while I am using the intelligence community language and methods. Occam's razor won't cut it. That's my point. I think we are in agreement on what is possible, but do you have the evidence? So far no.

My view has always been to read into what the IC is releasing and how confident are they on matters of foreign policy, which this is. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

We are arguing over semantics here. My standard for something like this is the how confident is the evidence that the intelligence community is providing. 

In a formal governmental setting like this, in order to prove something, have to show the evidence. You use the court argument, while I am using the intelligence community language and methods. Occam's razor won't cut it. That's my point. I think we are in agreement on what is possible, but do you have the evidence? So far no.

My view has always been to read into what the IC is releasing and how confident are they on matters of foreign policy, which this is. 

Ok, forget word play and semantics.

Down to brass tacks.  

What, in your view, is the percent chance COVID-19 came from a lab vs a bat at a wet market. 

60/40? 50/50?

posted by jmog

Ok, forget word play and semantics.

Down to brass tacks.  

What, in your view, is the percent chance COVID-19 came from a lab vs a bat at a wet market. 

60/40? 50/50?

My view? I say 50/50 as in I don't know. I can't dismiss either one of them. 

If I had to pick one, I'd say lab, but little confidence in that option.

I don't think we will ever know for sure unless we get some key intel or credible human sources, so anything is really guess work. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

My view? I say 50/50 as in I don't know. I can't dismiss either one of them. 

If I had to pick one, I'd say lab, but little confidence in that option.

I don't think we will ever know for sure unless we get some key intel or credible human sources, so anything is really guess work. 

So the Doctor, who worked at the Wuhan Virology Lab, and fled China in 2020 to basically whistle blow what happened at that lab…

SHE isn’t a “credible human source”? 

If a doctor who actually worked at that lab isn’t a credible source in your opinion then zero credible sources exist on this planet in ptown’s world.

posted by jmog

So the Doctor, who worked at the Wuhan Virology Lab, and fled China in 2020 to basically whistle blow what happened at that lab…

SHE isn’t a “credible human source”? 

If a doctor who actually worked at that lab isn’t a credible source in your opinion then zero credible sources exist on this planet in ptown’s world.

I think the biggest issue is the fact that no one can trust anyone or anything that they hear.  We question the validity of EVERYTHING (questioning isn't bad).  We have to rely on the "truth" to come from somewhere, and we have to trust that what we are hearing is the truth.  I don't think that exists anywhere.

Of course it came from the lab. Bat soup...lol.

posted by ernest_t_bass

I will never understand this.  Ever.  I'm not saying that everything the government tells me is a lie, but I will be damned if I ever trust a single word that comes from the government.  They treat their citizens as "guilty until proven innocent," and I will reciprocate that to them.

If the government is lying to us it must be for our own good so we should just bend over and take it like good little citizens.

posted by ernest_t_bass

I think the biggest issue is the fact that no one can trust anyone or anything that they hear.  We question the validity of EVERYTHING (questioning isn't bad).  We have to rely on the "truth" to come from somewhere, and we have to trust that what we are hearing is the truth.  I don't think that exists anywhere.

Yeah, in today's climate, the smartest thing to do is to assume anything anyone says about virtually anything has some sort of agenda and their words and the way those words are phrased are for the purpose of advancing that agenda.

And, yes, that sentence does serve to advance my agenda of "Fuck the powers that be and everything about all of them, regardless of affiliation."

posted by jmog

So the Doctor, who worked at the Wuhan Virology Lab, and fled China in 2020 to basically whistle blow what happened at that lab…

SHE isn’t a “credible human source”? 

If a doctor who actually worked at that lab isn’t a credible source in your opinion then zero credible sources exist on this planet in ptown’s world.

I don't know. I don't have access to what material or primary sources that she brought out and if any of that information has been verified.

It's one data point and source. 

You cannot prove anything from one source.....

There is a famous example of why not...Iraq. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

I don't know. I don't have access to what material or primary sources that she brought out and if any of that information has been verified.

It's one data point and source. 

You cannot prove anything from one source.....

There is a famous example of why not...Iraq. 

You didn’t answer the question, you just deflected again.

Is she a credible human source?

posted by jmog

You didn’t answer the question, you just deflected again.

Is she a credible human source?

I. Don't. Know.

I don't know if her evidence is credible. Do you? Have you verified it? 

Ever heard of curveball? 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

There is a famous example of why not...Iraq. 

Wait, the WMDs were in Wuhan this whole time?

I met this fun lady at CPAC today. Her name is Melissa Rein Lively. Tonight she met Fauci in Washington DC and took this incredible picture with him.

Everyone is jealous that they didn’t get to do it! 😂😂😂 pic.twitter.com/1Hf0LxDwpY

— Ada Lluch 🇪🇸 (@ada_lluch) March 4, 2023

posted by BR1986FB

I met this fun lady at CPAC today. Her name is Melissa Rein Lively. Tonight she met Fauci in Washington DC and took this incredible picture with him.

Everyone is jealous that they didn’t get to do it! 😂😂😂 pic.twitter.com/1Hf0LxDwpY

— Ada Lluch 🇪🇸 (@ada_lluch) March 4, 2023

Shit like this is cringey when the left does it, and it doesn't make it less cringey if someone on the right does it (assuming she is on the right). 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Sounding very 2003 liberal you are...

Sadly, those liberals pretty much went missing around 2008 and were never to be seen again.  

If they ever come back, they will be ashamed to see that liberals became everything that they hated. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

I. Don't. Know.

I don't know if her evidence is credible. Do you? Have you verified it? 

Ever heard of curveball? 

So who would be credible if not someone who worked there? 

In a generic sense, wouldn't that be someone who is most credible, an eye witness?

posted by ptown_trojans_1

My view? I say 50/50 as in I don't know. I can't dismiss either one of them. 

If I had to pick one, I'd say lab, but little confidence in that option.

I don't think we will ever know for sure unless we get some key intel or credible human sources, so anything is really guess work. 

50/50 whether this virus was from a lab or from bat soup? 

Come on ptown, what does logic/common sense tell you?

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/biggest-scandal-american-history

We now know this censorship and speech silencing was part of a systematic effort of senior scientists to mislead the American people. When COVID-19 first became a threat in early 2020, Dr. Anthony Fauci already knew the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID) had funded research in the Wuhan Institute of Virology via EcoHealth Alliance. He knew the WIV was a subgrantee of EcoHealth Alliance – and that EcoHealth Alliance was not in compliance with its grant reporting. Specifically, the organization was out of compliance for a project that NIAID knew could potentially make novel bat-borne coronaviruses much more dangerous.

Fauci knew all this.

So, the same experts who are paid by the American people and given tens of billions of dollars to invest in research decided that they would deliberately mislead the American people.

This perfectly captures the arrogance of the aristo-bureaucrats, who believe they are intellectually and morally superior to the people to whom they are supposed to be accountable. They believe they have the right and duty to censor what we think and say – and to feed us falsehoods in the name of some higher duty.