posted by jmog

It was started in the US...by illegals from El Salvadore. Most of it's members to this day are illegals from El Salvadore and Central America.

So, while technically it was started in LA, calling it an "American gang" is purposefully misleading since the majority of the members are not US Citizens.

you have no way to calculate the citizenship numbers of the MS13 gang. either way closing the border will make zero difference on this gang as it started in the US and has members all over the country who were born here and are citizens of the US.  It is a gang that was started in the US and is an american gang however you want to spin it.

posted by geeblock

you have no way to calculate the citizenship numbers of the MS13 gang. either way closing the border will make zero difference on this gang as it started in the US and has members all over the country who were born here and are citizens of the US.  It is a gang that was started in the US and is an american gang however you want to spin it.

I hope you are kidding. A gang of illegals is an American gang? Lay off the MSNBC geeblock. 

posted by jmog

I hope you are kidding. A gang of illegals is an American gang? Lay off the MSNBC geeblock. 

In 2018, the gang accounted for less than 1 percent (10,000) of total gang members in the United States (1.4 million), and a similar share of gang murders. The gang is a core component to Republican Party messaging on immigration policy in the United States. The Trump administration and Republican politicians have argued that hardline immigration policies are necessary to combat MS-13, and have for example justified the Trump administration's implementation of a family separation policy to deal with MS-13. There is no evidence that weak immigration enforcement or sanctuary city policies contribute to MS-13 activity. Republican politicians, President Trump in particular, have falsely accused Democratic politicians of supporting MS-13.

that is straight from wikipedia

posted by geeblock

In 2018, the gang accounted for less than 1 percent (10,000) of total gang members in the United States (1.4 million), and a similar share of gang murders. The gang is a core component to Republican Party messaging on immigration policy in the United States. The Trump administration and Republican politicians have argued that hardline immigration policies are necessary to combat MS-13, and have for example justified the Trump administration's implementation of a family separation policy to deal with MS-13. There is no evidence that weak immigration enforcement or sanctuary city policies contribute to MS-13 activity. Republican politicians, President Trump in particular, have falsely accused Democratic politicians of supporting MS-13.

 

 

that is straight from wikipedia

Also from Wikipedia (the first sentence of it, you conveniently left it out) "Mara Salvatrucha, popularly known as MS-13, is an international criminal gang that originated in Los Angeles, California, in the 1970s and 1980s. The gang later spread to many parts of the continental United States, Canada, Mexico, and Central America, and is active in urban, suburban, and rural areas. Most members are Central American"

I even agree the right uses it as a tool, but get outta here with your US citizen claim

posted by geeblock

In 2018, the gang accounted for less than 1 percent (10,000) of total gang members in the United States (1.4 million), and a similar share of gang murders. The gang is a core component to Republican Party messaging on immigration policy in the United States. The Trump administration and Republican politicians have argued that hardline immigration policies are necessary to combat MS-13, and have for example justified the Trump administration's implementation of a family separation policy to deal with MS-13. There is no evidence that weak immigration enforcement or sanctuary city policies contribute to MS-13 activity. Republican politicians, President Trump in particular, have falsely accused Democratic politicians of supporting MS-13.

 

 

that is straight from wikipedia

Well if you can use wiki so can I. Wiki is the one that stated that most of the gang are illegals from Central America, namely El Salvadore.

So once again, I was right, they are illegals and your statement that I quoted here has ZERO to do with the fact that they are illegals and therefore NOT an "american gang". 

Major facepalm there geeblock, you go to wiki, conveniently don't copy/paste the first sentence of your copy/paste work because it is the sentence that directly states what I did and contradicts you. You move the goalposts to the Rs using them as a talking point (don't disagree here at all, but that wasn't the topic, you said they were an american gang).

posted by iclfan2

Also from Wikipedia (the first sentence of it, you conveniently left it out) "Mara Salvatrucha, popularly known as MS-13, is an international criminal gang that originated in Los Angeles, California, in the 1970s and 1980s. The gang later spread to many parts of the continental United States, Canada, Mexico, and Central America, and is active in urban, suburban, and rural areas. Most members are Central American"

I even agree the right uses it as a tool, but get outta here with your US citizen claim

my point is this gang as it says has been here since the 70's and 80's.  The children of these gang members are US citizens, and they have grown and spread all over the country.  A border wall will make no difference because they are already here. Im not saying they dont have a large membership of illegals, but they also have a large  membership at this point that also are US citizens.  Also most of the murders by MS13 are other MS13 and mexican gangs.  They arent a huge threat to those outside of the drug/cartel trade imo

posted by geeblock

my point is this gang as it says has been here since the 70's and 80's.  The children of these gang members are US citizens, and they have grown and spread all over the country.  A border wall will make no difference because they are already here. Im not saying they dont have a large membership of illegals, but they also have a large  membership at this point that also are US citizens. 

You use wiki to move the goalposts, then change your tune when we call you out on it. Interesting tactic for sure, but in reality your original statement, that they are an "american gang" is bull shit and you know it. That's just as much, or more, of a liberal talking point as when the Rs use them as a reason for the wall.

posted by jmog

You use wiki to move the goalposts, then change your tune when we call you out on it. Interesting tactic for sure, but in reality your original statement, that they are an "american gang" is bull shit and you know it.

Started in Los Angelos 

posted by geeblock

my point is this gang as it says has been here since the 70's and 80's.  The children of these gang members are US citizens, and they have grown and spread all over the country.  A border wall will make no difference because they are already here. Im not saying they dont have a large membership of illegals, but they also have a large  membership at this point that also are US citizens.  Also most of the murders by MS13 are other MS13 and mexican gangs.  They arent a huge threat to those outside of the drug/cartel trade imo

Also, above you stated that I had no idea what the makeup of the gang was...and then you come in this post and state that their children are in the gang and therefore the gang has a lot of US citizens in it. Do you not realize you just did exactly what you said I couldn't do?

posted by jmog

Also, above you stated that I had no idea what the makeup of the gang was...and then you come in this post and state that their children are in the gang and therefore the gang has a lot of US citizens in it. Do you not realize you just did exactly what you said I couldn't do?

i said it has both illegals and us citizens, i have no idea the percentages..

posted by geeblock

Started in Los Angelos 

So if I travel to Russia, start an criminal organization of US citizens living in Russia...that is a Russian gang? I seriously hope you are not serious and are just trolling at this point.

posted by jmog

So if I travel to Russia, start an criminal organization of US citizens living in Russia...that is a Russian gang? I seriously hope you are not serious and are just trolling at this point.

the gang exists in America...it is here in America...it has been here in America for decades...a wall will not make a difference in eradicating this gang...i dont know how else to put it... 

Not really outraged, but wtf is up woman teachers getting off on little boys?  There was one floating around yesterday who would text this kid she loved him and stuff (she was also married!). Like why does this seem to happen so often, but you never really hear about men doing it. 

https://nypost.com/2019/02/28/teacher-allegedly-had-sex-with-13-year-old-while-his-friend-watched/

posted by geeblock

you have no way to calculate the citizenship numbers of the MS13 gang. either way closing the border will make zero difference on this gang as it started in the US and has members all over the country who were born here and are citizens of the US.  It is a gang that was started in the US and is an american gang however you want to spin it.

So we might as well just ignore the issue then?  GTFOH with this crap.  

posted by Dr Winston O'Boogie

I went to a great burger joint in Birmingham for lunch today.  I am outraged that if I eat a cheeseburger and onion rings for lunch, I automatically feel like crap all afternoon,  That's just not right.  

Do some research on "toxic food environment"  You will learn why.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/03/01/california-city-removes-statue-of-president-mckinley-in-dead-of-night/

They can just ship the Ohio born presidents statue back home.  Then they can leave the Union as far as I am concerned.

posted by geeblock

the gang exists in America...it is here in America...it has been here in America for decades...a wall will not make a difference in eradicating this gang...i dont know how else to put it... 

Moving goalposts, ignoring questions, seems like the typical M.O.

Oh nice, jmog is being an arrogant fuckface on another thread. Yayyyy

posted by jmog

Moving goalposts, ignoring questions, seems like the typical M.O.

What question did I ignore? I have said the same thing from the beginning. This gang is unique to America.. it started in America and it’s members live in America therefore it is an American gang. I’m not saying it’s members are white amercan males.. they may be Mexican or from El Salvador but they live here.. I don’t know why  u want to argue semantics on every thread and nit pic one part of a sentence instead of look at the point logically.. you are simply arguing for the sake of argument. Everything I have said is really not even debatable. It is an American gang 

posted by Spock

So we might as well just ignore the issue then?  GTFOH with this crap.  

Is that what I said? Or did I say the wall wasn’t the answer 

posted by SportsAndLady

Oh nice, jmog is being an arrogant fuckface on another thread. Yayyyy

Taken that statistics class yet?

posted by jmog

So if I travel to Russia, start an criminal organization of US citizens living in Russia...that is a Russian gang? I seriously hope you are not serious and are just trolling at this point.

The gang is in Russia so therefore it is in fact Russian. It’s members may be American  but the gang would be a problem for Russia to deal with. It would be a Russian gang being that the members live in Russia. Chipotle is an American restaurant that serves Mexican food for example. It’s not restaurant from the country of Mexico 

posted by geeblock

What question did I ignore? I have said the same thing from the beginning. This gang is unique to America.. it started in America and it’s members live in America therefore it is an American gang. I’m not saying it’s members are white amercan males.. they may be Mexican or from El Salvador but they live here.. I don’t know why  u want to argue semantics on every thread and nit pic one part of a sentence instead of look at the point logically.. you are simply arguing for the sake of argument. Everything I have said is really not even debatable. It is an American gang 

We are both arguing semantics I guess. I don't believe that a gang full of citizens from other countries constitutes a gang belonging to the country they are in. I wouldn't consider Al Qaeda an Afghanistan terrorist group just because it was started there by mostly non-Afghans and most of its members were not Afghans. I can see how some would consider them an Afghanistan terrorist group however. 

posted by Spock

So we might as well just ignore the issue then?  GTFOH with this crap.  

posted by jmog

Moving goalposts, ignoring questions, seems like the typical M.O.

Wait....Did I miss something?

Are we talking about gun control here?

posted by Devils Advocate

 

posted by jmog

Moving goalposts, ignoring questions, seems like the typical M.O.

Wait....Did I miss something?

 

Are we talking about gun control here?

 

What's to talk about? It has nothing to do with guns and everything to do with control.