posted by QuakerOats

Too bad they were wrong.  

Thankfully this guy stood up and took it all way.

I think it’s a terrible idea. No need to mix religion and public school. Just because you may be catcholic or whatever doesn’t mean others should be subjected to being alienated or exposed to your religion. Private school, sure have at it . 

posted by kizer permanente

No I'm telling you if you didn't go to optional workouts that werent really optional you weren't going to play lol.. or did you not play football?

For a moment of lulz, this made me think about this video:

Football coaches when you miss an “optional” workout @theAIRapp pic.twitter.com/ayiPeKGpX9

— Brenden Clinton (@MrGo30) June 22, 2022

posted by geeblock

I think it’s a terrible idea. No need to mix religion and public school. Just because you may be catcholic or whatever doesn’t mean others should be subjected to being alienated or exposed to your religion. Private school, sure have at it . 

I think it's a great idea; time to go back to fundamentals and stop chasing religion out of our institutions.  Religion, respect, discipline, values. 

posted by QuakerOats

I think it's a great idea; time to go back to fundamentals and stop chasing religion out of our institutions.  Religion, respect, discipline, values. 

U think that because your expecting the same prayer you hear on Sundays. Doubt you would let your kid be exposed to a different prayer. 

posted by kizer permanente

The tax payers, I’m guessing  

I'm guessing no tax payer has ever beat on their local high school football coach's door to bitch about taxes and spending policy.

posted by geeblock

U think that because your expecting the same prayer you hear on Sundays. Doubt you would let your kid be exposed to a different prayer. 

Not really.  But, with vouchers, you can (and should) send your kids wherever you choose. 

posted by kizer permanente

Family full of coaches in baseball basketball and football. I never wasn’t somewhere, Mr Google . 

Now I see why you reported their posts.

posted by geeblock

I think it’s a terrible idea. No need to mix religion and public school. Just because you may be catcholic or whatever doesn’t mean others should be subjected to being alienated or exposed to your religion. Private school, sure have at it . 

Public school is mixed with a lot of beliefs others are subjected to.

posted by jmog

Just like any other rights, the life has rights until their rights attack someone else’s.

So in the case of severe health/life/death of the mother absolutely abortion should be legal. 

My wife is even more prolife than I am, and tried to make me promise if that type of decision ever came serious with any of our children that I would choose to save our baby and not save her.

I lied to her and said “ok” but I would have never been able to truly choose the baby over her at that point. I know that’s “hypocritical” of a prolifer but that’s reality. 

The problem for most left wingers, like yourself, is that the left used to be “safe legal and rare” for cases like your wife, rape, etc.

Once the left started going to “9 months, after the birth for a few hours, etc” it’s still ok to abort the far right really fought back and this is where we are.

People like your wife may have to travel to another state if she wants an abortion.

When the left started being ok with killing already born infants the far right fought back.

You can blame your own side to be honest.

Plan B should be legal, I would never be ok with it in my own life but I also understand the need.

My wife, again far more prolife than I am, wouldn’t be against plan B being illegal.

Sensible post. However, don't lump me in with crazy liberals on abortion as I am not lumping you in with most conservatives who are pushing a lot of the policies you say you are against. 

I think your history is a little off as the pro life movement started the moment Roe was ruled and took off with the rise of the evangelical movement in the early 80s. 

My own views are a mix of my up bringing in southern Ohio, abortion should be legal, but safe, rare, and legal. There should be an option at the very least.

I largely agree with your thoughts on exceptions. The problem is, you are now outside the norm of the conservative movement in states like Texas, Oklahoma, Missouri, Idaho, and maybe others, Ohio included. 

I think it is also a little naive to think the pro life movement is all high and mighty while the pro choice movement was going too far. We are seeing in states how far they can go, and they are against what you are stating. 

posted by majorspark

I'm guessing no tax payer has ever beat on their local high school football coach's door to bitch about taxes and spending policy.

No but most think he answers to them since they “pay his salary” 

posted by majorspark

Public school is mixed with a lot of beliefs others are subjected to.

Like what? Teaching about different religions or cultures isn’t the same as picking a religion and making it part of a school sponsored function. If a group of kids wants to pray, awesome. It shouldn’t be a team activity at all 

posted by kizer permanente

No but most think he answers to them since they “pay his salary” 

Where I come from they are more concerned about Johny's playing time and winning games.

posted by like_that

I don't agree with any of these things happening, and based on the average view of abortion I think you will be hard pressed to find many people who agree with any of it.   The problem is, these debates should have started 50 years ago vs legislating from the bench.  My guess in 50 years, laws would have been passed/reversed/amended/etc as society learned more about abortions.  This goes along the lines of what information is available and how the average view of abortion has changed with readily availably facts.  Instead, NOW is when the conversation is just beginning and we all are going to have to go through these growing pains that should have started a long time ago. 

Personally speaking, I think 99% of abortions are morally fucked up.  I understand and I am ok with the reasons being brought up in this thread for emotional appeal (rape, incest, dying, etc), however the reality is that those reasons a barely a blip on the radar for abortions and I believe a lot of people use "women's rights" as a shield for debate. 

Politically speaking, despite a few posters all of a sudden pretending to care about individual liberties, if you want to use a libertarian argument, libertarianism is about self autonomy and property rights + the non aggression principle.  If you actually understand this (most here don't), then you can understand why a libertarian (or someone who holds a lot of libertarian views) would extend these rights to a defenseless life in someone's body.  This is especially true for those that believe life begins at conception.  Most of us believe this is true for every other animal on the planet, but apparently can't grasp this for humans.   With that being said, nobody is ever going to be happy with this debate.  This is why I believe (and hope) every state aligns with Europe and allows abortions in the first trimester.   This is in line with what most people in the US are comfortable with and it's the best compromise. 

Edit: I could be wrong, but I think the votes are there to codify abortions up to the first trimester. Dems have failed to do this in the last 50 years.   I think some Rs would vote in favor of it too. 

Good post. I think while we agree a lot of posters won't agree with those items that could be banned, several states are moving in that direction. 

I also understand those thoughts and agree with your thoughts on the EU policy as an option. But, that is not the current policy Republicans are pursuing in more and more states.

Maybe you could have passed a nationwide law 10 or so years ago, but zero chance now. I do think liberals will be doing a lot reflection on how they failed, focusing on the courts instead of statehouses and Congress, because now they are completely unprepared.

On the other hand, the rights pro life movement post Roe is now one of the most successful grassroots movements in American history. 

On the decision today, I have no problem with a coach praying after a game, not forcing it on kids, and not punishing kids that do not participate.

You see coaches and players routinely praying before and after games. I see this as no difference. Osu and pro players do it all the time. 

As someone else said pages ago, it is freedom of religion, not from religion.

posted by geeblock

Like what? Teaching about different religions or cultures isn’t the same as picking a religion and making it part of a school sponsored function. If a group of kids wants to pray, awesome. It shouldn’t be a team activity at all 

Is expressing personal views to students on sexual or culture issues to an age appropriate group any different?  I was never forced to participate in school sponsored sports.  I was required to be in the classroom where teachers at times would promote their personal beliefs.  Age appropriate not a problem. 

Coaches are teachers as well.  I grew up in an Amish/Mennonite white as it gets community.  My basketball coach was a black catholic in an Anabaptist community.  You know the history between those two groups.

Local communities can handle this stuff on their own without intervention from the state.  

posted by majorspark

Is expressing personal views to students on sexual or culture issues to an age appropriate group any different?  I was never forced to participate in school sponsored sports.  I was required to be in the classroom where teachers at times would promote their personal beliefs.  Age appropriate not a problem. 

Coaches are teachers as well.  I grew up in an Amish/Mennonite white as it gets community.  My basketball coach was a black catholic in an Anabaptist community.  You know the history between those two groups.

Local communities can handle this stuff on their own without intervention from the state.  

Yes it’s different and teachers should not do it 

posted by kizer permanente

Uh huh. This SCOTUS is bound an determined to prove to everyone it seems? 

What does the 1A say, freedom of or freedom from?

posted by geeblock

Im sure there would be no uproar if this was a muslim prayer

As long as the kids had a right to leave with no repercussions, wouldn’t care if it was Christian, Jewish, Islamic, Buddhist, etc.

posted by kizer permanente

No I'm telling you if you didn't go to optional workouts that werent really optional you weren't going to play lol.. or did you not play football?

I did play HS football, and no one was forced to off season workouts. If you were strong/athletic enough to be the best at your position they didn’t care if your backup showed up to every off season lifting session..

My school was good though at football, maybe that was your schools problem? The coach was an idiot?

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Sensible post. However, don't lump me in with crazy liberals on abortion as I am not lumping you in with most conservatives who are pushing a lot of the policies you say you are against. 

I think your history is a little off as the pro life movement started the moment Roe was ruled and took off with the rise of the evangelical movement in the early 80s. 

My own views are a mix of my up bringing in southern Ohio, abortion should be legal, but safe, rare, and legal. There should be an option at the very least.

I largely agree with your thoughts on exceptions. The problem is, you are now outside the norm of the conservative movement in states like Texas, Oklahoma, Missouri, Idaho, and maybe others, Ohio included. 

I think it is also a little naive to think the pro life movement is all high and mighty while the pro choice movement was going too far. We are seeing in states how far they can go, and they are against what you are stating. 

I usually am outside the far right, nothing new here.

To believe the left hasn’t gone off rockers about most things lately but especially about abortion is a laughable statement.

They were literally talking about and trying to pass bills that allowed mothers to kill babies up to a MONTH AFTER BIRTH.

Out right banning abortion is mild compared to that.

posted by jmog

I did play HS football, and no one was forced to off season workouts. If you were strong/athletic enough to be the best at your position they didn’t care if your backup showed up to every off season lifting session..

My school was good though at football, maybe that was your schools problem? The coach was an idiot?

Nah a little different.   Refused to curse so it’d sound funny when he got upset . 

posted by jmog

I usually am outside the far right, nothing new here.

To believe the left hasn’t gone off rockers about most things lately but especially about abortion is a laughable statement.

They were literally talking about and trying to pass bills that allowed mothers to kill babies up to a MONTH AFTER BIRTH.

Out right banning abortion is mild compared to that.

Didn't say the left has not gone off their rockers. I belief both sides of the issue are too far to the extremes and outside the mainstream view of Americans. 

One may be worse than the other, but both are outside what most people think should be available. 

Wouldn't be surprised if Republicans overreach in some of these states like Democrats have in others. 

posted by kizer permanente

Refused to curse 

Not so with my coach.