Wayne County area Wrestling 2009-10

• 1_beast

  

  82airborne wrote: Chippewa is in for post season but will have to sit out county. we wrestled the same schedule as last year except for adding the Dies and dropping a tri mach. We have a first year AD that is doing the best job he can with little experience. Yes these things are the responsibillity of the AD and the coach but when the schedule hasn't really changed for a long time you might not think about that. The crazy thing is a team can wrestle in the state duals during the season but since it's put on by the state there is no points! Chippewa will be at county this weekend but not to wrestle just make weight and watch some great wrestling. I wish all the young men the best of luck at county and hope all stay healthy.

  Glad that things got sorted out enough to keep you alive for the tournament run. Its a shame you will miss WCAL's, but i can appreciate you showing up and weighing in.
  
  lol i do find it funny that in your explanation , you try to throw The Bears under the bus!!! The State used to charge for State Duals, however, Teams were declining to accept the 'INVITATION, thats right, its a priviledge and you can only go by invitation, so since Teams were denying the 'invitation' The State offered the State Duals priviledge without charging points....State Duals, Sectional, Districts, State.....
  
  NO SOUP FOR YOU!!!! Next???
• 350zjk

  1_beast wrote:

  82airborne wrote: Chippewa is in for post season but will have to sit out county. we wrestled the same schedule as last year except for adding the Dies and dropping a tri mach. We have a first year AD that is doing the best job he can with little experience. Yes these things are the responsibillity of the AD and the coach but when the schedule hasn't really changed for a long time you might not think about that. The crazy thing is a team can wrestle in the state duals during the season but since it's put on by the state there is no points! Chippewa will be at county this weekend but not to wrestle just make weight and watch some great wrestling. I wish all the young men the best of luck at county and hope all stay healthy.

  Glad that things got sorted out enough to keep you alive for the tournament run. Its a shame you will miss WCAL's, but i can appreciate you showing up and weighing in.
  
  lol i do find it funny that in your explanation , you try to throw The Bears under the bus!!! The State used to charge for State Duals, however, Teams were declining to accept the 'INVITATION, thats right, its a priviledge and you can only go by invitation, so since Teams were denying the 'invitation' The State offered the State Duals priviledge without charging points....State Duals, Sectional, Districts, State.....
  
  NO SOUP FOR YOU!!!! Next???

  Good to hear the Chips won't miss out on State competition! Hey Beast, you really luck out. You get Zar at the League Tourn., Charlie at sectionals, and I'll see you at Maple Hts. with Bardy. Are you staying at The H.I. at Rockside?
• falcon81

  

  Yes its to bad they have to miss the county tournament especially the seniors. Good luck to them at sectionals. I 'am a big fan of what the coaches and fans there are trying to do and it looks like a innocent mistake.
  SECTIONALS are only 10 days away !!!
• WGBplayer

  Good to hear they are in the big tournament.
  
  My only problem with everything is this... if their schedule hasn't changed over the years then this should have been a problem before now. Nothing against Chippewa at all but I am quite curious as to why this is a problem now. I've been told this 4 pt rule has been in place for the last 6-7 years. Wooster had to follow the 4 pt dual/tri rule when they had 6 man teams when Ryan Dye was coaching or they were considered ineligible for state tournaments. That came from OHSAA too. I'm worried (I doubt it will be an issue) that the OHSAA is setting a bad precedent. Can you imagine if Ed's did this? Wadsworth and others would be furious. I'm glad they made the exception but I think the OHSAA is walking a muddy path now.
• 350zjk

  Hey Beast, In case you missed my little reply earlier. I know you'll be happy to see all four of your favorite officials. Zar at league, Charlie at sectionals, and me and Bardy at Maple Hts. The Best of Luck! J.K.
• 1_beast

  

  lol...i saw it Brotha!!! All my favorite refs (rollin eyes) Looks like we're in for a screwin! J.K. or make that J/K lol Glad to see you made it over here finally. Yes as far as I know H.I. rockside has been our Hotel when at Maple Heights
  
  I agree WGBplayer. There should be NO exceptions. But the details have been sketchy. I really would HATE to see the kids miss the post season due to lack of attn to detail by coaches/AD. However, if one is to dig deeper, was their schedule Illegal last year? hmmm Would that take away Halls 4th place finish?? Just something to chew on!
• wrestle2win

  with the chipps out of county will this make the race closer with wayndale northwestern and possible norwayne ... i can see northwestern moveing some wrestlers around such as schaeffer going to 215 to make sure wayndales mullins cant win it and east going from 135 to 140 for a possible championship
• Red Rum

  

  I'm glad to hear the Chipp wrestlers will get the opportunity to wrestle in the post season. Missing the WCAL tourney is really going to be strange. 160 looks wide open and Mullins now becomes a huge favorite at 215. Waynedale may break the scoring record.
  
  Chipp fans should really jump the school board and get the Athletic Director replaced. Screwing up the schedule is a "Major Blunder" and it almost cost some wrestlers their season. You may think I'm being a little harsh, but too often administrative accountability is forgiven and careless job performance goes unpunished. A kid should never have to see all his sacrifice, hard work and state dreams crushed due to some administrators inexperience or ineptitude.
  
  Although I'm happy for the Chipp wrestlers, WGBplayers point is very valid and I agree the OHSAA has muddied what used to be clear water.
• 82airborne

  that was what I was saying by the duals not counting against you. Not anything against Waynedale it just seems the state gets to change the rules to fit its own agenda, the fact that Waynedale was there has nothing to do with it. I wish that OHSAA would revamp the entire points system to something more realistic. In Football you play every week in Basketball several times... If you go to their Duals then what the heck thats a freebie! If you wrestle under points then every match should count; if not fix the system.
• chippewa fan

  Spoke to the coach and he told me he would not wrestle anyone that would go over the state pts. Kids have been held out various meets all season. WE could wrestle 8 at county. Chippewa picked up better tourn. and some things were not taken off schedule. Sectional director notified ad and told him to get on the same page as coach and state rules. He did just that and found we were off on duals. He did so to avoid any future situations. The entire team was held out co. and i think loose 2 pts next year dint talk to much of that. The coaches all work together at chippewa and work only for the good of the team. They are growing and will make mistakes. Not just team but entire administration. When osting took over no one cared what chippewa did so there must be progress.
• Flash

  

  Says in the DR that the Northwestern Sectional tournament director found the error in points. Probably his job.
• 1_beast

  

  Nice article here from The Daily Record. They do nice work.....most of the time.
  http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4766722
• M Plant

  Beast, not because he's my boss, lol, but if you can find a writer who does a better job covering local wrestling than Doc, I'd be shocked.
  Realizing how rabid our area wrestling fans are, you guys are hard to please, which is maybe as it should be, but I see how much time & effort is put into coverage.
  That spread in today's paper didn't just happen.
• swinginahammer

  JUST MY OPINION: The Daily Record does a nice job of covering wrestling and today was the icing on the cake. I bet some of us feel like we have egg on our faces today. For a small paper with limited reporters and that weekend there was alot of wrestling going on and we at Waynedale Duals were the only local team at our duals if you guys look back they didn't even cover Wooster who is where the paper is printed. For myself I already apologized but I feel terrible about what was said about the paper and the reporters I understand its their job to cover sports but you have to admit we get alot of press and yes it is deserved our kids work their tails off to be on top but sometimes you need to let someone else have the spotlight. So with all that being said lets go to county and rip them up.
• 1_beast

  

  M.Plant,
  I do know Doc and crew put in the time. The "...most of the time" was a tongue in cheek comment. I was posting the link because i wanted to share what i thought was an excellent article and layout!!! Once again, you guys have outdone yourselves!!! Doc knows...I always bust his balls, but he should know I always defend him too!!! Thats what friends are for!
  
  Huge weekend of wrestling with the PAC, WCAL, OCC, NBC and SBL. Not that I have a personal interest in th elatter two, but I know there is plenty of folks that do. Quite frankly, its wrestling...so i appreciate it.
  
  Once again Doc, great article(s) and overall sports section today!!! Just wanted to give kudos since i did bust your balls. Back on track!!! See ya Saturday????
  
  
  P.S. An addition to the 1984 167lb class..to go a step further, Zody(Tri) and Zieglar (Nor) were on the podium as well, representing the Wayne County area...for I think, the top 4 spots!!! I may be slightly off...i was once before.
• WGBplayer

  I just read the article about Chippewa's situation on the DR. Does anyone want to share their opinion before I say mine and will probably come off like a major jerk to most on here.... Seriously... I just want to know if I'm the only one who has a take on Osting's comments.
• WGBplayer

  Ok I'll put this out there so everyone can read it.
  
  By AARON DORKSEN
  
  Daily Record Sports Editor
  
  The Chippewa wrestling team has been pinned before the Wayne County Athletic League Meet even gets under way.
  
  Chipps coach Chris Osting said "four or five" of his wrestlers have already met their maximum allotment for tournaments they can compete in and as a result the entire team will sit out this Saturday's WCAL meet at Norwayne (1 p.m. start). With Rittman not having a wrestling team that drops the tourney to just six teams.
  
  "The Northwestern Sectional Tournament director noticed we had too many points on our schedule and brought it to our attention," Osting said. "Our A.D. was made aware of the situation and the state knows. We won't be allowed to wrestle in the WCAL Meet and will have two points taken away from our schedule next year, but we can still wrestle at the sectional. ... That's what's most important to our team."
  
  Teams are only permitted to accumulate 20 schedule points in a season and the Chipps reached their maximum for tournaments, while not wrestling in enough duals or tri-meets. They scheduled only one dual meet this season (against Huron), while adding the Bill Dies Tournament to their schedule.
  
  Osting feels bad about the situation, saying, "I took the heat for it and feel disappointed for the school. ... I've been with this program for 17 years (eight as head coach) and am building the program the best I can. It's all about getting kids as many matches as you can."
  
  Only now Osting will be more careful to balance the points on the schedule correctly between tournaments and dual/tri-matches.
• WGBplayer

  First I want to say that I feel bad for the kids in this situation. I honestly do. Now after reading this I think the OHSAA should have done the "right" thing and took Chippewa out of the "post season". Here is why:
  
  Based off his quotes it sounds darn well that Osting knew what he was doing. He has "four or five" guys at their maximum already?!?! Already?!?! So it seems to me he is well aware of who is at what points which leads me to believe he knew his point total to begin with. I don't want to hear anything about how they wrestled out of state (we all know that still counts). Sure a couple of those guys are young I'm sure and wrestled in some JV things which is a perfectly fine explanation for having some high point totals. But this also tells me he had no intention on sending a full team to WCAL and a chance at the title. That's sad in my opinion.
  
  Another quote I have an issue with is his comment on his tenure. 17 years with 8 as a head coach. This rule has been in place for the last 6 or 7. Maybe more. He should have known better. Plain and simple. 99% of the schedule is the head coaches decision. The points and lay out of points is brought up at each state meeting. It's in the OHSAA Modifications book (Purple this year) they send each official and coach. They have gone over almost every page during all 4 State interpt meetings I've been too. I think this points again to the fact he knew what he was doing the whole time.
  
  My last issue is his last quote. "It's all about getting kids as many matches as you can." Every other school in the area has had no problems with scheduling enough matches. Kurt is 38-2. Beam 43-0 (He missed 5 matches at Elmwood, so state duals or not 43 matches is his total.) I remember my senior year you needed to win every match including states and you'd have 45 I believe. We had a full schedule. This was only 5-6 years ago. How many matches do you really need in a year? When is enough too much??? If Beam would go undefeated here on out (Same points as Chippewa, No state duals remember) He could potentially have 3 at county (most likely 2) 4 at sectionals/districts/states. 58-0! 58 MATCHES! SAME POINTS AS CHIPPEWA! Can anyone realistically fathom that 5/10/15 years ago?!?! I can't believe it now. He's OVER HALF WAY TO THAT GREAT MILESTONE OF 100 IN ONE YEAR!
  
  I'm sorry. Call me a jerk. Call me whatever. It really doesn't bother me but I firmly believe he knew what he was doing. He was getting his kids as many matches as possible the wrong way. He got caught. There are better ways about it. That is why we have dual tourneys (5/10 matches a weekend) Pool Tourneys (5 Matches) Tri's that cost 1 pt. (2 matches). He should have been CAREFUL FROM DAY 1! He jeopardized his kids. Now he has done some damage to his as many matches as possible theory and lost a weekend of competition next year.
  
  I honestly wish no ill will on the kids. I've been in their shoes. I know the work and effort that goes into this sport. The pain,blood,sweat,tears, ect... But the OHSAA messed this up. They should have stuck to the rules and penalized Chippewa what every other team should get. Like I said earlier. ED's/Wadsworth/Graham/Mason/Lexington should all be treated the same. If one of those teams did this there would have been hell to pay and everyone knows it. Chippewa/Waynedale/Wooster/Northwestern should all be treated the same. The OHSAA motto is respect the game. They blew it in my opinion. They set the rules which are supposed to be the law. Then they bent them. That is not respecting the game. That is not the sportsmanship they preach. That leaves it open to every coach to make an error and be ok with it because they got the kids as many matches as possible. Sure they'll lose 2 points next year and/or the conference meet at the end of the year. It's unrealistic and I know it but lets think just for one second. Everyone knows usually when they'll have a "Good year". Well let's say one of those good years is coming up... I know I'm a little more tempted to "get a few extra matches in" if it will benefit my future and the kids knowing that the OHSAA might not have the original consequences it has in place... Just another angle to chew on...
• 1_beast

  

  I read that as he was trying to sneak one by...lol, In good faith...get the kids as many matches...but do it WITHIN the RULES!!!
  You gotta get up pretty early in the morning to get something like that over on WCAL wrestling aficionado's.
• UncleGrizzly

  Let me be the first to say " Nobody gives a crap about your opinion"
• swinginahammer

  UncleGrizzly wrote: Let me be the first to say " Know one gives a crap about your opininion"

  Let me respond by saying:
  1) Go back to school and learn how to spell Noone not Know one and opinion not opininion
  2) If you want to say noone gives a crap about your opinion then please be specific as to whos opinion you don't give a crap about because kind sir there are alot more opinions on here than the one you don't care about.
  
  3) Have a wonderful day and smile
• chippewa fan

  iIt is my understanding a wrestler is not in danger as long as he does not exceed 20 pts. Bigger programs hold wrestlers out from week to week and if co. is a tourn he wishes not to compete so be it. The dual and tri issue is a message to the school. Try to schedule a home match around basketball and basketball practice at chippewa its impossible. Even better when you have a problem with busing due to cutbacks. I bet the school gets on board now. Not one wrestler went over pts. no matter how you get them. The state handled it. You speak of alot of good wrestlers that are 45-0 38-2 what about the truck load thats not gotten 10 wins. How do you keep them coming back the next yr. Osting has fought with adminisrtation for years trust me ive seen it and each year the program gets bigger and better. Next year there will be plenty of tris duals whatever but what if he hits the 20 limit and decides not to go to co next year is that against state rules. unclegrizzly im with you.
• 82airborne

  what is done is done let it go.and by the way Chippewa did NOT go over on points we would have gone over but didn't... so wgb what sanctions should be placed on a team that didn't go over on points. It sounds like you have something personal here... do you have a vented intrest at 160 or 215? why? Are you concerned that Hall or Shaffrath might pee in your wheaties? you are the only one on the soapbox. True there is going to be mixed feeling and opinions on this subject just like the accusations of one young man ducking a girl at last year sectionals or the infamous "bracketgate" the fact you have only been out of high school for such a short time should not be an excuse to act so young. How would you have felt if your post season got destroyed by a mistake a coach or AD made and nothing you did? Thats "messed up". Let the kids do what they have worked so hard for and get over it.
• wcalfan

  82airborne wrote: what is done is done let it go.and by the way Chippewa did NOT go over on points we would have gone over but didn't... so wgb what sanctions should be placed on a team that didn't go over on points. It sounds like you have something personal here... do you have a vented intrest at 160 or 215? why? Are you concerned that Hall or Shaffrath might pee in your wheaties? you are the only one on the soapbox. True there is going to be mixed feeling and opinions on this subject just like the accusations of one young man ducking a girl at last year sectionals or the infamous "bracketgate" the fact you have only been out of high school for such a short time should not be an excuse to act so young. How would you have felt if your post season got destroyed by a mistake a coach or AD made and nothing you did? Thats "messed up". Let the kids do what they have worked so hard for and get over it.

  Airborne, I think you should read over the rules carefully. Yes you DID go over your points according to the rule. Teams are only allowed 16 points from tournaments and ALL of your 20 points this year are from tournaments. It could have possibly been 24 points with the Gribbles and WCAL. You can have 20 points as long as 4 of those points are from duals or tri's. You have no duals or tri's on your schedule. It specifically says that dual tourneys cannot count towards a dual or tri. I believe this is why WGB says there should be sanctions.
• WGBplayer

  82airborne wrote: what is done is done let it go.and by the way Chippewa did NOT go over on points we would have gone over but didn't... so wgb what sanctions should be placed on a team that didn't go over on points. It sounds like you have something personal here... do you have a vented intrest at 160 or 215? why? Are you concerned that Hall or Shaffrath might pee in your wheaties? you are the only one on the soapbox. True there is going to be mixed feeling and opinions on this subject just like the accusations of one young man ducking a girl at last year sectionals or the infamous "bracketgate" the fact you have only been out of high school for such a short time should not be an excuse to act so young. How would you have felt if your post season got destroyed by a mistake a coach or AD made and nothing you did? Thats "messed up". Let the kids do what they have worked so hard for and get over it.

  First off I have no VESTED interest in 160 or 215. I've officiated matches involving all the Hall's and have done matches for Justin also. All good quality men and ladies. Talked to Mr. Hall a few times as well. I'm glad the girls have had some success in the sport along with Bryson and they are all fine people.
  
  Second I hate wheaties.
  
  Thirdly I'm not sure how I "acted so young"? because I have a strong opinion on a subject? I disagreed from the beginning how the state handled the situation when it first became apparent. I was ok with letting the kids wrestle if it was an honest mistake. After reading through all the facts and using direct quotes from Mr. Osting. It is apparent that it wasn't an honest mistake. He's going to butter it however he wants and he can. He's trying to now protect his kids that he endangered. I'm understand completely but now we have an exception to the rules OHSAA has set forth. The ones that I use every weekend. I don't like that. Makes the job and rules open for interpretation. We all know how crazy things get when you have to interpret things. (Stalling calls) Do I agree with all the rules. No. BUT I FOLLOW THEM TO THE T! Do I make mistakes? Absolutely. Never once have I not admitted a mistake or have blatantly bent a rule to favor one kid over another.
  
  The fact of the matter is this. For this very occasion (Schedule Errors) there is the rule set in place that anyone who does not fill all the requirements (duals/Tri and going over on pts) the sanction is loss of post season eligibility. Mr. Osting broke this rule. Also if we'd go back a year or two or maybe even more from the sounds of it, they would have been in the wrong also. I can't say that for sure and am not going to even bother going any further with that.
  
  What kind of message is this sending? One of my coaches who I respect dearly and would do anything for always told us this one thing after every single practice and game no matter the outcome. "Do the right thing." There was a golfer who won the OHSAA championship 5 or 6 years ago. Won it by 7 strokes. But before he handed in his card he had a scoring error. Instead of fixing it even though he already signed his card. (As soon as you sign... It's official even if not handed in yet.) He told the OHSAA he made the mistake. They DQ'ed him. He and OHSAA did the right thing even though it wasn't the popular thing. Mr. Osting did not. Plain and simple. OHSAA is now muddying the waters even more.
  
  Lastly I'm also going to say this. I know this will fire some of you up even more but we all know this is true and I think it helps cement my points. What if it were Waynedale in this same very situation? Mr. Stanley goes to the paper and says the exact same thing as Mr. Osting? What would the reaction be then? Is Waynedale held to a different standard then Chippewa? If so, Why? I feel there would be many more out there that would feel like I do. Sorry for the kids but have issue with the ruling after the way the coach came off. (I hear almost every weekend how much people don't like the way Louie Stanley comes off and this coach and that coach.) Airborne, you've already expressed your displeasure with Waynedale wrestling in the state duals and having what I interpreted as an unfair advantage (more matches with no points added). With the current points system... YOU CAN WRESTLE EVERY WEEKEND! It is all in how the coach sets his schedule up. I think it's a very bad precedent being set forth that could potentially have major issues and complications arising now. Hopefully/Doubtfully not. But the potential is now there and I have issue with that.
  
  Good Luck Chippewa at Sectionals and beyond.