Well, to be somewhat fair to Kamala, this rejection has been building up for years. I really don't think it was any one thing that flipped a switch for most people, but rather an ongoing accumulation of fuckery. I just think that people were fed up and repulsed by a lot of things until they used Trump as a blunt force weapon to fight back. Again.

I'm telling ya, the Dems better get off their high horse or the lessons will keep coming hard for years to come. JD Vance is starting to grow on people and if he plays his part well, people will vote for him over the likes of Gavin Newsome. 

That's another thing - Dems would do well to avoid California Democrats for a while. People don't like that shit.

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Yeah, I thought she was going to do better and start to take the momentum from the DNC and drive home the whole change and improving the economy over the last 4 years. 

But, nope, they kept hammering Orange Man bad and never Trumpers. Both groups that were already going to vote for her. 

I knew she was going to lose a few weeks before when I kept hearing from swing voters talking about the economy and she kept talking about how bad Trump is.

When she ran for POTUS she had to drop out before the first primary because she was polling AMONG DEMOCRATS at like 0.5% (going off memory here).

Biden, once he won the nomination, explicitly said he was going to pick a woman POC as his running mate. Well, of all that had run, she was the only one (Tulsi is pacific islander, but many Ds didn't think she wasn't 'black enough').

So she gets called a DEI hire, but realistically even if he wanted a woman, Warren, Gabbard, Klobuchar, etc were all doing far better than Harris. He directly said he was going to, and picked her because of her skin color. 

It's not like he needed California to turn blue due to his VP pick...

So yes, everyone knew she sucked as a candidate except those on the far left who would vote for a serial child rapist as long as they weren't Trump and had a "D" next to their name.

She REALLY lost the middle of the road people when she was asked "what would she do different than Biden" and she said "nothing".

posted by CenterBHSFan

Well, to be somewhat fair to Kamala, this rejection has been building up for years. I really don't think it was any one thing that flipped a switch for most people, but rather an ongoing accumulation of fuckery. I just think that people were fed up and repulsed by a lot of things until they used Trump as a blunt force weapon to fight back. Again.

I'm telling ya, the Dems better get off their high horse or the lessons will keep coming hard for years to come. JD Vance is starting to grow on people and if he plays his part well, people will vote for him over the likes of Gavin Newsome. 

That's another thing - Dems would do well to avoid California Democrats for a while. People don't like that shit.

Agreed, JDV will win in 4 years, especially if Ds keep going after the trope "everyone who doesn't agree with us is a racist/nazi/homophobe".

Picking Newsome or the like from CA is a terrible idea. The rest of the country is sick of the far left "woke" democrats so picking anyone from the west coast, even if they aren't really that far left, is a bad idea.

posted by BR1986FB

This could be interesting...

https://www.westernjournal.com/trump-effect-senior-hamas-official-wants-immediate-end-war-finding-47th-us-president-will/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=conservativetribune&utm_campaign=dlvrit&utm_content=square

1. This is a non-starter, as Hamas said "with Jerusalem as our capital". Never going to happen, they know that but sure.

2. I wonder where the left is going to go from here, they laughed at Trump when he said he would end the war "within 24 hrs". 

3. Hamas could be trying to negotiate now, knowing they will be negotiating with Israel backed by Biden for a few more months rather than Israel backed by Trump.

posted by jmog

Agreed, JDV will win in 4 years, especially if Ds keep going after the trope "everyone who doesn't agree with us is a racist/nazi/homophobe".

Picking Newsome or the like from CA is a terrible idea. The rest of the country is sick of the far left "woke" democrats so picking anyone from the west coast, even if they aren't really that far left, is a bad idea.

Or the extremely radical group of Libs. I think the Dems would have better success shifting back to their old formula of being for the working class and not trying to push electric vehicles and immigrant migrations on the country.

posted by iclfan2

Just saw where DC voted for Kamala 256k to 19k… never becoming a state. 

So so far removed from the American electorate it is actually threatening. 

posted by kizer permanente

I mean.. I don't think he's entirely right. The Republicans (even/especially Trump) are far from pro union/working class supporters. Dems haven't left that. They have let a more vocal minority hijack the message which is obviously their fault. So I think they've left a lot of that base feel disenfranchised and you obviously see that in midwest voting.  Now why that base has clung to Trump makes no sense to me. Other than the disenfranchised sympathizes with him. Trump is anti-union. He says that out loud. His policy is very much more geared to trickle down. It just further proves policy doesn't matter to most people.. they just hear that as an excuse and use it. 

Maybe you forgot what really happened.  Trump directly supported ALL members of the working class with a series of real ACTIONS:  tearing up terrible trade deals, cutting taxes and regulations, unleashing U.S. energy ---------- all of which directly and positively impacted the economic conditions of ALL working class members (with rising REAL wages), especially in manufacturing as reshoring began, as a direct result of his ACTIONS.

Take care.

I think there will only be two kinds of Democrats that voters will go for, that has a pretty good chance of beating Republicans in four years.

1.) A Bernie style Democrat with a very strong populist message. Let's face it, he would have won the Dem nomination if the DNC wasn't so corrupt. He would have been the left's version of people using a blunt force object to fight back. Also keep in mind that there is what they call the Bernie to Trump pipeline. Trump owes a good amount of his votes (in all 3 elections) to the Bernie Bros. People are are moving away from Establishmentism and towards populism.

3.) Josh Shapiro/type. He has a wide range of appeal that even some Republicans like. Right now the Dems think he is too Jew, but if we can get things straightened around in the ME, his being a Jew won't matter to them as much. Heck, I even like him and y'all know how I feel about Dems in general. 

So yeah, if the Dems want to win in 2028, they best be taking their hard lessons right now and reorganize their priorities. Will they do it?

Also, I just got to get this off my chest (lol)

Back in the day, Bill Clinton relied heavily on MTV and celebrity power and it worked, helped get him elected. It helped Barack Obama get elected, too. But those were different times. 

In today's climate, especially after Covid, having a whole bunch of rich people endorse you doesn't appeal to people who are maxing out their credit cards to feed their kids. 

posted by QuakerOats

So so far removed from the American electorate it is actually threatening. 

What's interesting is that when you really dig into the numbers, despite Trump boat racing her in the EC and popular vote, this election was closer than a lot might think. The difference in votes for Trump between PA, MI & WI was a bit over 200k. Those 200k swing her way and we're dealing with the Cackler running this country.

I also posted something about the Amish with Trump flags waiving from their buggies. Not sure how much it moved the needle but it sounds like there was a full on push by the Trump campaign to get Amish registered to vote and to the polls in PA.

I have been thinking the last day or so, and I do not think it would've mattered. But had Harris' bi-partisan border bill not stalled in congress and gone into effect, does she win? I say that not knowing if the border would've been secured enough to end the talk or not -- but it for sure would've been much better than what we have now. Would that have been enough? And if you think the answer is yes, or even a maybe, why on earth did the party not hammer that the republican's have been blocking the bill for years?

posted by Laley23

I have been thinking the last day or so, and I do not think it would've mattered. But had Harris' bi-partisan border bill not stalled in congress and gone into effect, does she win? I say that not knowing if the border would've been secured enough to end the talk or not -- but it for sure would've been much better than what we have now. Would that have been enough? And if you think the answer is yes, or even a maybe, why on earth did the party not hammer that the republican's have been blocking the bill for years?

Was not Harris or Biden, was a Senate led bipartisan bill. Maybe it would have helped, but I doubt it.

The economy was the number 1 issue. The only way I think Harris could have won if she would have based her entire platform on improving the economy and moving toward a post pandemic economy. 

I thought Trump's last few messages in the end were fantastic. One was, Trump: he can fix it. 

The second was, Harris: Higher Prices. Trump: lower prices 

posted by Laley23

I have been thinking the last day or so, and I do not think it would've mattered. But had Harris' bi-partisan border bill not stalled in congress and gone into effect, does she win? I say that not knowing if the border would've been secured enough to end the talk or not -- but it for sure would've been much better than what we have now. Would that have been enough? And if you think the answer is yes, or even a maybe, why on earth did the party not hammer that the republican's have been blocking the bill for years?

It was a bi-partisan bill that got bi-partisan rejection. I'm not sure what the wording or contents of the bill that was so bad that even some Democrats rejected it, but it was bad enough for them to do so. To answer your question, no, I don't think it would have made a difference. The border had already been massively flooded by the time that bill was put up (the first bill put up wasn't even picked up it was so bad). 

I think the real underlying issue was that Biden and Harris made a big production out of undoing all of Trump's border EO's that they put the cart before the horse. 

What they should have done was had a decent, stand alone border bill drafted and voted on before undoing Trump's border policies. But the compulsion to show their asses was greater than the necessity of forethought and we know what that caused.

Oh yeah, striping the EOs was really dumb. Its like people that want Obamacare gone before a replacement is ready. Cant strip it and make something worse until you have a viable solution for replacement. Just incompetence.

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Was not Harris or Biden, was a Senate led bipartisan bill. Maybe it would have helped, but I doubt it.

The economy was the number 1 issue. The only way I think Harris could have won if she would have based her entire platform on improving the economy and moving toward a post pandemic economy. 

I thought Trump's last few messages in the end were fantastic. One was, Trump: he can fix it. 

The second was, Harris: Higher Prices. Trump: lower prices 

It was a senate bill, but I thought Harris was the one who was driving it? Maybe that is incorrect. 

And yes, the ridiculous messaging (lack off) destroyed Harris. If nothing else, Trump knows how to make people believe/agree/whatever word what he says and that he is the only person to be able to fix (insert issue). I personally think his plan -- at least the tariff portion -- is horseshit. It will directly impact me and my company if it goes thru, so that sucks. But I also have faith that like his first term, he will only go thru with a portion of his statements (selective tariffing, only deporting portions of the illegals and not all of them, etc). But with full control, who knows?

posted by CenterBHSFan

Bernie calling out the Dems

https://x.com/BernieSanders/status/1854271157135941698

Bernie is a pussy. He bent over two primaries in a row for the Dems, and now he wants to act like a tough guy.  He political movement has always been trash.

LOL at the blame game. Dem's going hard after George Clooney for pushing Biden to drop out.

posted by Laley23

Oh yeah, striping the EOs was really dumb. Its like people that want Obamacare gone before a replacement is ready. Cant strip it and make something worse until you have a viable solution for replacement. Just incompetence.

Purely vengeful incompetence. 

posted by like_that

Bernie is a pussy. He bent over two primaries in a row for the Dems, and now he wants to act like a tough guy.  He political movement has always been trash.

Anyone can be bought off. 

posted by BR1986FB

LOL at the blame game. Dem's going hard after George Clooney for pushing Biden to drop out.

Must be a really unfocused blame game, because I've seen them also blame Biden for taking too long to drop out and for choosing to run again in the first place.

posted by like_that

Bernie is a pussy. He bent over two primaries in a row for the Dems, and now he wants to act like a tough guy.  He political movement has always been trash.

I can't disagree with you at all. The Bernie to Trump pipeline is real partially because of Bernie's own actions. Mostly because of populism, but he owns part of the blame for sure.

posted by QuakerOats

Anyone can be bought off. 

I don't think he was bought. I think the idea was that his wife could get into a looooooot of trouble if he didn't play ball.

posted by Heretic

Must be a really unfocused blame game, because I've seen them also blame Biden for taking too long to drop out and for choosing to run again in the first place.

Everybody is getting blamed. 

White women, Latinos, black men, Clooney, Biden, racists/misogynists, and so on. 

We are watching the back-biting phase.

posted by Heretic

Must be a really unfocused blame game, because I've seen them also blame Biden for taking too long to drop out and for choosing to run again in the first place.

Funny then that they spent over a year lying about his competency. They had plenty of time to leak his vegetable status if they wanted to.

Is this necessary?

Why can't we tell these people to fix their face and get on with their day?