Should the Cavs make a trade?

• jpake1

  

  Some people are content. After all, a few people thought Cleveland was the best team last year, and that they just blew it.
• devil1197

  btw, I don't want Iggy either.
• bases_loaded

  

  IF the league drops the hammer on West you lose one of your best(when his head is fucking in the game) defending guards. Iggy gives you that and I think any trade for him is an indication that Ferry thinks West's situation is a threat to the team winning a championship.
• BTBalla

  But can Iggy be content being a 3rd option or maybe 4th? He has been the man in Philly for a few years now can he make that transition. I dont want Iggy, i dont think he's a good fit.
  Jamison would be a nice pick up but he plays the same positionas LeBron and we already have a log jam inside with Shaq, Z, Anderson, and Hickson , plus Powe coming back. I like the idea of trading for Amare you start him and Anderson and then sub in Shaq and Powe.
• devil1197

  Jamison is a PF and LeBron is a SF.
  
  The lineup would be:
  C Shaq
  PF Jamison
  SF James
  SG Parker
  PG Williams
  
  Anderson will not start for Cleveland again unless there are injuries. They know he provides a spark off the bench and he plays his best there. Also, Z would still get bought out if they traded him to the Suns. But the Suns want immediate talent in return not just cap relief. Cleveland would need to get a 3rd team involved.
  
  Amar'e to Cleveland is a huge long shot. We just don't have the pieces for a player like him straight up.
  
  The only player I want to the Cavs to trade for is Jamison. He is a veteran player with a great attitude towards the game. He will have little to no problem adjusting with the team as compared to other young stars who want "theirs" (Amar'e, Iggy etc.). Jamison wants a title and that's it. Plus, when the deadline approaches Cleveland will be a team that could press Washington into an uneven trade.
• devil1197

  And don't get me wrong, this Cleveland team is probably better than last years when fully healthy.
  
  BUT, like Coach Brown has said. This team is very good but if there is a certain player on the table "We'll have to do it".
• Baseball

  Why not offer the suns Z, Hickson, Boobie and a first round pick, i think if you throw Boobie in the deal you may be able to pry Amare loose
• devil1197

  Baseball wrote: Why not offer the suns Z, Hickson, Boobie and a first round pick, i think if you throw Boobie in the deal you may be able to pry Amare loose

  That's not enough for Amar'e.
  
  I know his troubles have probably knocked his value down, but the Suns wanted West last year. And West >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Gibson. Throwing in Gibson wouldn't push the Cavs over the top.
  
  Z would provide cap relief which is good. Hickson would be the main piece in the trade. The Suns like him but if Amar'e is truly available their will be a much better main piece out there.
  
  Gibson's contract is not great. He is a good trading piece until you see his contract that goes through 2012/2014 ending at 4.8 mil.
  
  And the Cavs 1st rounder will be one of the last in the draft. I know you can find some players that low but its not the greatest pick in the world for Amar'e.
• sportswizuhrd

  If any Jamison deal is made, I would love to get Earl Boykins too. If the Cavs make it to the Finals, they will most likely play the Lakers. Quick guards give them fits. I know they beat the Lakers twice without a guard with the speed of Boykins, but I think he would help out come playoff time.
• devil1197

  sportswizuhrd wrote: If any Jamison deal is made, I would love to get Earl Boykins too. If the Cavs make it to the Finals, they will most likely play the Lakers. Quick guards give them fits. I know they beat the Lakers twice without a guard with the speed of Boykins, but I think he would help out come playoff time.

  Williams abused the Lakers guards in the Dec. 25th matchup as he went for 28-7-6.
  
  Boykins wouldn't see any playing time unless Williams or West were in foul trouble.
• I drain 3's

  sportswizuhrd wrote: If any Jamison deal is made, I would love to get Earl Boykins too. If the Cavs make it to the Finals, they will most likely play the Lakers. Quick guards give them fits. I know they beat the Lakers twice without a guard with the speed of Boykins, but I think he would help out come playoff time.

  If the Lakers were smart, Fish/Brown/Farmar would abuse Boykins down low.
• KR1245

  

  Looks like the Rockets and Wizards are talking about a Mcgrady for Butler swap. If this goes down then I dont see the Wizards holding onto Jamison. JJ, Z and a draft pick or cash towards Z's buyout gets the deal done imo. JJ has shown some promise over the last week but I would feel much more comfortable going into the playoffs with Jamison starting at PF then JJ.
• devil1197

  KR1245 wrote: Looks like the Rockets and Wizards are talking about a Mcgrady for Butler swap. If this goes down then I dont see the Wizards holding onto Jamison. JJ, Z and a draft pick or cash towards Z's buyout gets the deal done imo. JJ has shown some promise over the last week but I would feel much more comfortable going into the playoffs with Jamison starting at PF then JJ.

  KR, that definitely gets the deal done for the Wizards but not for Cleveland. Do you honestly think Ferry is going to give in to the Wizards demands (that is supposedly what the Wizards are asking the Cavs for Jamison).
  
  IMO, Cleveland should be able to wait it out and knock JJ off the deal giving the Wizards cap relief and a "1st" round pick to make their fans feel better.
• KR1245

  

  I agree with that but I worry about another team swooping in and making an offer. It doesnt sound like there are many teams that are willing to take on Jamisons contract but that could all change and I wouldnt want the Cavs to miss out.
• september63

  

  Hb31187 wrote: lol why is JJ untouchable? He does little to nothing when he plays and could be good trade bait

  Yea. OK. Seems you were a bit off on that opinion.
• jordo212000

  

  september63 wrote: Yea. OK. Seems you were a bit off on that opinion.

  I'm still with him (HB11...). JJ has been solid, but if you can get a piece that makes you better NOW, you take it. There is no given that Lebron will be back next year, thus you push your chips to the middle
• september63

  

  You cant mortgage the future for just this year!! The Cavs will OFFER LBJ the max contract and it will be up to him to accept. If he doesnt, he doesnt. But you cant be left with nothing if he does choose to leave.
• Pick6

  

  I dont think they should make a trade. You guys are trying to fix something that isnt broke. They added Shaq in the offseason, which was a key piece they needed mainly for Orlando.
  
  This team is deep. They are on their 3rd string PG, and have won what, 5 straight? with him. This is also the guy you all say doesnt fit what the team wants to do. The team wants to win and they are winning. Also with the best record in the NBA.
  
  Go Cavs
• hoops23

  

  I'll just copy and paste what I posted on the game thread:
  
  Agreed.
  
  JJ is really starting to blossom too.
  
  According to BW (listened to the halftime show on the radio) he doesn't think the Cavs will make a trade unless it's a homerun deal and suggested Ferry's previous moves prove this.
  
  He doesn't think the Cavs will put themselves in a position where the other team is taking away good pieces from Cleveland.
  
  Thus, Z may not even be traded because you can't exactly trust a "buyout" agreement.. He also doesn't think JJ will be traded because the Cavs really love what he's doing and only feel he will get better each week.
  
  Some trades he mentioned about the Cavs stealing players were:
  
  Mo Williams. We traded Damon Jones and Joe Smith out for him.
  
  Flip Murray. We traded Mike Wilkes (lol)
  
  Shaq. Ben Wallace and Sasha
  
  And of course the trade that brought in Ben Wallace, Wally, Delonte West, and Joe Smith in the first place. We sent out Larry Hughes and Drew Gooden, among some others.
  
  In other words, if we make a trade, it won't be JJ and Z plus picks for somebody, unless it's a can't miss player, he quoted.
• devil1197

  Exactly, any trade will be Z/1st with the Cavaliers being almost positive that Z will get bought out. I wouldn't be mad if JJ got traded but it would have to bring in multiple players.
• Pick6

  

  Of all of the talk, however, if a trade did happen, I wouldnt want anybody other than Jamison. He is on the back-end of his career but has the capability of putting up some pretty big numbers.
• devil1197

  Pick6 wrote: Of all of the talk, however, if a trade did happen, I wouldnt want anybody other than Jamison. He is on the back-end of his career but has the capability of putting up some pretty big numbers.

  And the closer it gets to the deadline the more that Ferry can pressure the Wizards. The only question or concern would be the buyout of Z but Ferry wouldn't do it without a great feeling of Z returning.
• hoops23

  

  Z and a 1st for Jamison I'd do in a heart beat.
  
  I'd hope that Washington wouldn't screw not only the Cavs, but Z who has long paid his dues in the NBA because we've kicked their ass every year...
• hoops23

  

  This just in: I don't want to trade J.J. Hickson.
  
  Not for Andre Iguodala . . . not for Amar'e Stoudemire . . . definitely not for Troy Murphy . . . and you know, not even for Antawn Jamison. (Although the Jamison part is a fairly new development.)
  Let's be real here, there's a snowball's chance that any of those players will be available to Danny Ferry for nothing. Regardless of whatever rumors you hear. They just won't be. It makes no sense.
  
  [We explored this fact before, here.]
  
  Teams are not going to give us their star - one of their big box-office draws (with the highly questionable inclusion of Murphy) - just for cap relief this summer . . . and they're not going to then turn around and do us another favor and buy-out Zydrunas Ilgauskas, just because we need him to come back. For nothing.
  
  They all want a young player in return for helping us out like that, and Darnell Jackson isn't going to do the trick.
  
  They want J.J. Hickson, who's by far the most exciting young, potential-bleeding player on Cleveland's roster. He's someone who probably isn't that far away from becoming the next big frontcourt star.
  
  I know. You can easily argue that all four of those players (with the highly questionable inclusion of Murphy) are better than J.J. Hickson. Sure they are. Right now.
  
  You can easily argue that a championship this year is the thing that will make the biggest statement to LeBron James heading into the hyped Summer of 2010. Yup. Right now.
  
  You can easily argue that one of those "superstar" players (without the inclusion of Murphy) will make all the NBA pundits finally cave in and name the Cleveland Cavaliers their favorite to win the Title. They'll be tripping over themselves. Right now.
  
  And you can easily argue that even if there was a way we could keep him, Stoudemire and Jamison would be significant improvements over J.J. in the frontcourt . . . and would render him unnecessary. Right now. That's right now.
  
  So, there are four arguments /rationalizations / justifications / excuses that you could make for trading J.J. Hickson before the deadline, as a way of bringing in a star for Z's expiring contract . . . and with a wink and a nod, having him be bought out so that he could return to the Cavs.
  
  And there are surely more.
  
  But take a second and think about this: Why would we?
  
  I don't care how familiar those names are to you. Amar'e Stoudemire! Andre Iguodala! Antawn Jamison! Troy . . . well, at least there's those first three.
  
  Just because those players are stars on their current teams . . . which by the way . . . aren't quite playing at the level the Cavaliers are right now, that doesn't mean we need to import them just for the hell of it.
  
  Obviously, if you can get one of these players for nothing . . . by all means! None of them are a real threat to not fit to the point where the Cavs all start recalling their favorite Larry Hughes memories.
  But that's highly unlikely. For example, let's take Jamison, my personal choice of the 3 1/2 rumored names listed above. (Sorry Troy.)
  
  Would I trade for Jamison for nothing? Yes. Would I trade for Jamison for Z and the Wizards' choice of trade picks, with a comfortable feeling that Z could return? Yes. Would I trade Z blindly for Jamison? Ooooh. I don't know. Would I trade for Jamison for Z and Hickson? No.
  
  The Wizards, in my opinion, are the team most likely to trade their star for nothing. That being said, here are the percentages, in my opinion, that each of these deals is on the table.
  Jamison for nothing (Z with an understood buyout): 0.1%
  Jamison for Z (with an understood buyout), draft picks and/or non-rotation* players: 0.9%
  Jamison for Z (with no understood buyout), draft picks and/or non-rotation* players: 5%
  Jamison for Z (with a maybe** buyout) and J.J. Hickson: 94%
  * = Danny Green, Jawad Williams, and Darnell Jackson (probably in that order)
  ** = No understood buyout. These are the Washington Wizards. They hate us. They may end up buying him out, especially if the Cavs include cash in the deal to do so . . . but they're not going to give us any guarantees ahead of time. (If you think it's just business, and the Wizards organization wouldn't enjoy the opportunity to screw the Cavs, then DeShawn Stevenson has some hype he'd like to sell you.)
  
  There's the saying "you don't get anything for free." Well, sometimes you do . . . in fact, I just got a free drink at my regular coffee joint earlier this week . . . but it's going to come out of nowhere. You certainly can't expect it to happen.
  
  OK, so we're at a familiar base: If the Cavs are making a trade . . . they're trading J.J. Hickson.
  Why shouldn't they pull the trigger?
  
  As an entry point, I'm going to require that you've watched at least two-thirds of the games this season. Because if you've seen him play enough, you have to at least be marginally wary of trading him. The kid is going to be good . . . and there's a chance he could be a star . . . and he isn't that far away.
  
  Even when J.J. has been off his game, he's shown some sweet, creative post moves . . . he's shown that he's a tough player, who's willing to put a body on any player in the post . . . and he's shown that he's a high-energy player, with some major hops, who can be a handful at both ends of the floor.
  And when he's on his game, he looks just as good, if not better, than the players we're apparently considering trading him for. He's definitely not consistent enough, even play-to-play, to be anywhere near as good as they are now overall . . . but those holes in his game are soon going to be turning into seams, and those seams are going to be closing up. For real, watch him play.
  
  He had a strong start when he was moved into the starting lineup in November. December was up and down for him, but he's really come on in 2010. In his last 10 games, he's averaging 9.1 points (on 54.5% shooting) with 6.7 rebounds (1.4 offensive / 5.3 defensive) and he' shooting 79.2% from the line.
  
  In the home game against the Lakers, he had 11 points and 14 rebounds. Against Minnesota last week, he had 23 points and eight rebounds. In Tuesday's game against Memphis, he had 15 points, eight rebounds and two steals. Last night against Miami, he had 12 points, five rebounds and two blocks.
  
  Two of those points came in a serious fast break dunk on Dwyane Wade. Later in the game, Wade tried to return the favor, and J.J. rejected him, hard, for his second block. These are big plays, people.
  
  He's had eight games scoring 15+. The Cavs are 8-0 in those games. He's had 13 games with 10+ points. The Cavs are 13-0 in those. His shooting percentage, 54.3%, is second on the team (to Shaq).
  
  All that being said, I do realize some people are going to disagree with me on this . . . and I'll admit, assuming we have Z back, Jamison and Stoudemire would both make our team better this year than we'd be with J.J. Troy Murphy, again, I'm sorry.
  
  The issue is the future.
  
  Jamison will be 34 this year, and has two years left on his deal. Stoudemire would have to agree to a new contract with the Cavs. We don't want to trade J.J. for a few-month rental that we may not even need. Even if he does, he doesn't exactly seem like someone who'd be a guaranteed fit with the fun, laid-back, team before individual atmosphere that LeBron enjoys here in Cleveland.
  
  And naturally, with Stoudemire, any long term contract would be a risk considering his two serious eye injuries . . . retina and iris . . . and two serious knee injuries. He had arthroscopic surgery on his right knee, and the dreaded microfracture surgery on his left knee.
  
  (I can't see Ferry going more than two years guaranteed. Think Andre's ego would want to leave his $17.7 million player option in Phoenix for that? Someone would be willing to offer him more.)
  
  Iguodala, of the three, could be the best option for a running mate for LeBron for years to come. But you don't trade a big man to get him. That would leave us extremely thin, offensively, at the forward spot for this year (and that's even if Leon Powe can come back at 110% health).
  
  And for the years ahead, the Cavs would have to stick with Shaq and Z . . . because with Iguodala's contract (and a reasonable amounts to resign Shaw and Z) . . . the Cavs aren't going to have any way of bringing in another player who makes more than the Mid-Level Exception for years to come.
  (Thank you for not mentioning the Samuel Dalembert "option.")
  
  So look at this way: The Cavs are 40-11 . . . on the same pace as they were last season. Our team is much better on and off paper this year. It's deep, it's flexible, and its absolutely stacked with talent.
  
  The Cavs have a 10-game winning streak, and have won eight of those without Mo Williams (and seven without Mo and Delonte, and one of those without Mo, Delonte and a right Boobie.)
  
  We don't need to make a trade. We'll feverishly explore all our options, we'll check and recheck the availability of every player in the league, and we'll absolutely move to bring in an upgrade in talent . . . if, by chance, there ends up being some available for nothing or next to nothing.
  
  But we're shouldn't force it . . . and we definitely shouldn't trade J.J. for anything short of someone else's young burgeoning big man. And honestly, I can't think of one that could be available that I'd want to make that switch for.
  
  As it stands, we have the best team in the NBA . . . we have two starters coming off the injured list soon . . . we have another intriguing piece in Powe that'll be joining the team after the All-Star break . . . and we have J.J. Hickson to look forward to watching blossom as a Cavalier for years to come, alongside LeBron James.
  
  Did you see them running the break together in the second quarter against Miami? LeBron at 6'8" lifting that perfect alley-oop up to a speeding Hickson at 6'9", who finished with a seismic throw-down.
  
  I know, If the Cavs don't make significant trade, they can't guarantee that they'll make the Finals . . . let alone win it all. But then again, a trade (for anyone) won't guarantee that either. If LeBron is looking for a "future" to sign with this offseason . . . Cleveland has one. Right now.

• Footwedge

  ^^Could you please repeat that?