2012 Cleveland Browns thread: AKA Pat Shurmur Memorial thread
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SportsAndLady
This is a hypothetical situation..so in this hypothetical situation, you were wrong and McCoy actually does have a good arm this year and leads them to 11-5, you seriously wouldn't watch just because you didn't like McCoy in '10-'11?BR1986FB;1038365 wrote:Exactly. Like I said, I have nothing to worry about. 'Checkdown Charlie' won't get this team near the playoffs. -
se-alum
I believe you build your team, then go out and get your QB, unless you have the opportunity to draft an Andrew Luck. I wouldn't take RGIII. I would fill out the rest of the team, and if McCoy is as bad as most of you seem to think he is, the Browns will have an early pick next year to get a QB or they can go after a veteran QB in free agency. -
BR1986FB
So McCoy suddenly grows an arm? Like you said (VERY) hypothetical.SportsAndLady;1038374 wrote:This is a hypothetical situation..so in this hypothetical situation, you were wrong and McCoy actually does have a good arm this year and leads them to 11-5, you seriously wouldn't watch just because you didn't like McCoy in '10-'11? -
se-alum
Honestly don't think that's McCoy as much as it was Shurmur. If you watched Bradford last year, he threw deep VERY rarely. Also, McCoy said himself that he wasn't given the option to audible at the line(which seems insane to me), so much of the time they were in a bad playcall, forcing McCoy to just get rid of the ball as quick as possible. Maybe McCoy isn't the answer, but I wouldn't count out a guy with McCoy's work ethic, who will finally have an entire offseason to become acclimated to Shurmur's system.BR1986FB;1038365 wrote:Exactly. Like I said, I have nothing to worry about. 'Checkdown Charlie' won't get this team near the playoffs. -
BR1986FB
Here's your problem. He's BAD but what if he's just "good" enough to get the team to 7-9 and that's his ceiling? You screw yourself out of the franchise QB "hoping & praying" that McCoy's the guy thus wasting another season. Holmgren's already wasted his first two seasons allowing a lame duck coach to coach and allowing a rookie HC to call his own plays.se-alum;1038380 wrote:I believe you build your team, then go out and get your QB, unless you have the opportunity to draft an Andrew Luck. I wouldn't take RGIII. I would fill out the rest of the team, and if McCoy is as bad as most of you seem to think he is, the Browns will have an early pick next year to get a QB or they can go after a veteran QB in free agency. -
SportsAndLady
Yes believe it or not, QBs do sometimes improve from year 2 to year 3BR1986FB;1038382 wrote:So McCoy suddenly grows an arm? Like you said (VERY) hypothetical.
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se-alum
So what if you take RGIII, and he's no good? Then you've wasted more seasons. There's risk in any player personnel move. Holmgren and Shurmur have been around the game long enough to know if McCoy has the arm to be successful at this leverl, so if they decide to bring him back, I'm good with that.BR1986FB;1038386 wrote:Here's your problem. He's BAD but what if he's just "good" enough to get the team to 7-9 and that's his ceiling? You screw yourself out of the franchise QB "hoping & praying" that McCoy's the guy thus wasting another season. Holmgren's already wasted his first two seasons allowing a lame duck coach to coach and allowing a rookie HC to call his own plays. -
DeyDurkie5
agree with sealum..build your team around the qb. There is always goin to be franchise qb's in the draft, no need to rush it. -
Commander of Awesome
Listening to the Draftcountdown podcast and they're really talking up Tannehill. Wonder if he could be a darkhorse pick for the Browns. -
SportsAndLady
No you don't lol you upgrade the team around him, then if he's not your franchise QB, you take a QB with your first round pick wehenver that may be.BR1986FB;1038386 wrote:Here's your problem. He's BAD but what if he's just "good" enough to get the team to 7-9 and that's his ceiling? You screw yourself out of the franchise QB "hoping & praying" that McCoy's the guy thus wasting another season. Holmgren's already wasted his first two seasons allowing a lame duck coach to coach and allowing a rookie HC to call his own plays.
It's eitehr 2 things:
you get your franchise QB in 2012, put him in a situation where he'll have young players and no real weapons around him. Obviously he'll get his lumps out in a year where they aren't going to be good anyways, which is perfectly fine imo.
you get your weapons and team set, then draft a franchise QB in 2013. Put your franchise QB in a winning environment right away w/ weapons around him so you will KNOW for 100% if he's legit or not.
Both of these scenarios are fine by me...my whole point is that in the first one, if you miss on RG3 (or wheover they draft in '12 draft), you are set back another 3 years. In the second scenario, you can simply take another QB in 2014 and add him to the weapons. -
DeyDurkie5
BR is in a win now approach, which is just not realistic. We are building the team up to get talent and youth. He's been a browns fan for quiet some time, and the frustration is building up!
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BR1986FB
Mentioned him earlier as a potential target.Commander of Awesome;1038409 wrote:Listening to the Draftcountdown podcast and they're really talking up Tannehill. Wonder if he could be a darkhorse pick for the Browns. -
BR1986FB
No, I realize they aren't going to "win now." For Godsake, look at next years schedule. What I'm saying is put the QB in place at least gives you SOME hope that they'll grow with him and that he can make ALL of the throws. That guy is NOT McCoy.DeyDurkie5;1038416 wrote:BR is in a win now approach, which is just not realistic. We are building the team up to get talent and youth. He's been a browns fan for quiet some time, and the frustration is building up!
Some of you guys are so used to such a piss poor team that you'd be happy just to reach the "mediocre" level which is what McCoy brings to the party. -
DeyDurkie5
That's not it at all. I see a lot more areas of need right now than the qb. A LOT more. It has nothing to do with being used to a mediocre team. It's being realistic and not forcing hte issue on a franchise qb(when really luck seems to be the only sure thing, what has rg3 proved?) when plenty of franchise qb's come into play every draft.BR1986FB;1038423 wrote:No, I realize they aren't going to "win now." For Godsake, look at next years schedule. What I'm saying is put the QB in place at least gives you SOME hope that they'll grow with him and that he can make ALL of the throws. That guy is NOT McCoy.
Some of you guys are so used to such a piss poor team that you'd be happy just to reach the "mediocre" level which is what McCoy brings to the party. -
SportsAndLady
Yeah the Browns are so good at drafting QBs, it's just going to be that easyBR1986FB;1038423 wrote:What I'm saying is put the QB in place .
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BR1986FB
Ok, since they suck so bad at drafting QB's why put one behind center, period? Let Cribbs run the wildcat every down.SportsAndLady;1038431 wrote:Yeah the Browns are so good at drafting QBs, it's just going to be that easy
/sarcasm
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SportsAndLady
My point is you speak like it's so easy...like, "hey guys, we can get our franchise QB in rgiii, he'll win multiple super bowls for us!" when really it's not that easy.BR1986FB;1038440 wrote:Ok, since they suck so bad at drafting QB's why put one behind center, period? Let Cribbs run the wildcat every down.
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royal_k
This is one of the better QB classes that's come out in last few years. (last year's wasn't too bad either) What would be wrong with drafting a stud WR (Blakmon) and getting your QB with the second pick. Or, maybe they bring in a FA QB to compete with McCoy and draft other needs. I really don't know what direction is the best. That's why this FA period is so important. After it's played out, we'll have a much better idea what direction they'll be looking to draft. -
derek bomar
I really would like to see what McCoy could do with a healthy backfield, a decent WR group and a serviceable line. But since BR says we must draft a QB...might as well sell the farm and move up and get Lucky. I mean, what could be the worst thing that happens? Not like he (or RG3) could be terrible too? -
royal_k
I agre with BR. I don't believe McCoy has the ability to win a Super Bowl. But, like I said earlier, Maybe they get their QB in FA or with the second pick, freeing up the first pick for a playmaker.
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BR1986FB
No, it's not because 'BR says." Since when aren't we allowed to have a STRONG opinion about something around here you fucking dumbass? And yes, that was deserved.derek bomar;1038497 wrote:But since BR says we must draft a QB...might as well sell the farm and move up and get Lucky.
I guess we'll just have to wait & see what the regime does but I bet they bring in another QB with the intent of him being the starter. -
Y-Town Steelhound
RGIII is going to be better than Luck in the NFL, which is why you take him if he's there. -
royal_k
He may turn out to be the best. But, can he play under center? He's been a shotgun QB his whole college career. That's the thing that scares me.Y-Town Steelhound;1038513 wrote:RGIII is going to be better than Luck in the NFL, which is why you take him if he's there. -
Y-Town Steelhound
Ah yes, the most overrated attribute for identifying a quarterback next to his height. First of all, let's not pretend like RGIII has NEVER taken a snap from under center in his entire career. Second of all, unless you're a complete and total R-tard (which it doesn't appear like he is considering he can form whole sentences in his interviews), you can learn with the help of a basic QB coach how to consistently take a snap from under center. If you look at his film you can see that he has good footwork even out of the shotgun so its not like you have to teach him how to drop back into the pocket.royal_k;1038523 wrote:He may turn out to be the best. But, can he play under center? He's been a shotgun QB his whole college career. That's the thing that scares me.
Here are things that you cannot coach: his speed, his arm, his accuracy, his decision making, his play making ability. Make no mistake about it gentlemen, we will see 10 Andrew Lucks (hell we saw one a few years ago in Matt Ryan) before we see another RGIII. He can make throws that Colt McCoy can't make in Madden. -
se-alum
Not that it can't happen, but I would be shocked if this were true.Y-Town Steelhound;1038513 wrote:RGIII is going to be better than Luck in the NFL, which is why you take him if he's there.