Archive

College Basketball Random Chatter 2015-2016 Season

  • birddog23
    Duke just landed 3 star Antonio Vrankovic, 6'11" 270lb Center from 2015 class.

    Duke's front line, which may not be very good offensively besides Jeter, will be huge next year. Vrankovic will join Plumlee, Jefferson, and aforementioned Jeter.
  • reclegend22
    Prescott;1721685 wrote:My continued disdain for Duke was intensified by their one-and-dones. Calipari has always been upfront about the one-and-dones, while Coach K hated OAD players until he saw that he couldn't win without them. He didn't suddenly realize,as he has said, that some of those players wanted to go to Duke.
    In the OAD era, which really began with Carmelo Anthony at Syracuse in 2003 and then escalated with the rise of John Calipari at Memphis, Coach K has proven he can win with and without them. See 2010 Duke, which featured not a single NBA draft pick the summer after cutting down the nets in Indianapolis. That championship came very much after the OAD boom.

    That being said, with the way the current system is constructed, Coach K would be remiss not to go after OAD talent. He didn't just now realize, as you say, that some of those players wanted to go to Duke. He has gone after them in the past. Luol Deng and Josh McRoberts, as examples. Deng left after one season in 2003-04 and going into the recruiting of McRoberts, Duke knew there was a real chance he could exit early (remember that he was the number one player in his class). K was always just more reluctant than others to go travel down that road; I'm sure due in part to many of the obvious reasons a lot of coaches once opposed that strategy (constant roster uncertainty, team chemistry concerns, difficulty implementing intricate schemes).

    The one constant at Duke, however, has always been great senior leadership, especially with regard to its title teams, and that is something that will never change with K in charge. As hard as he has gone after OAD's of late, he also zeroes in on three and four-year guys who he knows will be around to lead by example and keep some semblance of chemistry year in and year out. Speaking to Duke's last two title teams, there was Jon Scheyer and Brian Zoubek in 2010, and Quinn Cook (and junior Amile Jefferson) in 2015. While he didn't have a tremendous individual game against Wisconsin, Cook was absolutely one of Duke's most important players all season long, if not at times its most important. He was the CEO of that team, and without him serving as its captain and leader Duke does not win a championship.

    Duke will never recruit a whole class of four or five OAD's because of that reliance on leadership from upperclassmen that K finds so important to the success of his teams.
    sleeper wrote:Because Duke is the only school who recruits OADs and pretends they are there for academics; and that they do things "the right way".
    It only seems that way because of K's reluctance to go after certain kids (e.g. thugs, to be frank). There is definitely a certain profile that most Duke players fit and that is by design. The Duke staff -- and I'm certain they're not the only staff that does this -- not only evaluates a kid based on his ability to dribble and shoot the basketball, but also on how he conducts himself on and off the court (does he listen to his coach, respect his folks, play within the team mold, etc.
  • sportswizuhrd
    Duke might get their replacement for Tyus Jones in HS Junior Derryck Thornton. He might re-classify to the class of 2015 and play next season. Probably a one-and-done.

    http://www.wralsportsfan.com/devils-could-consider-hs-junior-to-fill-point-guard-position/14573360/
  • reclegend22
    sportswizuhrd;1721942 wrote:Duke might get their replacement for Tyus Jones in HS Junior Derryck Thornton. He might re-classify to the class of 2015 and play next season. Probably a one-and-done.

    http://www.wralsportsfan.com/devils-could-consider-hs-junior-to-fill-point-guard-position/14573360/
    This wouldn't be the first reclassified player to arrive at Duke ahead of their true class. Andre Dawkins being a recent and notable example of this. Without a prototypical point guard heading into next season, it might actually be beneficial for Thornton (as well as Duke) to head to Duke a season early as he'll be "the guy" without any true competition at the point, at least in the classic sense of the position.

    While I'm sure the media and prescott will twist the story into Coach K using his power and authority from his throne atop the evil empire to manipulate a young man in order to win at all costs, Thornton and his parents, even prior to Jones declaring, have actually voiced their interest in Derryck enrolling at Duke early. Besides, the Blue Devils would be just fine without Thornton in 2015-16. Luke Kennard is projected by many in the Duke camp to be the point guard in wait in Durham. In a mold similar to Jon Scheyer, the lengthy Kennard would possibly present a nightmare matchup as Duke's lead guard after gaining a little bit of experience.

    On the other hand, as a fan, I would definitely welcome Thornton early. Without question.

    This post is not directed at you, sportswhiz. And thanks for calling the championship!
  • sportswizuhrd
    reclegend22;1721951 wrote:This wouldn't be the first reclassified player to arrive at Duke ahead of their true class. Andre Dawkins being a recent and notable example of this. Without a prototypical point guard heading into next season, it might actually be beneficial for Thornton (as well as Duke) to head to Duke a season early as he'll be "the guy" without any true competition at the point, at least in the classic sense of the position.

    While I'm sure the media and prescott will twist the story into Coach K using his power and authority from his throne atop the evil empire to manipulate a young man in order to win at all costs, Thornton and his parents, even prior to Jones declaring, have actually voiced their interest in Derryck enrolling at Duke early. Besides, the Blue Devils would be just fine without Thornton in 2015-16. Luke Kennard is projected by many in the Duke camp to be the point guard in wait in Durham. In a mold similar to Jon Scheyer, the lengthy Kennard would possibly present a nightmare matchup as Duke's lead guard after gaining a little bit of experience.

    On the other hand, as a fan, I would definitely welcome Thornton early. Without question.

    This post is not directed at you, sportswhiz. And thanks for calling the championship!
    No prob, I didn't take it as that. Luckily the Lakers can't win the NBA title this year or else they would be too, haha.
  • Prescott
    Duke will never recruit a whole class of four or five OAD's because of that reliance on leadership from upperclassmen that K finds so important to the success of his teams.

    Never say never. Coach K has turned the corner and will take them if they will come.
  • Prescott
    It only seems that way because of K's reluctance to go after certain kids (e.g. thugs, to be frank). There is definitely a certain profile that most Duke players fit and that is by design. The Duke staff -- and I'm certain they're not the only staff that does this -- not only evaluates a kid based on his ability to dribble and shoot the basketball, but also on how he conducts himself on and off the court (does he listen to his coach, respect his folks, play within the team mold, etc.

    I get this. This characterization certainly fits Dahntay Jones .

    Get off your high horse, Duke is no better and no worse than most other schools. This is why Duke is not revered by all--------their fans will not own what they are.


    BTW, I don't consider Duke to be the evil empire. I do consider them in the same way I consider most, if not all, other major programs. They are no better and no worse.
  • birddog23
    Honestly, had Tyus Jones and Justice Winslow not had such a great NCAAT they would likely have come back IMO.

    Winslow 14.5 ppg, 9 rpg and shined in sweet 16 vs Utah and FF vs MSU

    Jones 13 ppg, 4.5 apg and ran the show exceptionally well during the tournament and obviously was extremely crucial vs Wisky.

    Had they just had so-so games or had Duke gotten knocked out early, I think we would not even be having this conversation. But regardless, I will take the 5th National Championship and wish Jah, Justice, and Tyus all well in the NBA.
  • Laley23
    Lol, Winslow was top 10 pick all season long. Kid was never coming back.
  • Azubuike24
    That's how it happens. UK has had at least half-a-dozen guys who weren't even projected first rounders end up leaving after a year. It's the negative of having the reputation for OAD's. That's why you end up getting more though.

    If Duke gets Thornton or Murray, and Ingram, they reloaded at both Jones and Winslow's spots.
  • wildcats20
    Laley23;1722050 wrote:Lol, Winslow was top 10 pick all season long. Kid was never coming back.
    Yup, lottery pick at worst.
  • Prescott
    Excerpt from a pertinent article:

    [INDENT]Krzyzewski maintained that that his reliance on freshmen has come more from opportunity than envy. Some of that can be tied to USA Basketball, as Krzyzewski can easily monitor if players like Okafor, Jones and Winslow can handle Duke’s culture and demands as they move through USA Basketball’s youth system. Even if he’s not coaching them. "There seem to be more guys like that," Krzyzewski said of talented recruits ready to handle Duke. "It just worked out that way."

    [/INDENT]This is flat-out nonsense, a torture of Krzyzewski’s comments. It was never about opportunity or envy; it was a great coach realizing that he could no longer compete with the best of college basketball using the methods he preferred. Nobody, not Calipari, not Bo Ryan, not Roy Williams and not Mike Krzyzewski wants to lose their best players after only one season. Unfortunately, it is hard, if not impossible, to be at the top of the sport without players who might do just that. Krzyzewski, to his great credit, simply refused to be left behind when he had the kind of program that didn’t have to be.

    http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/ncaabk/kentucky-basketball-media-hypocrites-are-fully-exposed-by-mike-krzyzewskis-embrace-of-one-and-done/ar-AAb3CYt?ocid=mailsignout
  • reclegend22
    Prescott;1722021 wrote:It only seems that way because of K's reluctance to go after certain kids (e.g. thugs, to be frank). There is definitely a certain profile that most Duke players fit and that is by design. The Duke staff -- and I'm certain they're not the only staff that does this -- not only evaluates a kid based on his ability to dribble and shoot the basketball, but also on how he conducts himself on and off the court (does he listen to his coach, respect his folks, play within the team mold, etc.

    I get this. This characterization certainly fits Dahntay Jones .

    Get off your high horse, Duke is no better and no worse than most other schools. This is why Duke is not revered by all--------their fans will not own what they are.


    BTW, I don't consider Duke to be the evil empire. I do consider them in the same way I consider most, if not all, other major programs. They are no better and no worse.
    Dahntay Jones is the product of a nuclear family from Hamilton Square, New Jersey, a historical colonial village. He played with extreme confidence and a little swagger, which you seem to be confusing with being a thug. Doing push ups after a slam dunk is about as hard as I remember Dahntay getting.
  • reclegend22
    Prescott;1722093 wrote:Excerpt from a pertinent article:
    [INDENT]Krzyzewski maintained that that his reliance on freshmen has come more from opportunity than envy. Some of that can be tied to USA Basketball, as Krzyzewski can easily monitor if players like Okafor, Jones and Winslow can handle Duke’s culture and demands as they move through USA Basketball’s youth system. Even if he’s not coaching them. "There seem to be more guys like that," Krzyzewski said of talented recruits ready to handle Duke. "It just worked out that way."

    [/INDENT]
    This is flat-out nonsense, a torture of Krzyzewski’s comments. It was never about opportunity or envy; it was a great coach realizing that he could no longer compete with the best of college basketball using the methods he preferred. Nobody, not Calipari, not Bo Ryan, not Roy Williams and not Mike Krzyzewski wants to lose their best players after only one season. Unfortunately, it is hard, if not impossible, to be at the top of the sport without players who might do just that. Krzyzewski, to his great credit, simply refused to be left behind when he had the kind of program that didn’t have to be.

    http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/ncaabk/kentucky-basketball-media-hypocrites-are-fully-exposed-by-mike-krzyzewskis-embrace-of-one-and-done/ar-AAb3CYt?ocid=mailsignout
    Whom are you arguing with? And what is the argument? I agree with pretty much all of that. While he has proven in the OAD era that he can win a championship with a variety of styles and teams, what we have witnessed from Krzyzewski over the past couple of seasons in particular is his ability to evolve and adapt and continue to win despite a constantly changing environment.
  • Prescott
    which you seem to be confusing with being a thug

    If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck it is a duck. His thuggish behavior continues in the NBA.Just ask Draymont Green.This elitist belief that Duke, as you inferred, is only school that recruits good kids is laughable.

    what we have witnessed from Krzyzewski over the past couple of seasons in particular is his ability to evolve and adapt and continue to win despite a constantly changing environment.

    It has been this way for many moons. Coach K didn't adapt, he changed because he wanted to win.

    As the author wrote in the article I posted:

    it wasa great coach realizing that he could no longer compete with the best of college basketball using the methods he preferred.
  • reclegend22
    Prescott;1722145 wrote:This elitist belief that Duke, as you inferred, is only school that recruits good kids is laughable.
    Originally posted by me:

    The Duke staff -- and I'm certain they're not the only staff that does this -- not only evaluates a kid based on his ability to dribble and shoot the basketball, but also on how he conducts himself on and off the court (does he listen to his coach, respect his folks, play within the team mold, etc.

    Never have I said that Duke is the only school that recruits good kids.
  • lhslep134
    reclegend22;1722152 wrote:- and I'm certain they're not the only staff that does this
    Nope. I've sat in on Arizona staff meetings and in one of the recruiting ones for the coaches of all the sports Coach Miller discussed how he picked up his recruiting "manifesto" from Coach K--going hard after a small batch of people that you really get to know instead of going after a larger batch of targets and not getting to know them quite as well--the takeaway being that you want to recruit these kids as athletes but equally, if not more importantly, as people.

    Hate on Duke all you want but that IS Coach K's style and it has been picked up at a couple other schools, but it's far from widespread or mainstream.
  • reclegend22
    lhslep134;1722158 wrote:Nope. I've sat in on Arizona staff meetings and in one of the recruiting ones for the coaches of all the sports Coach Miller discussed how he picked up his recruiting "manifesto" from Coach K--going hard after a small batch of people that you really get to know instead of going after a larger batch of targets and not getting to know them quite as well--the takeaway being that you want to recruit these kids as athletes but equally, if not more importantly, as people.

    Hate on Duke all you want but that IS Coach K's style and it has been picked up at a couple other schools, but it's far from widespread or mainstream.
    Thanks for sharing. Very cool.
  • Azubuike24
    The better you recruit (besides Calipari, Coach K, Miller and probably Self) are the best. They don't have to offer everyone. Even the super-talented guys, any red flags and you can back off. You don't need to take any chances. This isn't the same for the Baylor's, UCLA's, Memphis' and Florida's of the world, who always knock it out of the park in recruiting, but have also had some problem children.
  • Classyposter58
    I don't think Coach K changed at all. A survey this year by the NCAA showed 75% of D1 players believe they'll play professional basketball. The combination of AAU and high profile scouting is ruining these kids today to the point where pretty much every high profile recruit is bolting after a year because of how great they're all told they are


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  • Azubuike24
    I'd bet that barring an injury or something completely unique, every 5-star HS recruit plays professional basketball. The question is, how well, how long and how much of it in the NBA? I'd even expand this to the top 100 or so...considering how strong leagues are in Europe, Asia and now even in other places as well.
  • Mulva
    Marshall Henderson for the win
    http://www.sbnation.com/2015/4/20/8457901/marshall-henderson-waited-2-years-to-revenge-tweet-erin-andrews
  • Iliketurtles
    Lol the guy is a douche but that is fucking funny.
  • birddog23
    Duke gets 5 star Derryck Thornton. And gets him to reclassify to 2015.

    One of the best PG's in the class. The Blue Devils have their floor general for next year. Kennard could still likely see some PG minutes, but I think he is more suited for off the ball.
  • Azubuike24
    I hope this means Jamal Murray does the same to Kentucky.