Should ND coach Brian Kelly step down?

• bigkahuna

  LJ;714673 wrote:They wouldnt get an infraction either. Quit trying to play moderator

  
  Again, not playing moderator, playing citizens' advocate.
• LJ

  

  bigkahuna;714674 wrote:Can you not read?
  
  I asked if you knew for a fact or not if HE knew that. When he says won't, is he saying won't because they can't?

  
  Seeing as how he kept mentioning it who knows. It doesnt matter though, seeing as how as I mentioned before that isnt their job. Im going to watch my show peace
• The Equalizer

  

  
• sleeper

  

  vball10set;714467 wrote:please, don't fuck with my posts, okay?

  
  QQ
  

  Crimson streak;714579 wrote:Just because OSHA finds a fault doesn't mean jack shit. OSHA also charged my company I work for 25000 dollars because we had pallets standing up on it's side instead of being flat on the ground. I agree this is a terrible accident but to fire Brian Kelly because of this is ridiculous. And lj and sleeper Stfu. If this wasn't nd you would even care don't give me the " im so concerned in this case" bullshit. You are just nd haters so gtfo

  QQ
  
  I don't care that its ND, but I don't like how the case and the fans of ND are so quickly trying to sweep under the rug the negligent death of an innocent child. Apparently, at ND its okay to kill someone as long as the parents involved get their multi-million dollar lawsuit and OHSA fines the maximum($77,000), you people disgust me.
• karen lotz

  

  sleeper;714697 wrote:I don't care that its ND, but I don't like how the case and the fans of ND are so quickly trying to sweep under the rug the negligent death of an innocent child. Apparently, at ND its okay to kill someone as long as the parents involved get their multi-million dollar lawsuit and OHSA fines the maximum($77,000), you people disgust me.

  
  
  No one is trying to sweep anything under the rug in South Bend. Funny you should bring that up in light of Tressel's current situation.
• bigkahuna

  sleeper;714697 wrote:
  I don't care that its ND, but I don't like how the case and the fans of ND are so quickly trying to sweep under the rug the negligent death of an innocent child. Apparently, at ND its okay to kill someone as long as the parents involved get their multi-million dollar lawsuit and OHSA fines the maximum($77,000), you people disgust me.

  
  What does firing do for the family though?
  
  Is it going to bring them some kind of closure?
• bigkahuna

  karen lotz;714703 wrote:No one is trying to sweep anything under the rug in South Bend. Funny you should bring that up in light of Tressel's current situation.

  
  I've agreed with a lot of what you've said, but this is apples to oranges IMO.
• Pick6

  

  ok guys/girls...since it looks like some of us struggle with reading comprehension, i'll try to make it as simple as possible..
  
  LJ isnt saying Kelly is the one responsible. He is saying whoever is directly responsible should be fired. I dont see how it would take months to find out who the kids boss was..
  
  Dont see how its that hard to comprehend.
• karen lotz

  

  bigkahuna;714707 wrote:I've agreed with a lot of what you've said, but this is apples to oranges IMO.

  
  I'm not comparing the death to the violations/emails. Just the fact that sleeper is talking about a cover up at ND when it is possible that it is going on in Columbus. The old glass houses and stones analogy comes to mind.
• sleeper

  

  karen lotz;714703 wrote:No one is trying to sweep anything under the rug in South Bend. Funny you should bring that up in light of Tressel's current situation.

  
  Tressel manned up and admitted his mistake. GG
  

  bigkahuna;714705 wrote:What does firing do for the family though?
  
  Is it going to bring them some kind of closure?

  
  Does the money bring them closure?
  
  It's not about bringing "closure", its about bringing justice and punishing those responsible for the negligent death of an innocent child. It could be BK, it could be someone else, but just having Father Jenkins come and say "I TAKE FULL RESPONSIBILITY" and then not doing anything but paying the family and OHSA's joke fine is a disgrace. It seems like he is paying lip service to the responsibility factor and not actually going after the people who KILLED an innocent child.
• bigkahuna

  bigkahuna;714655 wrote:Like I said, I'd be curious to know the times of the following
  
  1. Assignment to go to the lift
  2. Weather Advisory issued
  3. Start of practice
  
  Also, contact between the AV director and the crews.

  
  I quoted this to reply to sleeper.
  

  sleeper;714713 wrote:
  
  
  Does the money bring them closure?
  
  It's not about bringing "closure", its about bringing justice and punishing those responsible for the negligent death of an innocent child. It could be BK, it could be someone else, but just having Father Jenkins come and say "I TAKE FULL RESPONSIBILITY" and then not doing anything but paying the family and OHSA's joke fine is a disgrace. It seems like he is paying lip service to the responsibility factor and not actually going after the people who KILLED an innocent child.

  
  
  I'll agree to that. Nothing the university can do will bring them closure. A memorial on campus in his honor perhaps, but that's neither here nor there.
  
  If we could get some answers to my post above, I think it'd shed a lot of light on the situation. Because of the sheer chaoticness of a practice at a big time school, I can't see BK being liable as he has 1000 other things on his plate. It was probably "Video set up? Good."
  
  I could see the AV director being help liable because I'm guessing the video crew sets up things of that nature. Just like during a game, the crew sets up the equipment and films/edits the game. The team just sees the final product. My guess is the crew sets up equipment for practice, not the assistant coaches. If anyone knew about the wind restrictions, it'd be the AV director.
• sherm03

  

  sleeper;714697 wrote: I don't care that its ND, but I don't like how the case and the fans of ND are so quickly trying to sweep under the rug the negligent death of an innocent child. Apparently, at ND its okay to kill someone as long as the parents involved get their multi-million dollar lawsuit and OHSA fines the maximum($77,000), you people disgust me.

  
  QQ
• LJ

  

  bigkahuna;714752 wrote:I quoted this to reply to sleeper.
  
  
  
  
  I'll agree to that. Nothing the university can do will bring them closure. A memorial on campus in his honor perhaps, but that's neither here nor there.
  
  If we could get some answers to my post above, I think it'd shed a lot of light on the situation. Because of the sheer chaoticness of a practice at a big time school, I can't see BK being liable as he has 1000 other things on his plate. It was probably "Video set up? Good."
  
  I could see the AV director being help liable because I'm guessing the video crew sets up things of that nature. Just like during a game, the crew sets up the equipment and films/edits the game. The team just sees the final product. My guess is the crew sets up equipment for practice, not the assistant coaches. If anyone knew about the wind restrictions, it'd be the AV director.

  I would assume the person responsible for sending them up there would be the one responsible for knowing the restrictions as well as telling him to get down
• bigkahuna

  I'm just assuming that'd be the crew director.
  
  I know when I was taking my education classes and had to do field studies (not the same I know), I was supervised by someone in the education building and not the teacher I was shadowing or w/e at the school. Even the tutors that were UNIV students and paid to go out and tutor at local districts were supervised by someone at the university and not the district they were going to. They just kept a log of whether or not I/they showed up and did an evaluation at the end.
  
  They way I look at it is BK is indirectly responsible for deciding to hold practice outside. However, it's Sullivan's director's responsibility to make sure he's there or not. JMO.
• Heretic

  

  sleeper;714713 wrote: Does the money bring them closure?
  
  It's not about bringing "closure", its about bringing justice and punishing those responsible for the negligent death of an innocent child. It could be BK, it could be someone else, but just having Father Jenkins come and say "I TAKE FULL RESPONSIBILITY" and then not doing anything but paying the family and OHSA's joke fine is a disgrace. It seems like he is paying lip service to the responsibility factor and not actually going after the people who KILLED an innocent child.

  
  Technically, since the dead guy was 20, he's considered an adult and not a "child" or "an innocent child". I understand that with your insistence on portraying a person who is immensely rich and destined to be elite solely due to the university you attend -- you probably would associate being 20 or so with living in a childlike, innocent bliss. But for most people, that isn't really the case.
  
  And didn't you agree to some "if ND wins their bowl, I won't post in their threads" sort of deal? I'd guess a thread about their coach would count as a ND thread. Man, you could be back in the Basement and shit if the wrong people (like us mods) ever figure out you're doing this! Hope nobody snitches!!!
• sleeper

  

  karen lotz;714703 wrote:No one is trying to sweep anything under the rug in South Bend. Funny you should bring that up in light of Tressel's current situation.

  bigkahuna;714705 wrote:What does firing do for the family though?
  
  Is it going to bring them some kind of closure?

  Heretic;714830 wrote:Technically, since the dead guy was 20, he's considered an adult and not a "child" or "an innocent child". I understand that with your insistence on portraying a person who is immensely rich and destined to be elite solely due to the university you attend -- you probably would associate being 20 or so with living in a childlike, innocent bliss. But for most people, that isn't really the case.
  
  And didn't you agree to some "if ND wins their bowl, I won't post in their threads" sort of deal? I'd guess a thread about their coach would count as a ND thread. Man, you could be back in the Basement and shit if the wrong people (like us mods) ever figure out you're doing this! Hope nobody snitches!!!

  
  It's only for threads with "ND" in the title.
  
  And, the word innocent is all that matters. I care about a young man's life, apparently Notre Dame doesn't.
• Heretic

  

  sleeper;714833 wrote:It's only for threads with "ND" in the title.

  
  Thanks for sharing. From the bottom of my heart!
• Tobias Fünke

  

  hahahahah
• bigkahuna

  Not gonna lie, that's really funny heretic
• dwccrew

  

  WebFire;713837 wrote:Did you play/coach FBS football?

  Why does it matter what level he played at?
  

  thedynasty1998;713882 wrote:I know it's not the same, but it would be like saying Gordon Gee is responsible for the meningitis death at OSU this week.

  No, it wouldn't be the same thing at all. Gordon Gee didn't put or allow the student in position to get meningitis, where as SOMEONE (maybe not Kelly) was in charge of Sullivan and allowed him to be in an unsafe working environment. Employers are not supposed to allow their employees to be in unreasonably unsafe working environments.
  

  WebFire;713937 wrote:From the FBS practices I have seen both in person and on film, there is no way I would ever think the head coach is giving a rat's ass about who or what and how the practice is filmed. There is too much going on, too much ground to cover. And like I've said over and over, there are people in place to take care of that. You trust that they are doing their job.

  There is the problem, the coach didn't give a rat's ass, which is negligence. You said it, not me.
  

  rock_knutne;714132 wrote:Oh nice, name calling. Are you going to give yourself an infraction?
  
  Again, I understand that so........go up there and investigate it yourself!

  Notre Dame should be the one investigating. They have the OSHA report. They now need to find the responsible party within the university and terminate their employment. If OSHA fines a company for something an employee (representative of the company) has done that is in violation with OSHA rules, generally the company will take the OSHA findings and conduct their own investigation. The employee is then terminated. I've seen this happen before and it is what should (and may happen for all we know) be done at ND.
  

  rock_knutne;714178 wrote:My logic is just fine, again, who should be fired? Who's DIRECTLY in charge of this kid?

  
  Why are you asking the same question over and over even after the answer has been given to you? Are you this dense? LJ has stated that the direct supervisor or whomever is in charge of that dept. that Sullivan worked in should be fired. Do you want names or something?
  

  Crimson streak;714579 wrote:Just because OSHA finds a fault doesn't mean jack shit. OSHA also charged my company I work for 25000 dollars because we had pallets standing up on it's side instead of being flat on the ground. I agree this is a terrible accident but to fire Brian Kelly because of this is ridiculous. And lj and sleeper Stfu. If this wasn't nd you would even care don't give me the " im so concerned in this case" bullshit. You are just nd haters so gtfo

  
  Yeah, OSHA's findings don't mean jackshit. As made evident by your great comparison between pallets being stored improperly and the death of someone. Great drop in....
  
  
  I am not a ND hater. I believe that someone should be fired over this though. It displays negligence, poor decision making and an overall lack of comme sense and accountability. I don't care who the person is that was in charge, whether it be Kelly or someone else, but whoever it was should be fired.
• rock_knutne

  ^^^^Can you tell us who's in charge? NO ONE KNOWS! And you call me dense?
  
  BTW, ND began and continues their own investigation long before OSHA got involved and ND OPENLY took responsibility for what happened.......how hard is that to understand?
• LJ

  

  rock_knutne;714910 wrote:^^^^Can you tell us who's in charge? NO ONE KNOWS! And you call me dense?
  
  BTW, ND began and continues their own investigation long before OSHA got involved and ND OPENLY took responsibility for what happened.......how hard is that to understand?

  
  You really think that the University doesn't know who his direct boss was? :rolleyes:
• dat dude

  thedynasty1998;713882 wrote:I know it's not the same, but it would be like saying Gordon Gee is responsible for the meningitis death at OSU this week.

  
  There are many dumb posts in this thread (99% by Rock), but this one takes it. That is just a terrible, terrible analogy.
• dat dude

  And just some additional info for thought, for those saying its not BK's responsibility, he's the head coach, etc - the following is Tressel's quote before practice the day before the incident:
  

  Tornado warning sirens blared across campus on Tuesday afternoon when a cold front blew threw the state. Sheeting rain and high winds forced the Buckeyes to practice indoors at the Woody Hayes Athletic Center.
  
  "I don't know today if we'll be inside or out," Tressel said before practice. "It looks a little nasty. I worry about our cameramen, their well-being up there 50 feet in the air. So we'll see how that goes."

  The Buckeyes ultimately practiced indoors.
• rock_knutne

  dat dude;714921 wrote:There are many dumb posts in this thread (99% by Rock), but this one takes it. That is just a terrible, terrible analogy.

  Please.......look who's talking about dumb! You may the biggest fucking retard on this board!