If Freddie is calling plays, he needs to stop. That was atrocious all night. Not a single play at the end there had a chance.

posted by iclfan2

What in the fuck is Baker doing? We get a great chance to score at the end of the half and he does nothing. Come on

I've been one of Baker's biggest pimps and I'm starting to question whether he's the guy. It's getting more & more obvious that Freddie's not. They did better tonight in using Chubb but that was about it. Hats off to the D for keeping this close because the offense is offensive.

This team reminds me of the Vikings, has a lot of good pieces but doesn’t put it together. Probably the best receiving corps in the NFL and they keep trying to run this vertical passing attack instead of using quick strikes to open up the deep ball. All the Rams did was sit in a zone and let that front 7 hunt while Mayfield looked for that 20 yard pass all game. 

Really Mayfield is showing his age too right now, very obvious with this game and Tennessee he is not handling pressure too well.  It’s a shame because the D is legit and this team talent wise is 10-11 wins

posted by BR1986FB

I've been one of Baker's biggest pimps and I'm starting to question whether he's the guy. It's getting more & more obvious that Freddie's not. They did better tonight in using Chubb but that was about it. Hats off to the D for keeping this close because the offense is offensive.

I was never as passionate about Baker as you (and some of the others on here), but I was looking forward to him being the guy. However, I don't like the fact that he can only make throws when his feet are set, and not on the run--it goes without saying that this doesn't bode well for short QB's. Also, the thing that makes him 'dangerous' is his confidence, and right now he has very little--if any.

As far as Kitchens goes, this is too big for him--waaaay too big.

posted by vball10set

I was never as passionate about Baker as you (and some of the others on here), but I was looking forward to him being the guy. However, I don't like the fact that he can only make throws when his feet are set, and not on the run--it goes without saying that this doesn't bode well for short QB's. Also, the thing that makes him 'dangerous' is his confidence, and right now he has very little--if any.

As far as Kitchens goes, this is too big for him--waaaay too big.

I haven't given up on Mayfield but it is concerning that he seems to bail, even when he has a clean pocket. Perhaps lack of confidence in his O-Line? Who knows but I was expecting progression, not regression. The second half of the schedule is more favorable but it would be nice if he'd figure things out sooner. Using Chubb & play action more should help.

As far as Kitchens goes, 1st & goal from the 4, with all timeouts in his pocket, and he doesn't run Chubb ONCE? That coupled with his response in the post game presser about "not being worth it" to challenge the PI call when the Browns had illegal motion? Would've given them an extra down. Don't even get me started on the 4 & 9 draw play, a play which has NEVER been called (on 4th & long) since the league has been tracking these plays (2000?). It's been speculated that he thought it was 3rd down.

https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2019/09/look-for-cleveland-browns-coach-freddie-kitchens-to-let-it-rip-next-week-because-he-knows.html

posted by BR1986FB

https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2019/09/look-for-cleveland-browns-coach-freddie-kitchens-to-let-it-rip-next-week-because-he-knows.html

we'll see

posted by vball10set

we'll see

This was what I was expecting from them in week 1. It seems like these offense "genius" coordinators suddenly become mentally challenged once they get the Browns HC gig.

Way too early to jump to conclusions.  All they had to do was stick with the quick-hitter passing game; he was 12-13 when he got rid of the ball in less than 2.5 seconds ---  Tom Brady has made a hall-of-fame career doing that.  Instead we decided to go downfield way too much.  The final sequence inside the 10 was a real head scratcher though ----- geeeez.

posted by QuakerOats

 

Way too early to jump to conclusions.  All they had to do was stick with the quick-hitter passing game; he was 12-13 when he got rid of the ball in less than 2.5 seconds ---  Tom Brady has made a hall-of-fame career doing that.  Instead we decided to go downfield way too much.  The final sequence inside the 10 was a real head scratcher though ----- geeeez.

 

Even when they were backed up at their own goal line, instead of running the quick-hitters, he (Kitchens) has the receivers running 9 routes. If you're going to throw out of your own end zone, you don't want to be sitting back there, waiting for a route to develop. And if he feels the need to pass on the goal line, to tie or win the game, why not at least try that slant that was working with OBJ earlier? Are they assuming he won't get inside position on a defender?

posted by QuakerOats

 

Way too early to jump to conclusions.  All they had to do was stick with the quick-hitter passing game; he was 12-13 when he got rid of the ball in less than 2.5 seconds....

 

Thank you, Cris Collinsworth (he was stating this ALL GAME LONG!)

Freddie ain't go a clue man. He needs to fix it.

Throwing 4x, while I disagree with it, is fine. Going empty backfield 4x however is indefensible. When you have that little room to work, to not even make the linebackers question their assignment makes no sense. Those 4 plays were so easy to defend and had zero chance from the snap. 

This is a problem.

NFL leaders in taking self out of rhythm (passing open receiver/bailing from clean pockets):

1 Baker Mayfield 12

2 Russell Wilson 9

t3 Lamar Jackson 5

t3 Kyler Murray 5

Fans are savage. Three games in and Freddie's already being called "Fat Shurmur."

posted by BR1986FB

Fans are savage. Three games in and Freddie's already being called "Fat Shurmur."

hey, if he can't stand the heat, get out of the....sorry, I just can't do it... ;)

There's been some speculation that Freddie has been calling the plays but has been calling Monken's plays. If you look at it, kind of makes sense. Freddie's offense last year was a bunch of quick pops, misdirection and trick plays. So far (this season), it seems like the routes are taking too long to develop, with too many 5-7 step drops. Looks eerily familiar to the offense Jameis Winston was running last year (vertical).

Call me crazy but I'm expecting a win and for the offense to get off the schneid against Baltimore. I really don't think their defense is all that. Their secondary can be thrown on and the Chiefs (140 yards rushing) showed they can also be run on. Plus, Baltimore hasn't faced a defense as good as Cleveland's.

Calling my shot, right now....if the Browns get this win they go on a 3 game winning streak (beating SF & Seattle after) heading into Foxboro 4-2.

posted by BR1986FB

I really don't think their defense is all that.

Does anyone think their defense is that great?

posted by iclfan2

Does anyone think their defense is that great?

I think that a lot of people go off the past and assume their defense will be good (also see most Steeler fans when it comes to their team).

I don’t think Baltimore is that great. Jackson just isn’t good enough of a passer. I see people talking about Lamar in MVP discussion, Chiefs v Ravens AFCG, Baltimore as a top 3 team in the league etc. Calm the fuck down, they beat the worst team in history; Arizona (unconvincingly if you watched); and got smoked for 2/3 of the game vs a real team with Jackson having 2-3 Hail Mary type plays caught in the attempted comeback.

Now, Browns have looked bad. But this still seems like a game where Baltimore comes back to earth and Cleveland rises to what we thought they could be. 

posted by Laley23

I don’t think Baltimore is that great. Jackson just isn’t good enough of a passer. I see people talking about Lamar in MVP discussion, Chiefs v Ravens AFCG, Baltimore as a top 3 team in the league etc. Calm the fuck down, they beat the worst team in history; Arizona (unconvincingly if you watched); and got smoked for 2/3 of the game vs a real team with Jackson having 2-3 Hail Mary type plays caught in the attempted comeback.

Now, Browns have looked bad. But this still seems like a game where Baltimore comes back to earth and Cleveland rises to what we thought they could be. 

Didn't Arizona put up a shit ton of yards? I finally watched Baltimore on Sunday as it was the only game on here, and Lamar SUCKED at passing. Missed some easy throws, and then those bullshit ducks he threw up. I'm worried about Ingram, Lamar running, and our offense. 

Now, I don't think Baltimore is great, but they ARE better than the Browns right now, so I'm extremely worried about Sunday.

posted by iclfan2

Didn't Arizona put up a shit ton of yards? I finally watched Baltimore on Sunday as it was the only game on here, and Lamar SUCKED at passing. Missed some easy throws, and then those bullshit ducks he threw up. I'm worried about Ingram, Lamar running, and our offense. 

Now, I don't think Baltimore is great, but they ARE better than the Browns right now, so I'm extremely worried about Sunday.

I’m not saying Baltimore is bad, just not great. Very beatable. Yes, Arizona moved the ball, seemingly at will when I was watching. They had 3 1st and goals and I think ended up with 3 Fgs. Maybe 2 and a turnover? But yeah, if Arizona had punched even 1 of them in it would’ve been a 1 score game the whole way, instead of a 2 score catch up in the 4th.

posted by BR1986FB

I think that a lot of people go off the past and assume their defense will be good (also see most Steeler fans when it comes to their team).

Steelers are about the 25th-27th best team IMO but you think the Browns are going to be 4-2 from what’s been seen?

Sounds like you are acting like most Steelers fans 

posted by Ironman92

Steelers are about the 25th-27th best team IMO but you think the Browns are going to be 4-2 from what’s been seen?

Sounds like you are acting like most Steelers fans 

You're pretty objective, as far as Steeler fans go. Most fans I know assume that because they've almost always been good (in their lifetime) that things will always stay the same. They also believe that since the Browns have sucked since 1999 that they always will.

As far as the Browns go, "if" they win this Sunday, yes...I do think they will be 4-2. For the doom & gloom after that Rams game, they have actually improved from week to week. Mayfield, according to PFF, played at an "elite" level for 3 quarters against the Titans before the wheels came off. Then they played like shit. They played better against the Jets, although still not at the level fans have expected (offensively). Against the Rams, they actually played their best game offensively (although it still sucked) and defensively.

San Fran has beaten shitty Bucs & Bengals teams and squeaked by a Steelers team that was featuring a backup QB. Seattle barely beat the Bengals, squeaked by the Steelers (after Roethlisberger went down) and got bitch slapped, at home, by the Teddy Bridgewater-led Saints.

The Browns just went toe to toe with the NFC Super Bowl rep and should've beaten them.

I expect this team to improve, not regress, over the next few weeks, so yes...If they beat Baltimore I expect them to beat SF on MNF & Seattle, at home, with a 1pm start.