posted by kizer permanente

Except Ford isn't shutting down plants. They're moving light trucks into those lines. GM is closing 5 plants, not moving trucks into them. It's done as a cost cutting measure. Don't think for 1 second the $1B isn't affecting the cost cutting measure. 

The entire second paragraph of the post you responded to says exactly this.  They're cutting some lines to focus on others, which results in a downsized plant, but not a closed one.

posted by kizer permanente

Except Ford isn't shutting down plants. They're moving light trucks into those lines. GM is closing 5 plants, not moving trucks into them. It's done as a cost cutting measure. Don't think for 1 second the $1B isn't affecting the cost cutting measure. 

Everyone is cutting costs. Blaming this on Trump is laughable. I assumed it was a joke at QO, but then you took it seriously. I'm not going to blame it on Obama either (I'd have let them go bankrupt correctly though). The Cruze sucked, was made cheaper in Mexico, and they have been cutting lines at Lordstown prior to Trump. Anyone from the area knew it was inevitable if they didn't get a different vehicle. GM was betting on small cars and high gas prices and lost. Same reason why Ford is no longer making smaller cars in America. The Volt failed too, not because of Trump, but because it sucked. 

Regardless, Warren has already been trending downwards, and this will only hurt it worse.

I get that QO is a jackass and gives Trump all the credit, but you would be the first to argue it wasn't him. He can't not get any credit and all the blame or all of the credit and none of the blame.

Ah, the end result of QQ being a gigantic nutcase whose entire sense of self-worth is tied into how a political party is doing: A world where every single thing a company does gets immediately brought back to the president, so that anything good is directly because of him and his policies and everything bad gets the same treatment.

So, I guess I have to cheer Trump now. After all, GameStop did have the deal I wanted on a video game system and it was available on Thanksgiving, so that has to be due to him, right?!?

posted by iclfan2

Everyone is cutting costs. Blaming this on Trump is laughable. I assumed it was a joke at QO, but then you took it seriously. I'm not going to blame it on Obama either (I'd have let them go bankrupt correctly though). The Cruze sucked, was made cheaper in Mexico, and they have been cutting lines at Lordstown prior to Trump. Anyone from the area knew it was inevitable if they didn't get a different vehicle. GM was betting on small cars and high gas prices and lost. Same reason why Ford is no longer making smaller cars in America. The Volt failed too, not because of Trump, but because it sucked. 

Regardless, Warren has already been trending downwards, and this will only hurt it worse.

I get that QO is a jackass and gives Trump all the credit, but you would be the first to argue it wasn't him. He can't not get any credit and all the blame or all of the credit and none of the blame.

Everyone cutting costs has nothing to do with who's facing additional burdens due to tariffs though which is why it's Trumps fault. No ones saying there aren't other factors. Of course there are. But to say an extra $1B isn't Trumps fault or a reason is asinine. Which QO would deny up and down. 

posted by Heretic

Ah, the end result of QQ being a gigantic nutcase whose entire sense of self-worth is tied into how a political party is doing: A world where every single thing a company does gets immediately brought back to the president, so that anything good is directly because of him and his policies and everything bad gets the same treatment.

So, I guess I have to cheer Trump now. After all, GameStop did have the deal I wanted on a video game system and it was available on Thanksgiving, so that has to be due to him, right?!?

posted by kizer permanente

Everyone cutting costs has nothing to do with who's facing additional burdens due to tariffs though which is why it's Trumps fault. No ones saying there aren't other factors. Of course there are. But to say an extra $1B isn't Trumps fault or a reason is asinine. Which QO would deny up and down. 

Both Mary Barra and auto industry analysts say that the tariffs actually had little if any effect on this decision. Not really sure why you're humping this so hard, unless you just have a hardon for All Things Trump. 

https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/general-motors/2018/11/26/gm-tariffs-cutting-jobs-plants/2115829002/

“This is a correction,” said Kristin Dziczek, vice president of Industry, Labor & Economics at the Center for Automotive Research in Ann Arbor. “GM plants are building more cars that people just don’t want to buy. This has very little to do with tariffs, though I’m sure that’s a part. But this is about the fundamentals of the business.”

The temporary tariff has nothing to do with the Lordstown decision.  Declining sales of the Cruze are the main reason. 

Now if you want to discuss overall major cost components, let’s look at 8 years of skyrocketing employee insurance premiums because of obamaKare.  Now there is a real problem, and continued cause for serious concern.

Employee insurance premiums are a drop in the bucket. Between $6-9000 of the price of every new car goes to pay the lifetime pension of some guy who spent 20 years screwing cigarette lighters into dashboards for $45/hr. 

 posted by fish82

Both Mary Barra and auto industry analysts say that the tariffs actually had little if any effect on this decision. Not really sure why you're humping this so hard, unless you just have a hardon for All Things Trump. 

https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/general-motors/2018/11/26/gm-tariffs-cutting-jobs-plants/2115829002/

“This is a correction,” said Kristin Dziczek, vice president of Industry, Labor & Economics at the Center for Automotive Research in Ann Arbor. “GM plants are building more cars that people just don’t want to buy. This has very little to do with tariffs, though I’m sure that’s a part. But this is about the fundamentals of the business.”

And Forbes thinks GM is just playing nice. Quick question for you though.... if your business faced an extra $1B in unexpected and uncontrolled cost, do you think it would factor into your cost cutting measure? And furthermore, one doesn’t have to have a hardon for Trump to blame him for terribly policy, but I would question why you can’t blame him? 

posted by kizer permanente

And Forbes thinks GM is just playing nice. Quick question for you though.... if your business faced an extra $1B in unexpected and uncontrolled cost, do you think it would factor into your cost cutting measure? And furthermore, one doesn’t have to have a hardon for Trump to blame him for terribly policy, but I would question why you can’t blame him? 

I guess Forbes is entitled to that opinion. I'll take the word of the CEO and actual industry analysts over theirs...and yours, for that matter. 

And while we're at it, the tariffs being 'terribly policy" is also a matter of opinion, and fully depends on who one asks. 

posted by fish82

And Forbes thinks GM is just playing nice. Quick question for you though.... if your business faced an extra $1B in unexpected and uncontrolled cost, do you think it would factor into your cost cutting measure? And furthermore, one doesn’t have to have a hardon for Trump to blame him for terribly policy, but I would question why you can’t blame him? 

I guess Forbes is entitled to that opinion. I'll take the word of the CEO and actual industry analysts over theirs...and yours, for that matter. 

And while we're at it, the tariffs being 'terribly policy" is also a matter of opinion, and fully depends on who one asks. 

Well.... proceed.....

Trump failed to get Mexico to pay for his retarded ass wall. Would be nice if he stopped crying about it and moved on to something of actual importance. 

posted by QuakerOats

 

The temporary tariff has nothing to do with the Lordstown decision.  Declining sales of the Cruze are the main reason. 

 

Now if you want to discuss overall major cost components, let’s look at 8 years of skyrocketing employee insurance premiums because of obamaKare.  Now there is a real problem, and continued cause for serious concern.

 

Employee insurance premiums have risen rapidly since the late 1990s - long before Obama came on the scene.  That's true whether you want to spell Obamacare with a 'k' to make some point about it being communist or not.  

Glad you are privy to the inside decision-making process at GM.  You have no more idea than I do whether or not tariffs were a factor.  The CEO of GM is not going to blame a policy of a sitting president for causing plant shutdowns regardless of what it is.  That is a political failure for a car company that has been too the government's step for help many times during its history.  

posted by Rotinaj

Trump failed to get Mexico to pay for his retarded ass wall. Would be nice if he stopped crying about it and moved on to something of actual importance. 

Maybe he is not done yet

  there needs to be a movie called 8 degrees of Obama that explains how everything that happens in the future directly correlates to Obama and is his fault 

posted by geeblock

  there needs to be a movie called 8 degrees of Obama that explains how everything that happens in the future directly correlates to Obama and is his fault 

It would be the sequel to the 8 degrees of Bush.  I assume the next president will be the 8 degrees of Trump and so on...

posted by geeblock

  there needs to be a movie called 8 degrees of Obama that explains how everything that happens in the future directly correlates to Obama and is his fault 

Well, if Obama & friends want to take credit for economic success more than 18 months after he's out of office, the above seems fair.

Anyway, Obamacare and some federal judge appointments are literally all that's left of his legacy.....we'll survive Trump, too.

Again, the declining sales of the Cruze is the cause for the Lordstown shutdown.  To maintain profitability on a cheap car with just a one-shift operation at a huge plant due to slow sales volume is impossible.  Although it will hurt the valley, the decision seems to be prudent and taxpayers should probably applaud it because it could alleviate another obama-style bailout in the future.  Alternatively, it is much easier and less expensive to retool a large factory when it is idle, so maybe a plan will be revealed later to do so, and Lordstown can come back off the ‘unallocated’ list.

posted by Rotinaj

Trump failed to get Mexico to pay for his retarded ass wall. Would be nice if he stopped crying about it and moved on to something of actual importance. 

Trump is playing 4-D chess with x-ray vision glasses and a crystal ball.  Do not think for a second that what you see right now is part of a the master plan.  

$2.05/gallon

MAGA

posted by QuakerOats

 

 

$2.05/gallon

 

MAGA

 

LOL. Ok. 

They  just raised our coke machine price from 90 cents to a dollar.  WTF Trump?

Doesn't gas always drop in price in the winter?

posted by QuakerOats

 

 

$2.05/gallon

 

MAGA

 

It is amazing that Trump is able to make your gas prices lower.  Who would have believed that one man would create a fracking revolution in less than 2 years.  Al Gore's creation of the Internet in 1986 is the only innovation that surpasses it.  

 In Trump's own words, "Great job President T!!!"

posted by justincredible

Doesn't gas always drop in price in the winter?

Shh.  Don't ruin it for him.  Let him be surprised on his own.