2015 Browns Offseason Thread

• SportsAndLady

  

  BR1986FB;1744342 wrote:I bet he doesn't. For all of the good stuff we heard about him in the offseason, from Joe Haden, it sounds like his confidence has gone back in the shitter. Some of the local guys covering this training camp are saying it looks like he's "clueless" and "just doesn't get it." Just like Mingo, you'd expect your top 10 pick to be an impact player/game changer but I bet Gilbert never amounts to anything close to that. Manziel gets a lot of flack for potentially being a 1st round bust, because he's so polarizing but Gilbert could end up being the bigger disappointment.
  
  I think Farmer could have hit on both 1st rounders this year (time will tell/it always does) but it looks like his (Farmer's) true "value" is finding late round gems and UDFA's.

  It's been a week of training camp dude. Stop believing everything you read. Gilbert will be fine.
• BR1986FB

  SportsAndLady;1744343 wrote:It's been a week of training camp dude. Stop believing everything you read. Gilbert will be fine.

  It's got nothing to do with "reading" anything. It's coming from the people who cover the camp and are seeing it with their own eyes. Yeah, it's too early to deem Gilbert a bust but I bet he doesn't turn out to be anything but a JAG. I don't see him ever being an impact player and, unless someone gets injured, a starter for the Browns.
• SportsAndLady

  

  BR1986FB;1744344 wrote:It's got nothing to do with "reading" anything. It's coming from the people who cover the camp and are seeing it with their own eyes. Yeah, it's too early to deem Gilbert a bust but I bet he doesn't turn out to be anything but a JAG. I don't see him ever being an impact player and, unless someone gets injured, a starter for the Browns.

  Uhhh yeah, it does have something to do with what you are reading. Just because people who are covering the camp write "Gilbert just isn't getting it!!" Doesn't mean he's going to be a bust.
  
  It's training camp. It's week 2 of training camp.
  
  99% of the shit you read right now is just reporters writing shit to get viewers.
• BR1986FB

  SportsAndLady;1744345 wrote:Uhhh yeah, it does have something to do with what you are reading. Just because people who are covering the camp write "Gilbert just isn't getting it!!" Doesn't mean he's going to be a bust.
  
  It's training camp. It's week 2 of training camp.
  
  99% of the shit you read right now is just reporters writing shit to get viewers.

  He was the #8 pick in the draft. Desir was a 4th rounder. K'Waun Williams, who is right there with him, was UNDRAFTED. Gilbert isn't "getting it." If he is so "talented", he's not getting pushed aside by a 4th rounder.
  
  Someone drafted that high, at that position, you can give a bit of a "pass" to until they get their feet under them. Haden started out very slow but came on strong toward the end of his rookie year. If the pick is going to be a true impact player, you may have that but Gilbert hasn't shown that skillset.
• like_that

  

  If desir or williams turns into legit CBs does it really fucking matter if Gilbert turns into a Bust? The point of the draft is to find impact players. It is supposed to be easier to find the impact players in the first round, but if that doesn't happen you better find them in the rounds beyond that. If impact players are founded in the later rounds, it really doesn't matter if the first round picks do not pan out. The only thing it causes is an annoyance as those first round picks could have been used on somebody else. The Seahawks were just in back to back SBs because of the their later picks. Their last impactful first round picks came 5 years ago with Earl Thomas and Russell Okung. I am not suggesting that the first round doesn't matter, but if a GM makes good picks int he later rounds, it can easily fix the fuck ups from the first round. Thus if desir/williams surpass Gilbert, then so be it. You can treat them as the first round guy the team was looking for in Gilbert.
  
  With that being said, as S&L said, it has only been 1 fucking week of training camp. For fucks sake, how about waiting for a couple preseason games before we label our rookies as good picks/busts and our 2nd year players as busts/good picks??? All the training camp news is always a pile of shit. Do you guys remember how many times Robiskie was looking AMAZING every Browns training camp? How about Carlton Mitchell?!?? 98% of these reporters don't know what the fuck they are talking about. They get a limited view of the team every day at training camp, and most of them are needle dicks who never played football in their lives.
• BR1986FB

  like_that;1744347 wrote: With that being said, as S&L said, it has only been 1 fucking week of training camp. For fucks sake, how about waiting for a couple preseason games before we label our rookies as good picks/busts and our 2nd year players as busts/good picks??? All the training camp news is always a pile of shit. Do you guys remember how many times Robiskie was looking AMAZING every Browns training camp? How about Carlton Mitchell?!?? 98% of these reporters don't know what the fuck they are talking about. They get a limited view of the team every day at training camp, and most of them are needle dicks who never played football in their lives.

  Now, now...we all have our "whipping boys." You guys had Weeden and I'll have Mingo & Gilbert, until they prove otherwise.
  
  "I've just got to keep going in and working hard daily and prove that I really want to be a part of this team and be out there and be able to make plays for this team,'' ("prove that I really want to be part of this team? Sounds like doubt to me by either the player or the staff)
  
  http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/08/browns_justin_gilbert_ive_got.html
• SportsAndLady

  

  Here is BR's logic, not that everyone doesn't already know this:
  
  One week passes of training camp, couple reporters, who are desperate for news stories, write, "player X looks lost out there."
  
  BR sees this and automatically labels player X a bust, and not only that, but the entire draft player X was in a huge failure. And then generalizes about the GM's ability to find players in the early rounds of the draft because of that news article about player X.
  
  
  It's okay to have opinions, you just go completely overboard
• like_that

  

  BR1986FB;1744350 wrote:Now, now...we all have our "whipping boys." You guys had Weeden and I'll have Mingo & Gilbert, until they prove otherwise.
  
  "I've just got to keep going in and working hard daily and prove that I really want to be a part of this team and be out there and be able to make plays for this team,'' ("prove that I really want to be part of this team? Sounds like doubt to me by either the player or the staff)
  
  http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/08/browns_justin_gilbert_ive_got.html

  LOL at still being butt hurt about Weeden, because you were the only one who wanted to draft him. Everyone in their right mind knew that was a stupid ass pick. With that being said, most of us were open to giving him a chance to show he was a capable NFL QB in his second year.
  
  The Weeden pick is not even comparable to Gilbert and JFF. Nobody is being a Gilbert apologist either. He needs to step up, but i am not going to freak out after 1 week of TC and I won't be upset if he is a bust if desir/williams turn out to be legitimate players. As for JFF, no idea why you brought him up. The only people who jerked off to JFF were FW and IQQY. Anyway, you can continue your psych analysis of players and their quotes (LOL). I will wait to see how they play on the field.
• like_that

  

  SportsAndLady;1744352 wrote:Here is BR's logic, not that everyone doesn't already know this:
  
  One week passes of training camp, couple reporters, who are desperate for news stories, write, "player X looks lost out there."
  
  BR sees this and automatically labels player X a bust, and not only that, but the entire draft player X was in a huge failure. And then generalizes about the GM's ability to find players in the early rounds of the draft because of that news article about player X.
  
  
  It's okay to have opinions, you just go completely overboard

  Pretty much spot on, but you forgot the psych analysis of every player.
• Commander of Awesome

  

  Carlton Mitchell lol
• Commander of Awesome

  

  Look, bottom line do we all wish Gilbert was the 2nd coming/all pro cb? Absolutely. Was he a reach in the draft? Probably.
  
  But you have to factor in what we knew at the time he was drafted, not revisionist history boohoo farmer sucks bs.
  
  Gilbert was a spoiled little bitch boy last season who was given the opportunity to begin the season. Obviously that was a mistake, he makes one play we win that game. Petite learned from his mistake and played udfa over him rest of season.
  
  What did we know about Gilbert at the time he was drafted? He was a physical freak, best cover corner in college football. He needed work in technique, as he relied too much on his athleticism. That's ok, we can coach that. He was also a monster punt returner. Great, checks all the boxes, ok draft him.
  
  This, br, isn't a weeden/veikune/trich hilariously bad draft pick. Weeden was old as dirt and sucked in college. Wasn't accurate, and didn't handle pressure in the pocket. Also was old as shit and can't build around. Horrible indefensible pick.
  
  Veikune, bum who didn't produce in college. Bad.
  
  Trich, a rb top 3 pick? Lol. Even if he was next ap still a bad value pick.
  
  I don't blame or put the Gilbert selection in same category at those picks above. Gilbert by all accts, was immature and learned from his mistake. He's getting it.
• BR1986FB

  Commander of Awesome;1744368 wrote:Look, bottom line do we all wish Gilbert was the 2nd coming/all pro cb? Absolutely. Was he a reach in the draft? Probably.
  
  But you have to factor in what we knew at the time he was drafted, not revisionist history boohoo farmer sucks bs.
  
  Gilbert was a spoiled little bitch boy last season who was given the opportunity to begin the season. Obviously that was a mistake, he makes one play we win that game. Petite learned from his mistake and played udfa over him rest of season.
  
  What did we know about Gilbert at the time he was drafted? He was a physical freak, best cover corner in college football. He needed work in technique, as he relied too much on his athleticism. That's ok, we can coach that. He was also a monster punt returner. Great, checks all the boxes, ok draft him.
  
  This, br, isn't a weeden/veikune/trich hilariously bad draft pick. Weeden was old as dirt and sucked in college. Wasn't accurate, and didn't handle pressure in the pocket. Also was old as shit and can't build around. Horrible indefensible pick.
  
  Veikune, bum who didn't produce in college. Bad.
  
  Trich, a rb top 3 pick? Lol. Even if he was next ap still a bad value pick.
  
  I don't blame or put the Gilbert selection in same category at those picks above. Gilbert by all accts, was immature and learned from his mistake. He's getting it.

  Why in the Hell would you include Veikune in there? He was a SECOND fucking rounder. Not "apples to apples" at all.
• BR1986FB

  SportsAndLady;1744352 wrote:Here is BR's logic, not that everyone doesn't already know this:
  
  One week passes of training camp, couple reporters, who are desperate for news stories, write, "player X looks lost out there."
  
  BR sees this and automatically labels player X a bust, and not only that, but the entire draft player X was in a huge failure. And then generalizes about the GM's ability to find players in the early rounds of the draft because of that news article about player X.
  
  
  It's okay to have opinions, you just go completely overboard

  Gilbert sucked ass LAST year. He's still sucking ass. Until he proves otherwise, he sucks ass.
• Commander of Awesome

  

  BR1986FB;1744370 wrote:Why in the Hell would you include Veikune in there? He was a SECOND fucking rounder. Not "apples to apples" at all.

  Are you serious? You can't comprehend the logic used that I spelled out for you? LOL
• Commander of Awesome

  

  BR1986FB;1744372 wrote:Gilbert sucked ass LAST year. He's still sucking ass. Until he proves otherwise, he sucks ass.

  He actually played well at the end of the season. Pick 6 against the colts for example
• SportsAndLady

  

  Yeah Gilbert did not "suck ass" last year.
  
  Look at most all-pro corners in the NFL, they mostly all had the same rookie year Gilbert did last year.
• Commander of Awesome

  

  Not sure what br wants, desir to not be ahead of Gilbert on the depth bc he was a 1st round pick?
  
  Personally I want best players to play. Be like not starting Russell Wilson bc you paid all that $$$ for their qb in fa(whose name I can't recall ATM) wilsons rookie year.
• SportsAndLady

  

  Flynn Knows
• like_that

  

  I think br is trying too hard to use Gilbert as his redemption for the amount of support he gave for the weeden/trich first round.
• SportsAndLady

  

  like_that;1744397 wrote:I think br is trying too hard to use Gilbert as his redemption for the amount of support he gave for the weeden/trich first round.

  I'll never forget iggy's post about how the city of Cleveland's excitement level is through the roof with the thought of weeden at QB and t-rich in the backfield. LOL
• shook_17

  

  Sounds like Johnny is straight slinging it at practice today. Looking like a real pro. McCown better watch out.
• BR1986FB

  like_that;1744397 wrote:I think br is trying too hard to use Gilbert as his redemption for the amount of support he gave for the weeden/trich first round.

  No I'm not. If a dude sucks, a dude sucks. I call a spade a spade. I held on too long on Weeden thinking he could be a legit QB. He sucks. Gilbert sucks & Mingo sucks. I've seen nothing in either to think they will ever live up to where they were picked or be consistent starters for the Browns.
• like_that

  

  shook_17;1744400 wrote:Sounds like Johnny is straight slinging it at practice today. Looking like a real pro. McCown better watch out.

  Where do you see that?
• SportsAndLady

  

  BR1986FB;1744404 wrote:No I'm not. If a dude sucks, a dude sucks. I call a spade a spade. I held on too long on Weeden thinking he could be a legit QB. He sucks. Gilbert sucks & Mingo sucks. I've seen nothing in either to think they will ever live up to where they were picked or be consistent starters for the Browns.

  You give no reason as to why Gilbert and Mingo sucks. You just say they suck because they were drafted in the top 10 and haven't been an all-pro yet.
  
  Lumping them in with weeden just further strengthens Like That's point that you are just butthurt you were wrong about weeden and are looking for a target to "get us back".
• Commander of Awesome

  

  SportsAndLady;1744415 wrote:You give no reason as to why Gilbert and Mingo sucks. You just say they suck because they were drafted in the top 10 and haven't been an all-pro yet.
  

  Great point, glad someone else saw the lazy as shit Cle radio analysis here.
  
  Gilbert was a rookie who didn't play much last season. Never mind that outside of QB, CB is one of the hardest transition positions from college to pros. I think he'll be fine.
  
  Mingo, yeah not a double digit sack, but is still a decent OLBer who is above average in pass coverage. Can't find a use for that in the Pros? LOLOLOLOL