OSU vacates 2010 wins

• Azubuike24

  

  centralbucksfan;826642 wrote:Jackass fans? LMAO...pot meet kettle. Your nothing but a ****ing troll moron. There are few non OSU classy fans on this OHIO BASED forum! To this day, i have NO clue why fans from Fla, LSU other non area fans come onto this forum. Oh wait..yes I do...TO stir the pot and troll!! I have yet to step foot into another state or other team forum. There is NO reason to. Except to be an ass like you. And I highly doubt you will find many OSU fans trolling the other sites. Very few!! And you act like Florida is all innocent. ****, they have a team that could rival the London Correctional institute in terms of the number of times they have run into the law!! ****, one of your own just admitted he and others at Fla did the samething OSU players did. They just didn't get caught. That is the only difference. So just STFU and move on.

  This post showed your maturity CBF. You have no idea why fans of other schools are on an Ohio board? This is the 21st century. People move. People re-locate. People root for a wide variety of teams, especially in the media age we live in. The forums are titled "college football, college basketball, pro sports, etc..." While it's expected that naturally most of the fans will be supporters of Ohio-based teams, to say you have no clue why there are people with connections to other states is just stupid.
• Midstate01

  

  "@Buckeye_Nation Of the 28 teams who violated NCAA rule 10.1 in past 10 yrs, none received post-season ban." #OhioState #BuckeyeNation”
• killer_ewok

  

  Azubuike24;826673 wrote:This post showed your maturity CBF. You have no idea why fans of other schools are on an Ohio board? This is the 21st century. People move. People re-locate. People root for a wide variety of teams, especially in the media age we live in. The forums are titled "college football, college basketball, pro sports, etc..." While it's expected that naturally most of the fans will be supporters of Ohio-based teams, to say you have no clue why there are people with connections to other states is just stupid.

  Good post.
  
  I mean, come on, cbf.....do you ACTUALLY believe that every or even most of the non-OSU fans on here signed up to troll the Buckeyes?
• Thinthickbigred

  sick
• Speedofsand

  

  cbf,
  Your nothing but a ****ing troll moron.
  its "You're" not "Your".
  To this day, i have NO clue ...I have yet to step foot into another state or other team forum.
  Maybe when you get educated you will be able to find websites currently out of your reach and discover how knowledgeable fans interact on message boards.
  one of your own just admitted he and others at Fla did the samething OSU players did.
  If you mean Crowder, he said "hypothetically", and the story died as fast as it hit the headlines. Check the links in the thread on this OHIO based board right here.
  http://www.ohiochatter.com/forum/threads/26414-Everyone-does-it...
  
  
  LMAO @ the replies by vball, writer, sleeper, and cbf proving my point.
• Writerbuckeye

  

  Midstate01;826681 wrote:"@Buckeye_Nation Of the 28 teams who violated NCAA rule 10.1 in past 10 yrs, none received post-season ban." #OhioState #BuckeyeNation”

  
  Which is why most of us have said UNLESS the NCAA comes back with some type of amended letter of allegations, the chances of OSU receiving any kind of ban are nil. The NCAA is all about precedents; it's why OSU hired the consulting firm it did, one that regularly works with schools and the NCAA to formulate punishments based on what rules were broken and what the NCAA has done in the past.
• Pick6

  

  Midstate01;826681 wrote:"@Buckeye_Nation Of the 28 teams who violated NCAA rule 10.1 in past 10 yrs, none received post-season ban." #OhioState #BuckeyeNation”

  
  but...but..but...what OSU did is worse than USC. They are for sure getting hammered! /sarcasm
• thedynasty1998

  

  Pick6;826745 wrote:but...but..but...what OSU did is worse than USC. They are for sure getting hammered! /sarcasm

  
  So you're using that tweet as evidence of your stance?
• cats gone wild

  Wow, cbf has snapped. Break open a box of kleenex. I guess all this OSU stuff is getting under his scarlet skin. I guess the crow doesnt taste good after years of running his mouth about other programs. Azu hit it right on the head. CBF, you are one of the many reasons why I could never be a bucks fan. Btw, I live in Ohio so whats the big deal about being on a Ohio board. This isnt bucknuts. Tell your 200 bucks fans to get off the LSU site.
• thedynasty1998

  

  Yea pretty immature to say only OSU fans should be allowed on here. It's comical when people think everyone should be on a message board with the same opinions.
• SportsAndLady

  

  One of these days cbf will be gone from these boards...and all in the world will be well.
• Hb31187

  

  SportsAndLady;826793 wrote:One of these days cbf will be gone from these boards...and all in the world will be well.

  
  If he takes Big Gain and Sleeper with him, then id agree lol
• Tiernan

  Having diverse (although idiotic) opinions like Speed O' Sand, Ty Webb and Cats offer up is what makes a message board hop & pop.
• se-alum

  

  thedynasty1998;826756 wrote:So you're using that tweet as evidence of your stance?

  Should it not be evidence toward no post-season ban? A precedent has been set, and to go against that precedent opens up an appeal process that would most likely be easily won by OSU. Nobody wants their decision overturned, which is why courts and judges typically always rule w/ the precedent that has been set in other cases.
• enigmaax

  se-alum;826893 wrote:Should it not be evidence toward no post-season ban? A precedent has been set, and to go against that precedent opens up an appeal process that would most likely be easily won by OSU. Nobody wants their decision overturned, which is why courts and judges typically always rule w/ the precedent that has been set in other cases.

  
  I've stated I don't believe they'll get a bowl ban, but none of what you said applies remotely to the NCAA. The NCAA makes its own decisions and those are admittedly made on a case-by-case basis with no regard to their own precedents. They also essentially hear their own appeals, so there is no "easily won" about it. It isn't anything like the American court system, so there's no evidence to consider either way and we're all in the dark. The determining factors are going to be, how pissed off they are that OSU made them look stupid over the Sugar Bowl ruling, and how deadset are they on suddenly proving they aren't a paper tiger (this is the part that could hurt OSU because the NCAA is feeling some heat from Congress so they may feel the need to reinforce their amateurism charade).
• Azubuike24

  

  enigmaax is correct. If the NCAA acted on their own precedent, a lot of things (past cases and rulings) would be different. I don't know how many times we've had issues like the OSU scenario, try to predict how it will turn out because "A and B" went this way, so should "C", only to see the NCAA come out of left-field and make a ruling.
  
  Sadly, like enigmaax stated, it may come down to how much of a beef do they have with OSU and whether or not this point in time is one to make a huge example.
• dat dude

  We've had a couple of days to process Ohio State's response to the NCAA and as one might expect with a self-punishment that did not include the loss of scholarships or a postseason ban, Buckeye fans are ecstatic, while just about everyone else is incredulous.
  
  The football program was alleged to have violated several NCAA Bylaws, including 12.1.2.1.6, 14.11.1, 16.1.4 and 16.11.16, in addition to a 10.1 charge levied against former head coach Jim Tressel. In turn, the university's response boiled down to the following:
  
  Suspending five players for the first five games of next season (with a sixth, Jordan Whiting suspended for the opener and a seventh, unnamed player, suspended for the entire 2011 season pending appeal1)
  Accepting Jim Tressel's resignation
  Vacating the football program's wins in the 2010 season, including the Sugar Bowl victory over Arkansas2
  Self-imposing a two-year NCAA probation
  Implementing additional measures "to enhance the university's already extensive monitoring, educational and compliance programs"
  The school painted Tressel as a good man that made a grave mistake, hoping to avoid any type of institutional culpability:
  
  The University believes that little institutional responsibility exists for the preferential treatment violations in Allegation #1. While the University recognizes that the institution must take responsibility for its employee’s actions with respect to Allegation #2, the responsibility is upon Tressel. No other institutional personnel were aware of the preferential treatment violations, and Tressel had an obligation to report the potential violation to the appropriate institutional officials.
  And that's it.
  
  Beyond the annoying thought of returning to 0-fer territory in bowl games against the SEC and having a streak of six Big Ten championships snapped, if the NCAA agrees with Ohio State's response, we'll a state full of happy campers. The same cannot be said for certain members of the media who have a hard time separating sensationalist allegations with the facts on the ground.
  
  Noted Buckeye troll3 Brett McMurphy of CBS Sports had the following take:
  
  If the Buckeyes were this inept on the field, they never would have won the past six Big Ten Conference titles. Oh wait, that last title will be vacated. Big freakin' deal. Correction: It's only five Big Ten titles in the past six years.
  ESPN's Brian Bennett:
  
  Instead, Ohio State has tried to half-step it, again, just as it did in its 10-day sham investigation last December, and just as it did when it originally announced that Tressel would be suspended for only two nonconference games. The school's response, predictably, tried to lay all the blame at the feet of the departed and disgraced coach.
  In columns everywhere (and especially on Twitter), the reaction was more of the same: Utter shock that the Buckeyes could have the chutzpah to avoid scholarship reductions or a postseason ban in their self-punishment.
  
  
  But you know what? The response matched the allegations.
  
  Despite breathless accounts of rigged raffles and feigned outrage over perfectly legal and entirely permissible car sales, the NCAA has yet to amend their original Notice of Allegations. The university has worked with NCAA and continues to do so to "review information concerning potential violations, including issues publicly raised subsequent to the university's self-reporting", but nothing has surfaced and you have to think that if there was anything close to surfacing, the NCAA would have told Ohio State to hold off on their response.
  
  The penalties, might seem light to outsiders, but when you consider the fact that USC didn't even impose any penalties on their football program4 -- hoping to toss the hoops program out as a sacrificial lamb instead -- they make perfect sense. SI's Stewart Mandel gets it:
  
  There was no Lack of Institutional Control charge (as USC received) or Failure to Monitor charge (as North Carolina recently received). No school employees besides Tressel were implicated of any wrongdoing. The school has no incentive to impose heavier penalties than it issued Friday because the NCAA itself has not indicated anyone other than Tressel and the suspended players should be punished.
  
  
  While I don't expect the NCAA to amend their notice of allegations or push the hearing back beyond the originally announced date of August 12th, it's only reasonable to think the organization will add another year of probation or revoke scholarships. However, a postseason ban, as so many outside the program have hoped for, is likely not in the cards.
  
  Even if the NCAA adds to Ohio State's penalty, it won't invalidate the university's response. When is the last time the organization has told a member institution to take it easier on itself? You do not want to amputate your leg when all that's needed is a cast.
  
  So there you have it. For the first time in many months, there's optimism in Buckeyeland. We're not out of the woods just yet, but we're inching closer, much to the chagrin of outside observers.
  
  1 This player, alleged to have received several hundred dollars worth of free tattoos, is more than likely Dorian Bell.
  2 Ohio State is actually vacating the entire season, including the lone loss to Wisconsin. One casualty of this is the school's all-time winning percentage, which is now .716, dropping the Buckeyes behind Texas and Oklahoma on the all-time list. This will also throw head-to-head records out of whack. For instance, Michigan still has a loss on the books from last November's game, but the Buckeyes will no longer have the win, meaning the Wolverines are 57-44-6 in the series, while the Buckeyes are 43-57-6.
  3 A, B, C
  4 This is particularly egregious when you consider USC violated 31 Bylaws, compared to just five for Ohio State.

  http://www.elevenwarriors.com/2011/07/the-great-butthurt-symphony-of-2011
  
  Great summary.
• FatHobbit

  

  http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sports/stories/2011/07/10/schools-should-forfeit-cash-not-wins.html?sid=101
  
  This makes a little more sense to me than forfeiting a season. (the part at the end about giving money to the non revenue sports seems a little odd to me, but oh well.) Nobody really gives a crap and everybody remembers the games and knows who won. And the NCAA and all the schools make a lotta cash and just move on. Maybe they should refund the price of the tickets to people who watched games that never happened? And they can buy back all the t-shirts and memorabilia too.
• enigmaax

  dat dude;827075 wrote:http://www.elevenwarriors.com/2011/07/the-great-butthurt-symphony-of-2011
  
  Great summary.

  
  The one other thing that seems to get lost, and I forgot to mention it as well, is how seriously the NCAA will take the "repeat offender" status. They specifically mentioned it in the letter to OSU and there aren't many schools who ever fall into that category.
  
  I'm not even sure I'm clear on how that came to be - apparently the NCAA defines the window for repeat offending by the date of the punishment being handed out for the first offense and the date of discovery of the next offense? If I understand correctly, the actual offenses were almost ten years apart? Not sure how all of that will play into the NCAA's thinking.
  
  Side note, open question. It was reported within the last few weeks that the NCAA had been in Columbus again to investigate the free golf issue. I would assume that OSU would prefer that if anything comes of that, it be added now and roll everything into one? But I'm not sure what the potential impact would/can be if the NCAA hands out some penalties over the Tressel deal and then later discovers (or addresses) more violations as it relates to the golf issue. I only mention this one specifically because of the report that the NCAA was in Columbus investigating it. Thoughts?
• Writerbuckeye

  

  Someone on the O-Zone looked back at 28 prior cases of 10.1 violations (the major infraction OSU is facing because of Tressel not coming forward) and in all those cases, only two schools were on probation and considered repeat offenders. The school that was a repeat offender in the same sport (football) got more severe punishment than the school on probation in another sport (which is the case with OSU). That school did not receive a ban or scholarship reductions.
  
  Unless the NCAA has found something else and another letter of allegations is forthcoming -- and one that includes LOIC or FTM -- precedents say there will be no ban or scholarship reductions.
  
  I heard the rumor the NCAA came back to look into the golf allegations as well, but have heard nothing since. I would have to presume that if something is found, an amended (or new) letter will be forthcoming.
  
  In the meantime, ESPiN is suing OSU because the university isn't just turning over every e-mail in the system so they can go on a fishing expedition. Under freedom of information laws, you are supposed to specifically tell what it is you want to view; apparently ESPiN doesn't believe they need to follow the law.
  
  Too damn funny. I'm sure they'll be whining about it publicly soon in a column near you...
• sleeper

  

  Careful again Writer, you are letting facts get into the way of the hater's wet dream.
• se-alum

  

  Writerbuckeye;827339 wrote:Someone on the O-Zone looked back at 28 prior cases of 10.1 violations (the major infraction OSU is facing because of Tressel not coming forward) and in all those cases, only two schools were on probation and considered repeat offenders. The school that was a repeat offender in the same sport (football) got more severe punishment than the school on probation in another sport (which is the case with OSU). That school did not receive a ban or scholarship reductions.
  
  Unless the NCAA has found something else and another letter of allegations is forthcoming -- and one that includes LOIC or FTM -- precedents say there will be no ban or scholarship reductions.
  
  I heard the rumor the NCAA came back to look into the golf allegations as well, but have heard nothing since. I would have to presume that if something is found, an amended (or new) letter will be forthcoming.
  
  In the meantime, ESPiN is suing OSU because the university isn't just turning over every e-mail in the system so they can go on a fishing expedition. Under freedom of information laws, you are supposed to specifically tell what it is you want to view; apparently ESPiN doesn't believe they need to follow the law.
  
  Too damn funny. I'm sure they'll be whining about it publicly soon in a column near you...

  I really can't stand ESPN. They sent a reporter last week or the week before to try to get more on the golf story. The woman hassled former players from back in the 90's that weren't even real contributors on the football team. She told the players her boss(ESPN) told her to come back w/ a story because they're sure there is more to it. They are super pissed that there has been no evidence of any the shit slinging they've done sticking.
• se-alum

  

  Also, the haters will love this, since 1987, over half of the schools hit w/ major violations by the NCAA have had BETTER records the next 5 years, than they had the previous 5 years.
• KnightRyder

  

  Writerbuckeye;827339 wrote:Someone on the O-Zone looked back at 28 prior cases of 10.1 violations (the major infraction OSU is facing because of Tressel not coming forward) and in all those cases, only two schools were on probation and considered repeat offenders. The school that was a repeat offender in the same sport (football) got more severe punishment than the school on probation in another sport (which is the case with OSU). That school did not receive a ban or scholarship reductions.
  
  Unless the NCAA has found something else and another letter of allegations is forthcoming -- and one that includes LOIC or FTM -- precedents say there will be no ban or scholarship reductions.
  
  I heard the rumor the NCAA came back to look into the golf allegations as well, but have heard nothing since. I would have to presume that if something is found, an amended (or new) letter will be forthcoming.
  
  In the meantime, ESPiN is suing OSU because the university isn't just turning over every e-mail in the system so they can go on a fishing expedition. Under freedom of information laws, you are supposed to specifically tell what it is you want to view; apparently ESPiN doesn't believe they need to follow the law.
  
  Too damn funny. I'm sure they'll be whining about it publicly soon in a column near you...

  well if someone on the o-zone said it it would have to be gospel.
• thedynasty1998

  

  Interesting that OSU won't turn over some of the emails requested. I read about it through ABC6's release and they mentioned they have the same request for information. No one local would be dumb enough to sue the school so as much as everyone will criticize them for it, it was going to take someone of their power to force OSU's hand.