Republican debates/primaries.

• BoatShoes

  rrfan;1784644 wrote:So because she had a public office in the west wing that makes her qualified. She completely sucked at her job and should be in jail. There is no way I would trust her with anything. The "pile of shit" comment could be considered better than what many think of her experience. Let her be the D's choice and then she can get arrested on her campaign.

  I didn't say that makes her qualified. I'm just saying it is silly to suggest her experience is a pile of shit. Experience alone does not make one qualified to be president IMHO.
• rrfan

  

  BoatShoes;1784647 wrote:I didn't say that makes her qualified. I'm just saying it is silly to suggest her experience is a pile of shit. Experience alone does not make one qualified to be president IMHO.

  Please explain to me what her experience has done for her? She is a complete disaster as a candidate.
• ZWICK 4 PREZ

  

  BoatShoes;1784637 wrote:It is very strange. Kasich is considered a RINO and permanently scarred by things like accepting the federal medicaid money while Trump can say anything and not lose support.

  Well.. Republicans made their bed the last 15 years. Now they have to lay in it. They did this to their own base.
• like_that

  

  BoatShoes;1784641 wrote:I can totally understand if you don't like Hillary but it seems pretty cray to say her experience is a "pile of shit" - At the very least she was the first first lady to have an office in the west wing and was essentially another chief of staff for two presidential terms and was instrumental in passing at least two major pieces of legislation with a Republican congress.
  
  Hillary has plenty of warts but I wouldn't say experience is one of them. It's like saying Dick Cheney experience was shit.

  I'm referring to the performance. Anybody can have a nice resume, but how well did they actually perform?
• bigkahuna

  I have no elephant in the race, but Kasich is the most competent one the Republicans have to choose from. The one thing that killed me last night besides the dick reference was when Trump was asked about the military doing "illegal" things such as torture and killing the families of terrorists. The mod said something along the lines of military personnel are trained to refuse "illegal" orders. Trump responded with, "I'll make them do it, trust me."
  
  It was obvious that the debate was almost set up for him to fail. I did laugh when they brought up statistics to show that his policies don't add up, and the country would still be at a huge deficit.
• Dr Winston O'Boogie

  

  Everyone liked Kasich last night, and I understand that. The problem is that he doesn't have the personal appeal needed to get him over the hump - fair or unfair. I discount these debates because all they are are TV theater. They're set up to get candidates fighting like that. I don't think they influence people much. In fact I think most people forget about them rather quickly.
  
  The appeal of Trump has to do with people being sick and tired of the political establishment, regardless of whether there is an "R" or a "D" after someone's name. McCain and Romney coming out against Trump is the latest example of this establishment showing how threatened it is by him. But by calling him incompetent, these people only reinforce the low regard they have for voters. They insult people by telling them they're being bamboozeled by Trump. People are smarter than that. They like Trump because he flies in the face of the McCains, Romneys, Bush's, Boehners, Clintons, Obamas, etc. I don't believe he's an idiot. He certainly seems plenty intellegent when compared to these politicians. What he or anyone else says in a debate is of little consequence.
• queencitybuckeye

  like_that;1784652 wrote:I'm referring to the performance. Anybody can have a nice resume, but how well did they actually perform?

  At this point, what difference does it make?
• QuakerOats

  ptown_trojans_1;1784598 wrote:So many lies and false statements by Trump...sigh.....

  
  When democrats flip/flop it is termed 'evolving'; when R's do it, it is a gotcha lie.
  
  Funny how that works.
• Belly35

  

  ptown_trojans_1;1784617 wrote:Trump is too much of an idiot and a liar.
  Give me what I know.
  Again, the devil I know, rather than the devil I don't.

  This is known as “motivated reasoning.” Whether or not the consistent information is accurate, we might accept it as fact, as confirmation of our beliefs. This makes us more confident in said beliefs, and even less likely to entertain facts that contradict them. –
  
  http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/articles/2010/07/11/how_facts_backfire/?page=2#sthash.nexv55Vm.dpuf
  
  
  Get some big people pants on and start listening to facts about the Hillary...
  PT1 be the Patriot you wanted to be not a nose ring Democrat you've become.
  
  As an American I'm not proud of any of the front runner canidates ... but should it come to Hillary vs Trump
  I"ll take to one without the blood of American Soldiers left behind to die .... Warrior Ethos
• bigkahuna

  QuakerOats;1784660 wrote:When democrats flip/flop it is termed 'evolving'; when R's do it, it is a gotcha lie.
  
  Funny how that works.

  Why do you keep bringing up the democrats in a republican debate/ primary thread. If you want to talk about Hillary flip flopping, go into that thread and do it. Oh wait, you live there.
• ptown_trojans_1

  

  Belly35;1784662 wrote:This is known as “motivated reasoning.” Whether or not the consistent information is accurate, we might accept it as fact, as confirmation of our beliefs. This makes us more confident in said beliefs, and even less likely to entertain facts that contradict them. –
  
  http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/articles/2010/07/11/how_facts_backfire/?page=2#sthash.nexv55Vm.dpuf
  
  
  Get some big people pants on and start listening to facts about the Hillary...
  PT1 be the Patriot you wanted to be not a nose ring Democrat you've become.
  
  As an American I'm not proud of any of the front runner canidates ... but should it come to Hillary vs Trump
  I"ll take to one without the blood of American Soldiers left behind to die .... Warrior Ethos

  So if a complete idiot, buffoon, and guy who said he would want to kill the families of terrorists, and wants to start trade wars gets elected over someone who, sadly, oversaw the death of 4 Americans, that's ok to you?
  
  With Clinton, we know want we get.
  With Trump, we all be dead in 2 years from a nuclear winter, we don't know.
  He is so unpredictable, so brash, so insane, that honestly, he is more a threat than Clinton.
  
  You say Warrior Ethos, but look man, if Trump is elected, Hayden even said, some in the military may not follow his orders.
  The dude is straight crazy. And everything he said about foreign policy last night was wrong. Everything. He says false statements and lies.
  
  That is more a threat than Hilliary.
• like_that

  

  ptown_trojans_1;1784671 wrote:So if a complete idiot, buffoon, and guy who said he would want to kill the families of terrorists, and wants to start trade wars gets elected over someone who, sadly, oversaw the death of 4 Americans, that's ok to you?
  
  With Clinton, we know want we get.
  With Trump, we all be dead in 2 years from a nuclear winter, we don't know.
  He is so unpredictable, so brash, so insane, that honestly, he is more a threat than Clinton.
  
  You say Warrior Ethos, but look man, if Trump is elected, Hayden even said, some in the military may not follow his orders.
  The dude is straight crazy. And everything he said about foreign policy last night was wrong. Everything. He says false statements and lies.
  
  That is more a threat than Hilliary.

  You know that's not going to happen. Extremely unlikely. That's why we have checks and balances. Likely worst case is we are gridlocked for another 4 years.
  
  I am by no means defending trump, but I do find it hilarious (hypocritical) that the left mocks the right for the "sky is falling" narrative for particular candidates, yet the left does the same exact thing for the republican candidates (OMG insert candidate is racist and is going to strip every women's right to have sex!!!). You got your panties in a bunch numerous times over Quaker's hyperbole, but you're spewing your shit in your own hyperbolic chamber.
  
  And again with Hillary we have no idea what we will get because she hasn't been truthful and consistent with her thoughts for over 20 years.
• gut

  Dr Winston O'Boogie;1784658 wrote:But by calling him incompetent, these people only reinforce the low regard they have for voters. They insult people by telling them they're being bamboozeled by Trump. People are smarter than that.

  I disagree. Trump is pandering to the lowest common denominator. Just because you are unhappy with your choices or the establishment doesn't mean you throw support behind a bozo likely to be a disaster.
  
  IMO, Rand Paul is the closest to "the guy" most people want, at least the ones voting for Trump. Or Gary Johnson who can't even get on a stage.
  
  And I cringe, somewhat, at all the bashing of the "establishment". There are plenty of "establishment" characters with a history of getting things done. In a diverse country, no one gets everything they want. Compromise is both necessary and fair in that regard...but "compromising" is now derided as "establishment". Yeah, the voters are pretty dumb.
• Dr Winston O'Boogie

  

  gut;1784677 wrote:I disagree. Trump is pandering to the lowest common denominator. Just because you are unhappy with your choices or the establishment doesn't mean you throw support behind a bozo likely to be a disaster.
  
  IMO, Rand Paul is the closest to "the guy" most people want, at least the ones voting for Trump. Or Gary Johnson who can't even get on a stage.
  
  And I cringe, somewhat, at all the bashing of the "establishment". There are plenty of "establishment" characters with a history of getting things done. In a diverse country, no one gets everything they want. Compromise is both necessary and fair in that regard...but "compromising" is now derided as "establishment". Yeah, the voters are pretty dumb.

  Rand Paul's libertarian angle doesn't work - at least not for him. Like it or not, he doesn't have any appeal. Selective compromise in pursuit of ideals is one thing, compromising on every single thing of the purposes of keeping the party line and one's own kiester in DC is another. People like McCain and Boehner and Harry Reid - great compromisers of our time - stand for nothing, accomplish nothing that forwards our country or makes it great.
  
  Thinking voters are dumb is arrogant and costly. Romney did it in 2008, Hillary did it in 2008, McCain did it in 2004, etc. When you start thinking everyone is stupid, you've lost the plot.
• gut

  Dr Winston O'Boogie;1784681 wrote: Thinking voters are dumb is arrogant and costly. Romney did it in 2008, Hillary did it in 2008, McCain did it in 2004, etc. When you start thinking everyone is stupid, you've lost the plot.

  They may not be stupid (although surely almost half of them are), but they are most definitely ignorant. The reason money matters so much in elections is you basically have to bombard voters with 30 second ad spots that hit on something they want and convinces them you have the solution. And that's for many that are actually making a choice rather than blindly pulling the lever for 'D' or 'R'.
  
  From the media to our politicians...the state of public discourse is, at its foundation, due to a lazy and ignorant electorate.
• Fab4Runner

  

  Dr Winston O'Boogie;1784681 wrote:Rand Paul's libertarian angle doesn't work - at least not for him. Like it or not, he doesn't have any appeal. Selective compromise in pursuit of ideals is one thing, compromising on every single thing of the purposes of keeping the party line and one's own kiester in DC is another. People like McCain and Boehner and Harry Reid - great compromisers of our time - stand for nothing, accomplish nothing that forwards our country or makes it great.
  
  Thinking voters are dumb is arrogant and costly. Romney did it in 2008, Hillary did it in 2008, McCain did it in 2004, etc. When you start thinking everyone is stupid, you've lost the plot.

  But if you support Trump, you are dumb and stupid.
• gut

  Fab4Runner;1784685 wrote:But if you support Trump, you are dumb and stupid.

  I mean, if its' just an anti-establishment movement, why did Trump get so much more support than Fiorina or Carson? It's purely "charisma", because it certainly isn't more detailed policy or crazier or less crazy ideas. So it's not based on substance, and it's not purely anti-establishment. I really think it comes down to being a bully - which many people mistake for strength and leadership - and being a celebrity.
  
  Unless these backers are going to disappear in the general, I think it's highly irresponsible to take a protest vote all the way to electing a clown with 3rd grade insults.
• Fab4Runner

  

  gut;1784687 wrote:I mean, if its' just an anti-establishment movement, why did Trump get so much more support than Fiorina or Carson? It's purely "charisma", because it certainly isn't more detailed policy or crazier or less crazy ideas. So it's not based on substance, and it's not purely anti-establishment. I really think it comes down to being a bully - which many people mistake for strength and leadership - and being a celebrity.
  
  Unless these backers are going to disappear in the general, I think it's highly irresponsible to take a protest vote all the way to electing a clown with 3rd grade insults.

  I have no idea why anyone would support him. I do not know anyone in my actual, real life who does. My large family is fairly conservative, and I come from a conservative town/area. I do not personally know a single person who is voting for Trump. I see people on Facebook who seem to like him, but they are the same ones who share Onion articles because they think they are real. So in my experience, if you support Trump, you are dumb and stupid.
• Al Bundy

  Fab4Runner;1784689 wrote:I have no idea why anyone would support him. I do not know anyone in my actual, real life who does. My large family is fairly conservative, and I come from a conservative town/area. I do not personally know a single person who is voting for Trump. I see people on Facebook who seem to like him, but they are the same ones who share Onion articles because they think they are real. So in my experience, if you support Trump, you are dumb and stupid.

  You must hang around with a bunch of lightweights and losers
• Dr Winston O'Boogie

  

  Fab4Runner;1784689 wrote:I have no idea why anyone would support him. I do not know anyone in my actual, real life who does. My large family is fairly conservative, and I come from a conservative town/area. I do not personally know a single person who is voting for Trump. I see people on Facebook who seem to like him, but they are the same ones who share Onion articles because they think they are real. So in my experience, if you support Trump, you are dumb and stupid.

  
  If this is what you think, I don't believe you will understand his appeal.
• Fab4Runner

  

  Dr Winston O'Boogie;1784703 wrote:If this is what you think, I don't believe you will understand his appeal.

  It is exactly what I think, and no, I will never understand it.
• gut

  Dr Winston O'Boogie;1784703 wrote:If this is what you think, I don't believe you will understand his appeal.

  His appeal is to the lowest common denominator. Fiorina was just as tough in the debates, and isn't low-brow or crude. Never sniffed even 1/3 of his support at her peak.
  
  A good chunk of America still loves a bully...always has. And a bully is kind of the opposite of a statesman. There is absolutely no substance behind Trump or his policies. He responds to every tough question with a juvenile personal attack. How does an intelligent person see that and think "THAT's my guy!"?
• sleeper

  

  gut;1784710 wrote:His appeal is to the lowest common denominator. Fiorina was just as tough in the debates, and isn't low-brow or crude. Never sniffed even 1/3 of his support at her peak.
  
  A good chunk of America still loves a bully...always has. And a bully is kind of the opposite of a statesman. There is absolutely no substance behind Trump or his policies. He responds to every tough question with a juvenile personal attack. How does an intelligent person see that and think "THAT's my guy!"?

  No one I know supports Trump so that correlates well since I don't know or care about trash/poor people.
• gut

  sleeper;1784712 wrote:No one I know supports Trump so that correlates well since I don't know or care about trash/poor people.

  Maybe if it's Trump vs. Hillary the Koch brothers (libertarians) get behind Gary Johnson and things get interesting.
• SportsAndLady

  

  gut;1784718 wrote:Maybe if it's Trump vs. Hillary the Koch brothers (libertarians) get behind Gary Johnson and things get interesting.

  Gary Johnson.
  
  A name you hear every election but literally no one supports. I lol every time I hear his name.