Archive

Can we just shut the government down already?

  • Glory Days
    jmog;1511096 wrote:No offense, while I'm not happy about the shutdown, national parks are a minor point when compared to the current debt, deficit, reckless spending, and the ACA.
    oh no offense taken, it was just the first thing that came to mind where public sector and private sector jobs don't equate.
  • Glory Days
    http://mashable.com/2013/10/01/obamacare-jimmy-kimmel/
  • O-Trap
    This is so much like one of those Mark Dice videos, where he asks the public ludicrous questions to demonstrate the ignorance of conventional wisdom in modernity.
  • gut
    A lot of this is of the Dems own doing...We have rarely seen a minority party so ignored and run-over as in 2009-10. And I can't remember more vile, divisive rhetoric coming from the SML, Speaker and Potus as with Reid, Pelosi, and Obama.

    The congressional struggles truly reflect a very divided electorate. That is perhaps not coincidental with how Reid, Pelosi and Obama chose - and continue to choose - to play the game.

    Repubs absolutely got their asses handed to them - deservedly so - in 2006 and 2008. It took about 12 months for the Dems to piss that away.
  • gut
    Glory Days;1511095 wrote:when does 40% of any workforce go on vacation at the same time?
    Auto industry. Twice a year usually.
  • Glory Days
    gut;1511149 wrote:Auto industry. Twice a year usually.
    yeah, that's a fair comparison. a few new cars weren't made is equal to government services being provided.... more federal employees didn't go to work yesterday than everyone employed by the auto industry combined. fail.
  • Glory Days
    The National Institute of Health is pretty much shutdown. They aren't accepting new patients. so several hundred people a week are not receiving new methods of cancer treatment etc.
  • queencitybuckeye
    Glory Days;1511166 wrote:more federal employees didn't go to work yesterday than everyone employed by the auto industry combined. fail.
    The fail is if your statement is accurate. Way too many people digging holes and filling them in, way too few people doing productive work.
  • Raw Dawgin' it
    Traffic was great today, thanks government!
  • BoatShoes
    gut;1511148 wrote:A lot of this is of the Dems own doing...We have rarely seen a minority party so ignored and run-over as in 2009-10. And I can't remember more vile, divisive rhetoric coming from the SML, Speaker and Potus as with Reid, Pelosi, and Obama.

    The congressional struggles truly reflect a very divided electorate. That is perhaps not coincidental with how Reid, Pelosi and Obama chose - and continue to choose - to play the game.

    Repubs absolutely got their asses handed to them - deservedly so - in 2006 and 2008. It took about 12 months for the Dems to piss that away.
    Indeed...they ran right over the Republicans by proposing the very healthcare proposal Romney and Co. would've produced had he won in 08....a healthcare proposal with tax credits for purchasing individual health insurance from private health insurance companies in competitive marketplaces just like McCain proposed.

    Again....just look at when President Bush signed into law the massive expansion of socialism....Medicare Part D...an actual socialist program with no funding whatsoever....not a single conservative declared the end of the country....no conservatives were willing to defund the government or breach the limit on tsy securities....and that was an actual socialist program expansion. Obummercare is waaay more conservative than Medicare Part D and the talk radio crowd has lost their minds. Yet, support for W was above 90% by those who call themselves "very conservative" throughout his presidency despite actual unfunded socialist expansions of the welfare state.

    Obama wasted a year trying to cajole Republicans to adopt a plan they invented and a plan copied from the guy they nominated for President in 2012. They were and are not capable of being reasoned with so long as the negotiating partner is the Kenyan Socialist.
  • Con_Alma
    I don't understand why all of the issues. Both branches are actually doing their jobs right now. The Legislative branch has no obligations to fund this at all.

    My understanding is that 3 federal government funding bills were drafted by the Republican Party recently. I can't find how many have been drafted by the respective Democrats. If the President doesn't want to sign such legislation...that's certainly his prerogative.
  • BoatShoes
    queencitybuckeye;1511168 wrote:The fail is if your statement is accurate. Way too many people digging holes and filling them in, way too few people doing productive work.
    What do you consider "productive work". It is silly to me that there's this broad assumption that work done out of public purpose is always unproductive make-work while all private sector work is "productive".

    Water Sommeliers, Massage Therapists who give HJ's, Porno Fluffers, Stock Photo Models, Porn Stars, Bartenders, Personal assistants and on and on....these are all paid by the private sector and seems to me would fail to meet this standard of "productive work" that people use when they apply it to public sector employees IMHO.

    Any work that makes somebody better off in their own subjective minds is productive. If a corporation feels that a certain seemingly benign personal service will make its shareholders better off, that work is productive. If Congress and our agents in the executive branch feel a seemingly benign personal service will make the public better off, that work is productive on the same standard.
  • Con_Alma
    BoatShoes;1511212 wrote:... It is silly to me that there's this broad assumption that work done out of public purpose is always unproductive make-work while all private sector work is "productive".
    ...
    What evidence do you find that makes you so certain that such a broad assumption exists?
  • BoatShoes
    Con_Alma;1511214 wrote:What evidence do you find that makes you so certain that such a broad assumption exists?
    Read QCB's post. Gut and others have expressed similar sentiments as well.

    Any of our conservatives here care to chime in on how there's all this bloat in the federal government with people doing unproductive work so Con_Alma can see what I'm talking about?
  • Con_Alma
    I did read his post. It's hardly concrete evidence that he believes that work done out of public purpose is "always" unproductive while "all" private sector work is "productive".
  • BoatShoes
    Con_Alma;1511220 wrote:I did read his post. It's hardly concrete evidence that he believes that work done out of public purpose is "always" unproductive while "all" private sector work is "productive".

    You take message board posts too literally. Hope this helps.
  • Con_Alma
    BoatShoes;1511224 wrote:You take message board posts too literally. Hope this helps.
    I cant read your mind. I can only go by the words you use to communicate.

    If always and all weren't reflective of what you believed or the point you were trying to make then why use them?
  • BoatShoes
    Con_Alma;1511225 wrote:I cant read your mind. I can only go by the words you use to communicate.

    If always and all weren't reflective of what you believed or the point you were trying to make then why use them?

    This is not a symposium on boolean logic. If you didn't understand the connotation in the context of menial banter on a message board then I am sorry for your lack of familiarity with modern social conventions and the like. People speak in generalities in casual speech and I am sorry that this concept is foreign to you.

    BTW my sympthathies for not getting to be able to watch your beloved socialist football team representing the Naval Academy battle the socialist football team from the Air Force Academy due to Republicans being upset over losing last fall.
  • Con_Alma
    Speaking in generalities is* one thing. Holding another accountable when using such general statements but not expecting yourself to be held in the same light is another thing all together.

    In an effort to give you the benefit of the doubt I asked for clarification of your general speak in hopes you weren't being hypocritical.

    I acknowledge your sympathy regarding academy football possibly being suspended. I have none for the potential decision that will formally be made on Thursday this week regarding such contests. Priorities always are able to be put into place when forced to do so. There are more important things going on at the Yard than a football game. I will never overlook that.
  • queencitybuckeye
    BoatShoes;1511228 wrote:This is not a symposium on boolean logic. If you didn't understand the connotation in the context of menial banter on a message board then I am sorry for your lack of familiarity with modern social conventions and the like. People speak in generalities in casual speech and I am sorry that this concept is foreign to you.

    BTW my sympthathies for not getting to be able to watch your beloved socialist football team representing the Naval Academy battle the socialist football team from the Air Force Academy due to Republicans being upset over losing last fall.

    IOW, your use of the English language is dreadful. Yes, we already know that.

    To go back to your poorly-worded "point", there have been any number of studies showing conclusively that as a whole (note: not "always"), private sector workers are far more efficient than their public sector counterparts. Feel free to use any popular search engine to find these studies.

    BTW. a really good bartender is worth his/her weight in gold, and easily meets the definition of productive.
  • BoatShoes
    But let's recap anyways.

    No Child Left Behind creates federal socialist intervention into local public schools, Medicare Part D creates massive unfunded expansion of largest socialist program in America, Creation of Department of Homeland Security massive expands federal, socialist control over citizens to the point of groping them at the airport.

    What do the Constitutionalist, So-Called "Fiscal Conservatives" do??? "Well...you know Boat those things I didn't really support by Bush either...." Lip Service with nevertheless unquestioned support. No filibusters, No shut downs, no chicken with the so-called "debt ceiling".

    Obama enacts RomneyCare/HeritageCare/NewtCare and provides tax credits for people to get individualized health insurance....partly moving health insurance away from being employer-based for workers who don't have access to group plans...a goal of conservatives for years and what do they do???

    "Shut Down teh Gubmint!!! Socialism!!! End of Health Care as we know it!!!"
  • BoatShoes
    queencitybuckeye;1511237 wrote:IOW, your use of the English language is dreadful. Yes, we already know that.

    To go back to your poorly-worded "point", there have been any number of studies showing conclusively that as a whole (note: not "always"), private sector workers are far more efficient that their public sector counterparts. Feel free to use any popular search engine to find these studies.
    Your derpy and unnecessary insults when you knew what I meant aside...efficiency/less efficiency and saying work is "not productive" and amounts to digging holes and re-filling them are not the same thing.

    It is one thing to say a department of justice lawyer doesn't work as efficiently as lawyer at a Big Law firm. It is entirely different to say the work of a Department of Justice lawyer amounts to unproductive work whereas the work of a private sector lawyer is.
  • Con_Alma
    BoatShoes;1511238 wrote:...

    What do the Constitutionalist, So-Called "Fiscal Conservatives" do??? "Well...you know Boat those things I didn't really support by Bush either...." Lip Service with nevertheless unquestioned support. No filibusters, No shut downs, no chicken with the so-called "debt ceiling".

    Obama enacts RomneyCare/HeritageCare/NewtCare and provides tax credits for people to get individualized health insurance....partly moving health insurance away from being employer-based for workers who don't have access to group plans...a goal of conservatives for years and what do they do???

    "Shut Down teh Gubmint!!! Socialism!!! End of Health Care as we know it!!!"
    Do you not ackowledge the options provided for the President to not shut the governemnt down? Did he not have such a choice?
  • Con_Alma
    BoatShoes;1511242 wrote:...

    It is one thing to say a department of justice lawyer doesn't work as efficiently as lawyer at a Big Law firm. It is entirely different to say the work of a Department of Justice lawyer amounts to unproductive work whereas the work of a private sector lawyer is.
    ...and yet this was not what was stated. His post was no more general than your exaggerated, general statement in criticism.
  • BoatShoes
    Con_Alma;1511243 wrote:Do you not ackowledge the options provided for the President to not shut the governemnt down? Did he not have such a choice?
    Indeed...the President could acquiesce to all of the House Republican's totally unprecedented demands and fund the government. Even better...House Republicans should just demand that the President resign in order for them to pass a funding bill and Obama could certainly go along with that too! After all, it's in the best interest of the country for Obama not to be President and they couldn't make that in an election! : thumbup: