2013 Random NFL Chatter

• SportsAndLady

  

  robj55;1538529 wrote:Okay, so if the ball is like 30 yards overthrown the hold superceeds the play regardless?

  Defensive holding is defensive holding. You're thinking of pass interference, where the ball has to be catchable.
  
  Shouldn't have been at the 1 yard line, but it definitely should have been half the distance and an untimed down.
• Big_Mirg_ZHS

  

  I do love how you can hear the panthers celebrating in the background during the hoodies press conference
• Ironman92

  

  So because it was uncatchable.....like the opposite of the extreme overthrow?
• robj55

  

  SportsAndLady;1538530 wrote:Defensive holding is defensive holding. You're thinking of pass interference, where the ball has to be catchable.
  
  Shouldn't have been at the 1 yard line, but it definitely should have been half the distance and an untimed down.

  Okay thanks for clarifying.
• SportsAndLady

  

  Big_Mirg_ZHS;1538531 wrote:I do love how you can hear the panthers celebrating in the background during the hoodies press conference

  The reporters are so annoying
• se-alum

  

  Refs had to think the holding occurred after the ball was released.
• SportsAndLady

  

  Those refs have to get in trouble for this.
  
  Refs can't just throw a flag when they see something, but because of how big the call would be, take it back.
• mucalum49

  

  Just to play devil's advocate. If they rightfully called the leg whip on the Pats offensive lineman earlier in the game do you think they still score a TD on that drive in the 3rd quarter which led to all of this?
  
  I think if they were going for a holding call then yes untimed down at the 7. But did the ref who threw the flag call PI? If so then the refs statement after the game explains the NFL rule of how PI is invalidated if it's called as a defender is intercepting. Not sure I follow but apparently it's a rule.
  
  None of this excuses the fact they didn't explain it on the field.
• SportsAndLady

  

  mucalum49;1538622 wrote:Just to play devil's advocate. If they rightfully called the leg whip on the Pats offensive lineman earlier in the game do you think they still score a TD on that drive in the 3rd quarter which led to all of this?
  
  I think if they were going for a holding call then yes untimed down at the 7. But did the ref who threw the flag call PI? If so then the refs statement after the game explains the NFL rule of how PI is invalidated if it's called as a defender is intercepting. Not sure I follow but apparently it's a rule.
  
  None of this excuses the fact they didn't explain it on the field.

  Lol come on..
  
  (I know you're a Panthers fan, but..)
• mucalum49

  

  I'm a fan as I live in the city but it's just a devils advocate situation. Going from 1st and 10 on the 43 to a 1st and 25 on the NE 16 yard line. They could have very well scored but extra time comes off the clock. Or Brady has to throw further than 3 yard dump passes and makes a mistake. That call changes the game just like the last one. Bad calls on both sides.
  
  I don't disagree that if the ref called holding at the end it's an untimed down at the 7. But if its PI then whatever that jacked up rule about PI on interceptions comes into play. Sometimes you don't know a rule sucks till it gets magnified in a situation like this. I'm sure if the NFL feels that it was that big a deal they will make a change to it in the offseason.
• wildcats20

  

  It seems like a lot of football people are agreeing with the call.
• Gblock

  looked like a terrible pass into triple coverage and then looking to get bailed out to me
• mucalum49

  

  wildcats20;1538646 wrote:It seems like a lot of football people are agreeing with the call.

  I think this link does a good job breaking it down.
  
  http://espn.go.com/blog/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4753409/fascinating-battle-clouded-by-confusing-end
  
  Since the ref called pass interference they determined this rule came into play (whether you agree or not).
  
  [h=5]Rule 8, Section 5, Article 3 Permissible Acts[/h]Article 3 Permissible Acts by both teams while the ball is in the air. Acts that are permissible by a player include, but are not limited to:(c) Contact that would normally be considered pass interference, but the pass is clearly uncatchable by the involved players, except as specified in 8-3-2 and 8-5-4 pertaining to blocking downfield by the offense.
• thavoice

  wildcats20;1538646 wrote:It seems like a lot of football people are agreeing with the call.

  I have only heard/seen former players/coaches DISAGREE with that call.
  
  I thought the PI on the sideline was just as much, or more, uncatchable, earlier on that drive than this play.
  
  It was a penalty. If not held Gronk has a chance to come back to the ball and who knows what happens....hits the defender and the ball tips in the air.
  
  Who knows.
• Classyposter58

  

  Refs are pussies is all. Seriously they do not want to call anything late in close game, players should just play with pure recklessness in those moments
• Laley23

  

  
• thavoice

  Laley23;1538746 wrote:

  This is my beef with it last night. A ref threw a flag because he saw a penalty. Then they picked it up. Not at all uncommon, but in the case last night it WAS a penalty. That is I think most people's beef. If they had not thrown a flag....eh...shit happens, but he saw the penalty, threw the flag, and then gave some BS reason.
  
  
  As far as that picture. Eh, who is to say that cost anyone the game? That looks familiar...James Harrision with the steelers got tied up all the time like that with no calls.
• Laley23

  

  thavoice;1538749 wrote:This is my beef with it last night. A ref threw a flag because he saw a penalty. Then they picked it up. Not at all uncommon, but in the case last night it WAS a penalty. That is I think most people's beef. If they had not thrown a flag....eh...shit happens, but he saw the penalty, threw the flag, and then gave some BS reason.
  
  
  As far as that picture. Eh, who is to say that cost anyone the game? That looks familiar...James Harrision with the steelers got tied up all the time like that with no calls.

  Lol. that wouldve have been a holding on the Pats...the semi-hail mary to Thompkins doesnt count. Pats lose. What are you talking about??? It was the final play of that game...
  
  As for the 1st point, they called PI I thought? In that case, it was then ruled uncatchable because it was undercut by a defender and intercepted. Lots of analysts and people who know the rules a lot better than you or I agreed with the call.
• thavoice

  Laley23;1538753 wrote:Lol. that wouldve have been a holding on the Pats...the semi-hail mary to Thompkins doesnt count. Pats lose. What are you talking about??? It was the final play of that game...
  
  As for the 1st point, they called PI I thought? In that case, it was then ruled uncatchable because it was undercut by a defender and intercepted. Lots of analysts and people who know the rules a lot better than you or I agreed with the call.

  I had no idea what that play was from, sorry dude.
  
  Golic, Gruden, Carter and more were saying it was a bad call. Those who I have heard agree with it are the officials type who are standing up for their buddies, but I imagine you have more examples.
  
  Thing is..you see PI/Holding called on DB's all the time, and many times it isnt near the actual throw or anything like that. Usually uncatchable is something that is totally obvious. To me and others I have heard......if he is not held/interfered with he gets to come back to the ball and then who knows at that point. As I said before.....the PI call on the sideline was more uncatchable than this.
• Classyposter58

  

  As a back judge myself, how this was not called PI is insane. His arms were fully wrapped around Gronk but again this is probably my biggest beef with refs, they mostly all freeze up in big situations
• Pick6

  

  They had some former ref on ESPN earlier. When asked if referees always call the game the same, he said something along the lines of "coaches call different plays in certain situations, players play different in certain situations, I think its fair to say that refs call games differently in certain situations"
  
  Dont get me wrong, I love seeing Brady lose, but that's a fucking joke. I cannot stand when refs let players get away with more at the end of the game in basketball and football. A foul is a foul.
• wildcats20

  

  It's not only that, but he basically said the way defensive holding is written in the rule book doesn't matter when calling a game.
• Classyposter58

  

  Pick6;1539137 wrote:They had some former ref on ESPN earlier. When asked if referees always call the game the same, he said something along the lines of "coaches call different plays in certain situations, players play different in certain situations, I think its fair to say that refs call games differently in certain situations"
  
  Dont get me wrong, I love seeing Brady lose, but that's a fucking joke. I cannot stand when refs let players get away with more at the end of the game in basketball and football. A foul is a foul.

  Correct. Good example was when late in the 4th on a 2 point conversion, a school down 24-22 went for two. QB throws a total duck and the TE gets popped by the LB way early. I throw the flag and the head referee tried to talk me out of it basically. Asked what happened, and if I was sure twice. It was an obvious call but I saw there personally how scared some of these guys are to make that call, and for these refs with millions of people watching they must be scared shitless to blow the whistle
• Ironman92

  

  I hate that the Panthers just blatantly made a horrible mistake and were bone-headed....but the refs sided with them anyways because the point in the game apparently outweighs obvious penalties
• SportsAndLady

  

  Would the refs have picked up the flag in the same situation/scenario, but IN New England? I don't think so..