Can Science and Religion co exist?
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jmog
Funny you should talk about broken logic when you use more logical fallacies in your statements/arguments about religion than anyone on such threads. It is actually comical to see you talk about logic and reason in the same post that you completely fail at a logical argument.sleeper;1612951 wrote:Do you ever get tired of defending the multitude of broken logic and outlandish stories to justify your erroneous indoctrinated belief system? When are you going to grow up and accept that your entire beliefs are made up to swindle money and influence from you and your children? -
Heretic
Yes. Many so-called prophet-types make outlandish claims to give their words more credence amongst the masses. Such as Oral Roberts and his "if you don't send me a shit ton of money, God is taking me away!!!!" bullshit.jmog;1612946 wrote:Would Catholicism have spread so fast if not for Constantine? Obviously no.
Does that mean that it is all made up and that Constantine is the one that officially proclaimed Christ's deity? Obviously no.
Unless you are referring to him being the first politician of a major government to do so, then I can see that comment as being true. But the way it sounds to some people is that you meant that Christ wasn't discussed as being a deity before Constantine at all, while his followers had proclaimed it from the beginning (as well as JC himself). -
sleeper
Do we need to talk about the bible again? For being a book about the history of the people of the god Jesus, it sure has a lot of metaphors that were once stories but then became metaphors when any reasonable person with a 3rd grade education can point out its flaws. Please tell me again about the baby dinosaurs on Noah's Ark.jmog;1612956 wrote:Funny you should talk about broken logic when you use more logical fallacies in your statements/arguments about religion than anyone on such threads. It is actually comical to see you talk about logic and reason in the same post that you completely fail at a logical argument. -
jmog
Please display one logical or scientific proof that said instance was impossible? If not you are just back to illogical banter.sleeper;1612966 wrote:Do we need to talk about the bible again? For being a book about the history of the people of the god Jesus, it sure has a lot of metaphors that were once stories but then became metaphors when any reasonable person with a 3rd grade education can point out its flaws. Please tell me again about the baby dinosaurs on Noah's Ark. -
Heretic
So, essentially, if you can't 100% prove something DIDN'T happen, it's illogical banter; but when you can't prove 100% it DID happen, it's something completely else? Or, otherwise, you're being as "illogical" as he is.
Kudos to you for such a well-thought-out "heads I win, tails you lose" argument. AKA: The cornerstone of faith. -
sleeper
It's impossible to hold over 10 billion species on any ship ever built much less 2 of each species on a ship built thousands of years ago by a family. Where is the ship? Did it sink to the bottom of the Ocean or did Noah burn it?jmog;1613007 wrote:Please display one logical or scientific proof that said instance was impossible? If not you are just back to illogical banter.
You're such a child. Grow up. -
dlazz
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to sleeper again.sleeper;1613014 wrote:It's impossible to hold over 10 billion species on any ship ever built much less 2 of each species on a ship built thousands of years ago by a family. Where is the ship? Did it sink to the bottom of the Ocean or did Noah burn it?
You're such a child. Grow up. -
WebFire
Sorry, but this.Heretic;1613012 wrote:So, essentially, if you can't 100% prove something DIDN'T happen, it's illogical banter; but when you can't prove 100% it DID happen, it's something completely else? Or, otherwise, you're being as "illogical" as he is.
Kudos to you for such a well-thought-out "heads I win, tails you lose" argument. AKA: The cornerstone of faith. -
jmog
Actually I never said that at all, you should read what I actually said before making such statements.Heretic;1613012 wrote:So, essentially, if you can't 100% prove something DIDN'T happen, it's illogical banter; but when you can't prove 100% it DID happen, it's something completely else? Or, otherwise, you're being as "illogical" as he is.
Kudos to you for such a well-thought-out "heads I win, tails you lose" argument. AKA: The cornerstone of faith.
I said he uses a bunch of logical fallacies in his statements surrounding religion, which is true.
His retort was "tell me more about dinosaurs on the ark".
My statement was show me proof that this did NOT happen.
That is a statement basically saying "prove that it didn't happen and then you are correct, I am being illogical and irrational in believing that it did". I did not say one time that his belief system is illogical or irrational, I am stating that his statements are. He is the one (along with you) that are saying that a given belief system is irrational/illogical with no logical or scientific proof behind such statements.
So, in essence, kudos to you for such well-thought out statements...or lack there of since you just read into what I said what you wanted instead of ACTUALLY reading what I said. But, you just fell right in line with Sleeper and Boatshoes into huge illogical leaps with respect to someone else's statements that don't hold water. -
jmog
1. If the story did happen, there was never stated and never needed 2 of every single species that we currently know exist. This is quite hilarious especially with your full believe in cell to human evolution. You should KNOW that with your belief system that one could get away with a small fraction of the species that currently exist and given time with micro evolution, selective breeding, natural selection, etc you end up with millions of species EASILY from a small fraction of species.sleeper;1613014 wrote:It's impossible to hold over 10 billion species on any ship ever built much less 2 of each species on a ship built thousands of years ago by a family. Where is the ship? Did it sink to the bottom of the Ocean or did Noah burn it?
You're such a child. Grow up.
2. Where is it? Wood rots/decays does it not? I mean seriously, where are the Nina/Pinta/Santa Maria that Columbus came across the Atlantic on? Not a single one of their locations are known, does that mean they didn't exist? I mean seriously, a ship, if it existed some 5000-6000 years ago, would not physically exist today due to natural decay, that is quite an obvious conclusion that you neglect to think about. I mean sure there are "zealots" who say they have found it in the mountains of Turkey (where the Bible says it landed) and have video/physical evidence of it there, but I'm not sold to be honest. All you have to do is look on google/youtube for "Noah's Ark found" and you'll see plenty of zealots and their archaeological expeditions. But like I said, I am not sold on the idea that they found THE Noah's Ark.
And your one statement made as a joke is QUITE possible. Think about it, if the story is real, even if it wasn't a global flood, just a local flood (local to the middle east), wherever Noah landed it would take some time for plants to grow once again. Therefore there would be no trees immediately available, so why wouldn't he have broken up most of the boat for firewood for both heat at night and to cook? -
sleeper
Or we could just ignore all of this and question why an all powerful god needed to bother with having a human do his work. He could have just wiped out all humans and created everyone from scratch in less than .00000000000000001 seconds.jmog;1613071 wrote:1. If the story did happen, there was never stated and never needed 2 of every single species that we currently know exist. This is quite hilarious especially with your full believe in cell to human evolution. You should KNOW that with your belief system that one could get away with a small fraction of the species that currently exist and given time with micro evolution, selective breeding, natural selection, etc you end up with millions of species EASILY from a small fraction of species.
2. Where is it? Wood rots/decays does it not? I mean seriously, where are the Nina/Pinta/Santa Maria that Columbus came across the Atlantic on? Not a single one of their locations are known, does that mean they didn't exist? I mean seriously, a ship, if it existed some 5000-6000 years ago, would not physically exist today due to natural decay, that is quite an obvious conclusion that you neglect to think about. I mean sure there are "zealots" who say they have found it in the mountains of Turkey (where the Bible says it landed) and have video/physical evidence of it there, but I'm not sold to be honest. All you have to do is look on google/youtube for "Noah's Ark found" and you'll see plenty of zealots and their archaeological expeditions. But like I said, I am not sold on the idea that they found THE Noah's Ark.
And your one statement made as a joke is QUITE possible. Think about it, if the story is real, even if it wasn't a global flood, just a local flood (local to the middle east), wherever Noah landed it would take some time for plants to grow once again. Therefore there would be no trees immediately available, so why wouldn't he have broken up most of the boat for firewood for both heat at night and to cook?
The amount of rationalization that it takes to cover 1 segment of a bible full of complete bullcrap is incredible. -
Devils Advocate
jmog;1613071 wrote:
wherever Noah landed it would take some time for plants to grow once again. Therefore there would be no trees immediately available, so why wouldn't he have broken up most of the boat for firewood for both heat at night and to cook?
What the hell is he supposed to cook? There were no plants....... Hmmmmmm. There you goo sleeper. If he was not going to answer your question. I will.jmog;1613071 wrote:
so why wouldn't he have broken up most of the boat for firewood for both heat at night and to cook?
Noah either ate the dinosaurs, or many a species of Gods earth were soon extinct from being eaten by Noah, -
jmog
The food they had on the ark, what, you think they didn't store a crap ton of food on the boat if the story is true? Come on...Devils Advocate;1613093 wrote:What the hell is he supposed to cook? There were no plants....... Hmmmmmm. There you goo sleeper. If he was not going to answer your question. I will.
Noah either ate the dinosaurs, or many a species of Gods earth were soon extinct from being eaten by Noah, -
dlazz
So you admit doubt in the ark story?jmog;1613119 wrote: if the story is true? -
jmog
Giving scenarios as in "if this or if that" is not the same as admitting doubt.dlazz;1613120 wrote:So you admit doubt in the ark story? -
sleeper
So did it happen or did it not happen?jmog;1613130 wrote:Giving scenarios as in "if this or if that" is not the same as admitting doubt. -
dlazz
So you admit possible* doubt in the ark? If not, then it's not an 'if' statement since if-then statements are always conditionaljmog;1613130 wrote:Giving scenarios as in "if this or if that" is not the same as admitting doubt. -
Devils Advocate
40 days, 40 nights, and 6 months of food for the vegetation to regenerate? What about the carnivores? Did they survive on tofu?jmog;1613119 wrote:The food they had on the ark, what, you think they didn't store a crap ton of food on the boat if the story is true? Come on... -
sleeper
The reality is, it didn't happen. Neither did the virgin birth or the resurrection. These stories are all made up as most of the stories in the bible are.
The only question that needs to be asked is: When are believes going to grow up and stop believing in fairy tales? -
HitsRus
Or we could just question why...in a universe billions of years old...why a creature just a few thousand years evolved from a monkey, could presuppose what a God's agenda is?:RpS_w00t:Or we could just ignore all of this and question why an all powerful god needed to bother with having a human do his work. He could have just wiped out all humans and created everyone from scratch in less than .00000000000000001 seconds. -
sleeper
Tell me more about God's agenda. I'm sure there's a good reason why he created HIV to kill millions of children in Africa every year but my monkey brain can't quite understand because God is from a different universal dimension.HitsRus;1613170 wrote:Or we could just question why...in a universe billions of years old...why a creature just a few thousand years evolved from a monkey, could presuppose what a God's agenda is?:RpS_w00t: -
HitsRus
I have no idea what his agenda might be, but it is pretty obvious human suffering is part of it. Maybe it has something to do with that metaphorical story of a garden, an apple, and a snake......
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sleeper
And someone who has an agenda that involves human suffering should be worshiped?HitsRus;1613214 wrote:I have no idea what his agenda might be, but it is pretty obvious human suffering is part of it. Maybe it has something to do with that metaphorical story of a garden, an apple, and a snake...... -
HitsRus
Someone? Just can 't stop thinking like the evolved monkey you are.
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sleeper
It, someone, does it matter? You aren't fooling anyone with your faux philosophy.HitsRus;1613340 wrote:Someone? Just can 't stop thinking like the evolved monkey you are.