Outside the Lines Report This Morning...

• soup city99

  It was interesting today on Outside the lines how they said the previous athletic director Andy Gieger rated Jim tressel Unsatisfactory in failing to report issues. I believe that year was Giegers last.
• Scooter1369

  

  As usual, the full story is completely missed or intentionally ignored.
  
  2004: ESPN low balls the Big Ten, offering them a fraction of what they should make on tv coverage, and says "take it or leave it". Jim Delaney tells them f*ck off. Anybody else remember what happened that year? The onslaught of coverage against Ohio State, starting with Troy Smith, Sam Maldonado and MoC.
  
  The Big Ten Network kicks off, tapping into ESPN's games. As the BTN grows and becomes more financially sound, ESPN sees the writing on the wall. The Big Ten has started a trend that could be the end of their college football coverage for BCS conferences.
  
  2010: The BTN pays out more to the Big Ten schools than ESPN's contracts ever could have.
  
  Now, Nebraska is in the fold. 4 of the top 5 winningest programs in college football history are in the Big Ten, and soon, the ESPN contract with the conference runs out.
  
  I agree its not personal against Ohio State. Its agianst the whole Big Ten. But its all business. Ohio State is the crown jewel of the Big Ten. So we are the target. If ESPN can attack the conference champs and bring us down, they hope to bring down the Network and avoid having to deal in the future with The PAC10 Network, The Big East Network, The Big XII Network and of course, The GREATEST CONFERENCE IN THE HISTORY OF MODERN MAN SEC NETWORK.
  
  ESPN sees the trends making them irrelevant. Little do they realize, their own actions and efforts will soon see them reduced to covering just the NBA and international soccer.
• enigmaax

  So if ESPN is out to get Ohio State/Big Ten over the TV contract issue, why wouldn't they be doing their own investigating? And what is the motivation of Yahoo and SI? They are in direct competition with ESPN, so why would they want to conspire to bring down the one potential roadblock to ESPN's complete domination of the sports world.
• Gblock

  I m not convinced they have been treated unfairly or singled out more so than other schools. i think that because some are buckeye fans they tend to notice and pay attention more. as far as clarett i think it was kinda a blip on the radar and they kept it moving and werent even tarnished all that much. i thought the coverage of that was probably too lenient. but if they are being singled out dont you think its because unlike all these other schools with infractions, ohio state is the only one with a coach that writes faith based books and part of osu's image through tressel was all about integrity?
• Fab1b

  

  Gblock;856073 wrote:I m not convinced they have been treated unfairly or singled out more so than other schools. i think that because some are buckeye fans they tend to notice and pay attention more. as far as clarett i think it was kinda a blip on the radar and they kept it moving and werent even tarnished all that much. i thought the coverage of that was probably too lenient. but if they are being singled out dont you think its because unlike all these other schools with infractions, ohio state is the only one with a coach that writes faith based books and part of osu's image through tressel was all about integrity?

  
  I watch ESPN daily, I read Yahoo daily and 100% since the 02 title has OSU received way more attention through any of those sources for negative content than anyone!
• Gblock

  Fab1b;856078 wrote:I watch ESPN daily, I read Yahoo daily and 100% since the 02 title has OSU received way more attention through any of those sources for negative content than anyone!

  
  they also in that time period have probably won the most games!
• Writerbuckeye

  

  enigmaax;855973 wrote:So if ESPN is out to get Ohio State/Big Ten over the TV contract issue, why wouldn't they be doing their own investigating? And what is the motivation of Yahoo and SI? They are in direct competition with ESPN, so why would they want to conspire to bring down the one potential roadblock to ESPN's complete domination of the sports world.

  
  ESPN mostly stopped doing its own investigations after the OSU debacle with Clarett. They did have a reporter writing for their magazine and broke that story if you recall. Then a whole slew of allegations followed, many of them by former and disgruntled players. ESPN kept their reporter going after the story, and then the NY Times and a few others joined in.
  
  In the end...OSU received no punishment for any of the allegations made by Clarett. It was a total embarrassment to ESPN after putting all those resources into putting the story together. If you remember, the author of many of those stories was going to write a book, too.
  
  Since then, Clarett has renounced what he said (said he was lying) and we now know it was a lot of made up BS.
  
  If you also remember, ESPN did a lot of the same things that time as this: they talked endlessly about how OSU should face stiff punishment from the NCAA, that JT and Geiger should resign, etc. Hell, they took up half of the Alamo Bowl game talking about this stuff instead of talking about the game in front of them.
  
  They got burned, big time. And I think it was shortly thereafter they stopped trying to be a journalism entity like Yahoo or CNN-SI. They basically stopped doing investigative pieces of any length. Yes, they would send reporters in to do stories on big issues, but after everything was already out there.
  
  In this case, they let others do the legwork for them and they simply re-reported what was found, making headlines and following up with tons of commentary pieces. Then their radio folks jumped on board and did the same.
  
  Bottom line: I think ESPN's brass felt they couldn't afford to do the type of investigative pieces that SI and Yahoo do. It's very specialized and eats up resources for long periods of time without much bang during those times. It can pay off big long-term, but it takes patience, hard work and money.
  
  I don't think they want to expend those things, but they do want to make the Big Ten look bad. So, if they get a chance to use all their commentators to fire away at a target, they do. As they have in this case. Is there a sports media operation out there that has more commentators than ESPN? I don't think so. So they've flooded the airways (TV and radio) and their web site with all the negative stuff that gets dug up; and they put together a couple "original" pieces like OTL that are basically rehashing events, but with some new faces to make it look original.
  
  As for Yahoo and SI: writing about sports IS what they do. And apparently, Yahoo is looking to make a name for itself by doing investigations like this. It's their identity now. So their motivation is simply doing their business as usual. They have no interest in the Big Ten and Ohio State per se, other than it's another story. They have already moved on to other stories, as we've seen.
• FatHobbit

  

  Writerbuckeye;856108 wrote:Since then, Clarett has renounced what he said (said he was lying) and we now know it was a lot of made up BS.

  
  Do we really know what he said was a lot of made up BS? Or did somebody shut him up? I've always felt like he was ready to open a big can of worms and someone either paid him off or threatened him.
  

  Writerbuckeye;856108 wrote:I don't think they want to expend those things, but they do want to make the Big Ten look bad. So, if they get a chance to use all their commentators to fire away at a target, they do..

  They definitely have motivation to slam the BIG and their network any chance they get.
• Scooter1369

  

  Gblock;856073 wrote:I m not convinced they have been treated unfairly or singled out more so than other schools. i think that because some are buckeye fans they tend to notice and pay attention more. as far as clarett i think it was kinda a blip on the radar and they kept it moving and werent even tarnished all that much. i thought the coverage of that was probably too lenient. but if they are being singled out dont you think its because unlike all these other schools with infractions, ohio state is the only one with a coach that writes faith based books and part of osu's image through tressel was all about integrity?

  
  Really?
  
  http://www.theclevelandfan.com/ohio-state-buckeyes/3-buckeye-archive/8452-standing-outside-espns-lines
  

  ESPN can offer up any excuse it wants for the disparity of intensity with which its pursued these two stories, but the only explanation that makes any sense (outside of abject laziness) is bias. ESPN started with a theory about the Buckeyes and is hellbent on either proving it right or at least making sure others share that same unproven theory.

  How do I know? Well, let's start with the fact that it's barely been mentioned by ESPN in any of its formats or the fact that there has been no "Outside the Lines" documentary created to detail it.
  
  But let me advance that notion a giant step forward. I sent a public records request to the University of Oregon media relations department to specifically get a copy of each and every records request that it has received from ESPN since December, 2010 about the Ducks football program.
  
  Two weeks ago came back the answer: two. The first request was a list of all the revenues and expenditures from the athletic department. The second was for a list of anyone who received complimentary sideline passes since 2007. ESPN refined its first request when Oregon sent them back a financial report, by asking for expenditures the athletic department made for recruiting services. Ultimately though that's the extent of their investigation into Oregon.
  
  Contrast that again with the literally volumes of materials they've requested from Ohio State (as ESPN itself acknowledged in the lawsuit against Ohio State) and ask yourself whether ESPN really is being the fair and balanced outlet they claim to be.
  
  For example, while ESPN was acutely interested in every email, text or phone call Jim Tressel or Gordon Gee or Gene Smith ever sent or had , in the material Oregon sent me ESPN didn't even bother to request any such material from Chip Kelly, who the recruiter admitted he had direct contact with, or the athletic director.
  
  There were no requests of Oregon into any internal investigatory materials, including their procedures manual, nor any requests of what Oregon may have sent to the NCAA. These same requests were made of Ohio State and for which Ohio State complied.

• Writerbuckeye

  

  Thanks for the link, Scooter. An excellent review of the crap ESPN is putting out there, along with a nice piece of reporting by the author in comparing public information requests for OSU and Oregon. Those requests are something you don't need to get on a plane to do; and they clearly show the difference in attention to detail when looking at the two cases.
• vball10set

  Because we are THE OSU, we'll continue to be news...the bigger they are, the more they want to see you fall, but we WILL have the last laugh....GO BUCKS!!!
• enigmaax

  Writerbuckeye;856180 wrote:Thanks for the link, Scooter. An excellent review of the crap ESPN is putting out there, along with a nice piece of reporting by the author in comparing public information requests for OSU and Oregon. Those requests are something you don't need to get on a plane to do; and they clearly show the difference in attention to detail when looking at the two cases.

  
  But the details are different. There was no evidence of the same type of cover up at Oregon. The issue there was that the athletic department paid money to a shady recruiting service. So they requested financial records. As for the coach and his involvement, there's already plenty of incriminating evidence out there.
  
  In Ohio State's case, the issue was who knew what and when. There was wild speculation even from OSU fans as to whether or not Tressel did, in fact, enlighten compliance or the administration. Let's just say those folks were right. Do you think the AD was ever going to reveal those emails on his own? You guys want to separate Tressel from the rest of the university now, but the fact is that his actions represented the entity and so the whole university is called into question.
  
  Bottom line, all situations are not the same and that is why they are not treated "equally". Oregon's situation may be much worse, but there isn't a whole lot to wonder about in that case.
  
  Where I agree with you is that a lot of the things that were "dug up" were likely non-issues. Until each of those things was investigated, though, who could've possibly known for sure? I don't blame ESPN, Yahoo, SI, or the Dispatch for looking or even for reporting what they found. I also agree that the spin is sometimes skewed when it comes down to the analysts and what not, but those are just opinions - I don't agree with those guys on a lot of things.
• cats gone wild

  Fab1b;856078 wrote:I watch ESPN daily, I read Yahoo daily and 100% since the 02 title has OSU received way more attention through any of those sources for negative content than anyone!

  
  Then.....stay out of trouble. Simple as that. OSU is a thug college who thinks they dont have to follow the rules.
• OneBuckeye

  

  more shit from ESPN. What a pointless "article."
  
  http://espn.go.com/college-football/preview11/story/_/id/6842618/college-football-preview-jim-delany-mike-slive-form-one-great-rivalries
  

  "This is so much Sun Belt versus Rust Belt, and the best players are in the Sun Belt now," said another college insider who knows both men. "It's made Jim combative, because he knows he can't compete anymore."
  
  There are other areas of conflict, in both style and substance.
  

  When Delany flexed Big Ten muscle last year with a protracted look at expansion that added Nebraska and threatened to alter the makeup of college athletics nationwide, some in the SEC rolled their eyes. They thought he was milking the moment and enjoying the attention he couldn't get from on-field football success. Slive's recent comment on expansion -- "We could get to 16 teams in 15 minutes" -- could be interpreted as a shot.
  
  Delany, a former NCAA investigator, strongly criticized the NCAA's ruling that allowed Auburn quarterback (and SEC standout) Cameron Newton to stay on the field last season after his dad violated rules. SEC officials fumed privately when Delany involved himself in appealing for Ohio State players retaining their eligibility for the Sugar Bowl (and a matchup with the SEC's Arkansas) after NCAA violations.
  

• vball10set

  cats gone wild;856235 wrote:Then.....stay out of trouble. Simple as that. I am a phuckwad who loves to troll OSU boards and elementary schools

  amen to that
• Scooter1369

  

  enigmaax;856224 wrote:But the details are different. There was no evidence of the same type of cover up at Oregon. The issue there was that the athletic department paid money to a shady recruiting service. So they requested financial records. As for the coach and his involvement, there's already plenty of incriminating evidence out there.
  
  In Ohio State's case, the issue was who knew what and when. There was wild speculation even from OSU fans as to whether or not Tressel did, in fact, enlighten compliance or the administration. Let's just say those folks were right. Do you think the AD was ever going to reveal those emails on his own? You guys want to separate Tressel from the rest of the university now, but the fact is that his actions represented the entity and so the whole university is called into question.
  
  Bottom line, all situations are not the same and that is why they are not treated "equally". Oregon's situation may be much worse, but there isn't a whole lot to wonder about in that case.
  
  Where I agree with you is that a lot of the things that were "dug up" were likely non-issues. Until each of those things was investigated, though, who could've possibly known for sure? I don't blame ESPN, Yahoo, SI, or the Dispatch for looking or even for reporting what they found. I also agree that the spin is sometimes skewed when it comes down to the analysts and what not, but those are just opinions - I don't agree with those guys on a lot of things.

  
  You see, that's the point. There is so much smoke over Eugene, Oregon you can't breathe, but ESPN isn't even looking for the fire. But someone got a whiff of cigarette smoke in Columbus and they sent in the cavalry to dig up the out of control blaze.
  
  What Ohio State had was simple. 5 guys got tats, Coach claims to not know about it, apaprently he did, he got fired.
  
  At Oregon, everything wreaks of major NCAA recruiting violations, the coach continues to claim he knows nothing about an violations. Starts off pretty similar doesn't it?
  
  Where is the hard hitting investigation in Eugene? Where is the story? Where are the records requests for emails, phone records, voicemails, office memos? Where is the lawsuit in Oregon Supreme Court?
  
  Where is the investigation into the Alabama program? a local store using current players' autographed jerseys and equipment as a display to bring in customers, huge violations.
  
  Neither school has a story on the front page of ESPN's site, or CFB page. But they run an episode of OTL about GRADUATED PLAYERS SIGNING AUTOGRAPHS. GRADUATED. No eligibility, and they vilify this.
  
  If you don't see the bias, its not because you're blind. Its because you're intentionally facing the other way with your eyes closed.
• FatHobbit

  

  OneBuckeye;856237 wrote:

  Delany, a former NCAA investigator, strongly criticized the NCAA's ruling that allowed Auburn quarterback (and SEC standout) Cameron Newton to stay on the field last season after his dad violated rules. SEC officials fumed privately when Delany involved himself in appealing for Ohio State players retaining their eligibility for the Sugar Bowl (and a matchup with the SEC's Arkansas) after NCAA violations.

  
  I think it was bullshit that Newton got to play, and bullshit the tat5 got to play. They should have started their suspension last year.
• enigmaax

  Scooter1369;856245 wrote:You see, that's the point. There is so much smoke over Eugene, Oregon you can't breathe, but ESPN isn't even looking for the fire. But someone got a whiff of cigarette smoke in Columbus and they sent in the cavalry to dig up the out of control blaze.
  
  What Ohio State had was simple. 5 guys got tats, Coach claims to not know about it, apaprently he did, he got fired.
  
  At Oregon, everything wreaks of major NCAA recruiting violations, the coach continues to claim he knows nothing about an violations. Starts off pretty similar doesn't it?
  
  Where is the hard hitting investigation in Eugene? Where is the story? Where are the records requests for emails, phone records, voicemails, office memos? Where is the lawsuit in Oregon Supreme Court?
  
  Where is the investigation into the Alabama program? a local store using current players' autographed jerseys and equipment as a display to bring in customers, huge violations.
  
  Neither school has a story on the front page of ESPN's site, or CFB page. But they run an episode of OTL about GRADUATED PLAYERS SIGNING AUTOGRAPHS. GRADUATED. No eligibility, and they vilify this.
  
  If you don't see the bias, its not because you're blind. Its because you're intentionally facing the other way with your eyes closed.

  
  Wait, who are you talking about regarding "sending in the cavalry". Yahoo first reported on its investigations of both OSU and Oregon. The Columbus Dispatch and SI followed up with their own investigations of Ohio State. ESPN has largely just re-hashed reports from those sources.
  
  ESPN didn't launch full force on OSU until there were results (you didn't hear about ongoing investigations into the tattoos until the school's announcement of a suspension, right?). Nothing is final in the Oregon or Alabama cases and none of the other mentioned sources have released any new info resulting from their own investigations, so what is there for ESPN to report?
  
  As for the records requests, Oregon provided what ESPN requested. OSU did not. That is why there's no lawsuit. As I've already mentioned, the Oregon situation hasn't even gotten to the NCAA yet so there's no coach-lied-to-the-NCAA-three-times cover up. Again, remember that ESPN didn't request any records from OSU until all the doubt was cast on who really knew and what they knew. Seriously, there were plenty of OSU fans themselves claiming Tressel was falling on his sword for Smith or whoever else. There was a reason to want that information after other shit started coming out at OSU. It isn't the same issue at Oregon (and perhaps that statement deserves a "yet"). The OSU coverage explosion came after the initial violations were supposedly resolved and are a direct result of the cover up. That is the unique quality in the OSU case and the reason they'll continue to be hammered.
• vball10set

  As for the records requests, Oregon provided what ESPN requested

  Sorry, but this isn't true-- Oregon's released what THEY wanted released--let's keep it real here.
• enigmaax

  vball10set;856277 wrote:Sorry, but this isn't true-- Oregon's released what THEY wanted released--let's keep it real here.

  
  According the article cited above, ESPN asked for revenues and expenditures and got a financial report. Then ESPN revised it to get more specific information about what Oregon paid for recruiting services. Somewhere along the line, that information was revealed ($25,000), so what is missing?
• WebFire

  enigmaax;856273 wrote: ESPN didn't launch full force on OSU until there were results (you didn't hear about ongoing investigations into the tattoos until the school's announcement of a suspension, right?). Nothing is final in the Oregon or Alabama cases and none of the other mentioned sources have released any new info resulting from their own investigations, so what is there for ESPN to report?

  Bingo! That's what I've said all along, but no one could wrap their head around it.
• Scooter1369

  

  enigmaax;856273 wrote:Wait, who are you talking about regarding "sending in the cavalry". Yahoo first reported on its investigations of both OSU and Oregon. The Columbus Dispatch and SI followed up with their own investigations of Ohio State. ESPN has largely just re-hashed reports from those sources.
  
  ESPN didn't launch full force on OSU until there were results (you didn't hear about ongoing investigations into the tattoos until the school's announcement of a suspension, right?). Nothing is final in the Oregon or Alabama cases and none of the other mentioned sources have released any new info resulting from their own investigations, so what is there for ESPN to report?
  
  As for the records requests, Oregon provided what ESPN requested. OSU did not. That is why there's no lawsuit. As I've already mentioned, the Oregon situation hasn't even gotten to the NCAA yet so there's no coach-lied-to-the-NCAA-three-times cover up. Again, remember that ESPN didn't request any records from OSU until all the doubt was cast on who really knew and what they knew. Seriously, there were plenty of OSU fans themselves claiming Tressel was falling on his sword for Smith or whoever else. There was a reason to want that information after other **** started coming out at OSU. It isn't the same issue at Oregon (and perhaps that statement deserves a "yet"). The OSU coverage explosion came after the initial violations were supposedly resolved and are a direct result of the cover up. That is the unique quality in the OSU case and the reason they'll continue to be hammered.

  
  One true statement there and one outright lie.
  
  Yes Oregon provided to ESPN exactly what they ask for: VIRTUALLY NOTHING. OSU has released everything to the NCAA, you know, the people that actually farking matter. And the NCAA is ready to rule on the complete set of info. ESPN wants it to sensationalize the story some more and do more damage by taking a sledgehammer to the car after the wreck is over. Its not for any other reason than to smear Ohio State some more.
  
  The argument that Tressel lied to the NCAA by "omitting his knowledge" of the infractions on a form would also apply to Chip Kelly, because he signs the same damn form. Tressel claimed no knowledge, and so is Kelly. ESPN talking heads were calling for Tressel to resign a month before it came out that he did know. ESPN also claimed that OSU was intentionally hindering the investigation, when they self reported the whole fucking thing.
  
  You don't hear any of this crap about Bama, Oregon or Auburn. Conferences in long term contracts with ESPN.
  
  Even today, Oregon is under investigation. Alabama is under investigation. Auburn is under investigation. UNC is under investigation. What's on the front page at ESPN?
  
  Tressel made $21.7 million during tenure at Ohio State
  

  COLUMBUS, Ohio -- Jim Tressel made $21.7 million as Ohio State football coach over his decade-long tenure before being ousted for breaking NCAA rules, records from the publicly funded school show.
  
  Tressel earned more than $3.5 million in 2010, the year he covered up an improper benefits scandal that has led to Ohio State being forced to appear before the NCAA's committee on infractions this Friday.

  Really? Tressel being maybe the 15th highest paid coach in football is front page news, but the investigations into their precious money making conferences are not.
  
  Turn around and open your fucking eyes.
• sleeper

  

  http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/6847366/jim-tressel-made-217m-tenure-ohio-state-buckeyes
  
  Another useless article.
• Scooter1369

  

  enigmaax;856305 wrote:According the article cited above, ESPN asked for revenues and expenditures and got a financial report. Then ESPN revised it to get more specific information about what Oregon paid for recruiting services. Somewhere along the line, that information was revealed ($25,000), so what is missing?

  
  The requests for emails, voicemails, office memos, phone records, for Lyles, Kelly, The AD, The assistant coaches, and players families and mentors. Any effort by ESPN to actually try to bring down Oregon, get Kelly and the AD fired, Calling for failure to monitor, Lack of institutional control, the death penalty or the harshest penalties they can convince the NCAA to give.
  
  That. Is. What's. Missing.
• vball10set

  enigmaax;856305 wrote:According the article cited above, ESPN asked for revenues and expenditures and got a financial report. Then ESPN revised it to get more specific information about what Oregon paid for recruiting services. Somewhere along the line, that information was revealed ($25,000), so what is missing?

  Scooter1369;856316 wrote:The requests for emails, voicemails, office memos, phone records, for Lyles, Kelly, The AD, The assistant coaches, and players families and mentors. Any effort by ESPN to actually try to bring down Oregon, get Kelly and the AD fired, Calling for failure to monitor, Lack of institutional control, the death penalty or the harshest penalties they can convince the NCAA to give.
  
  That. Is. What's. Missing.

  you beat me to it--thanks