1st Debate

• sleeper

  

  Romney and his religious bullshit.
• sleeper

  

  Also if anyone is watching this on CNN, I feel that "colorado undecided voter" tracker never goes below the midpoint.
• BoatShoes

  gut;1286718 wrote:Tax policy center has long since walked that back. They admitted they made assumptions about likely cuts they had no basis for. It's fair criticism to ask MR what he is going to eliminate, but it's a bald-faced lie to say "he's going to raise taxes on the middle class". That's one of 3 alternatives, and the left is pumping it as fact when it obviously isn't.

  He's only going to raise taxes on the middle class if he wants to actually have a revenue neutral tax plan. They have not walked it back. They stood by it. Romney told Forbes "they made an assumption that I would close the home mortgage interest deduction for middle class families." They stood by it and said that he'd have no choice but to close popular deductions like the HMID if it wanted to be revenue neutral without fantasy growth.
  
  The only other option is to explode the deficit.
• BoatShoes

  Romney has no plan to cut education, to not cut the military, to not raise taxes on the middle class, to cut rates for everybody and to cut the deficit. I think he's winning the debate I think but he's going to get hammered in the press.
• gut

  Green energy OUCH!!!
• fish82

  

  BoatShoes;1286730 wrote:Romney has no plan to cut education, to not cut the military, to not raise taxes on the middle class, to cut rates for everybody and to cut the deficit. I think he's winning the debate I think but he's going to get hammered in the press.

  Color me shocked. :laugh:
• gut

  BoatShoes;1286728 wrote:He's only going to raise taxes on the middle class if he wants to actually have a revenue neutral tax plan. .

  Make up your own facts just like Obama. Or, you could do your own math on what losing the mortgage interest deduction vs. a 20% tax cut does. Perhaps that is asking too much of you.
• gut

  BoatShoes;1286730 wrote:Romney has no plan to cut education, to not cut the military, to not raise taxes on the middle class, to cut rates for everybody and to cut the deficit. I think he's winning the debate I think but he's going to get hammered in the press.

  Obama could drop his pants and give America a helicopter and the press would still hammer Romney.
• ptown_trojans_1

  

  BoatShoes;1286730 wrote:Romney has no plan to cut education, to not cut the military, to not raise taxes on the middle class, to cut rates for everybody and to cut the deficit. I think he's winning the debate I think but he's going to get hammered in the press.

  The defense budget has to go down. He is an idiot calling for it to stay the same or go up.
  Hell, he wants more Navy ships, which the Navy does not even want.
  
  Overall, a worthless debate.
  Nothing was really nailed down in specifics.
  It was all fluff and broad statements.
  Romney owned the evening as Obama sounds so flustered.
• ptown_trojans_1

  

  ccrunner609;1286742 wrote:I doubt this. WHat we saw was a president that just got smoked by the govenor of Mass.

  Sure, smoked. But the real issues weren't touched.
  Specifics were not hammered out. Nothing was mentioned of the huge problem of January 2, and the more important thing that will make any of the ideas they are talking about: how to deal with a partisan Congress.
  
  I'm sure Romney does not want to enter a White House where taxes automatically went up, SS, Medicare, and Medicaid are cut by 8.4% and the DOD is cut by 9.6% for FY13.
• gut

  ccrunner609;1286742 wrote:I doubt this. WHat we saw was a president that just got smoked by the govenor of Mass.

  Pretty much, because Obama got smoked it's a worthless debate. Romney was pretty damn specific and knowledgeable.
• believer

  

  ccrunner609;1286742 wrote:I doubt this. WHat we saw was a president that just got smoked by the govenor of Mass.

  Pretty much sums it up. "Fluff and broad statements" aside, Romney won round 1.
• ts1227

  

  Obama tonight
  
  [video=youtube;5hfYJsQAhl0][/video]
  
  
  Also Jim Lehrer was just dreadful
• gut

  Obama badly forcing that smile as he walks off.
• BoatShoes

  gut;1286734 wrote:Make up your own facts just like Obama. Or, you could do your own math on what losing the mortgage interest deduction vs. a 20% tax cut does. Perhaps that is asking too much of you.

  Blah blah blah. I know it makes you feel good to talk down to me but the fact of the matter is that losing the mortgage interest deduction along with other tax expenditures that middle class people use (i.e. exclusion for employer provided health insurance) are going to amount to tax raises and have to be used to offset the reduction of rates for it to be revenue neutral. It is u who does not want to accept this inconvenient fact. It's not just the HMID vs. the 20% rate reduction for revenue neutrality.
• QuakerOats

  felt sorry for barry
• BoatShoes

  Good performance by Romney. I imagine the race should tighten substantially.
• ptown_trojans_1

  

  ccrunner609;1286758 wrote:MSNBC starts off complaining about the "format"............that means they know who got smacked.

  Romney won, but I agree the format sucks.
  
  What it needs is a moderator that pushes back. One that really asks specific questions and quickly follow-ups and asks more specific questions.
  I'm all for a back and forth, but a tough moderator would certainly help.
• ts1227

  

  ptown_trojans_1;1286764 wrote:Romney won, but I agree the format sucks.
  
  What needs is a moderator that pushes back. One that really asks specific questions and quickly follow-ups and asks more specific questions.
  I'm all for a back and forth, but a tough moderator would certainly help.

  I think the format was fine, but essentially having no moderator was the main problem. Needless to say that didn't cost Obama by any means, he just got beat.
• ts1227

  

  sleeper;1286723 wrote:Also if anyone is watching this on CNN, I feel that "colorado undecided voter" tracker never goes below the midpoint.

  This was odd, because in 2008 that thing was all over the damn place.
• gut

  BoatShoes;1286759 wrote: along with other tax expenditures that middle class people use (i.e. exclusion for employer provided health insurance)

  Again, saying Romney is going to raise taxes on the middle class is a lie. End of debate. Maybe that's why I talk down to you, because you either don't understand the issues or you lack integrity in your arguments.
• gut

  BoatShoes;1286762 wrote:Good performance by Romney. I imagine the race should tighten substantially.

  I don't know. Will be interesting. Some say debates don't move the needle much. And when partisan voters get most of their impression from their favored news stations the needle will, understandably, not move.
• ts1227

  

  gut;1286774 wrote:I don't know. Will be interesting. Some say debates don't move the needle much. And when partisan voters get most of their impression from their favored news stations the needle will, understandably, not move.

  Yeah. I mean think about this site. These debates will not change the mind of a single person. Depends on how many true undecideds there were.
• ptown_trojans_1

  

  gut;1286771 wrote:Again, saying Romney is going to raise taxes on the middle class is a lie. End of debate. Maybe that's why I talk down to you, because you either don't understand the issues or you lack integrity in your arguments.

  Well, he may if he doesn't get Congress to extend the Bush tax cuts and reform the tax codes.
  Wouldn't have known it though as it wasn't brought up...
• sleeper

  

  I don't like Mitt Romney but man did he own this debate tonight. Even CNN is slobbering his knob right now.