Senate Bill 5 Targets Collective Bargaining for Elimination!

• stlouiedipalma

  BRF;830899 wrote:believer and Writer: I'm laughing. Touche'!

  
  
  And all this time I thought I was the only one who thought they were joined at the hip. At least you can say they have each other's backs (along with other body parts).
• believer

  

  stlouiedipalma;831450 wrote:And all this time I thought I was the only one who thought they were joined at the hip. At least you can say they have each other's backs (along with other body parts).

  C'mon stlouie. Resorting to personal slams now? :rolleyes:
  
  Oh I forgot, you're from the "open-minded" political ideology that welcomes all points of views...unless, of course, those views are conservative.
• Writerbuckeye

  

  More *** jokes, louie?
  
  How predictable.
• LJ

  

  opening on request
• ernest_t_bass

  

  [INDENT]Someone sent me this email. I don't know the validity, but they swore up and down to me that it was real, and not faked, etc. He said that he checked it out to make sure it wasn't spam. Don't shoot the messenger, just read.
  

  This was forwarded to me from my friend who teaches at XXX. It is from XXX's superintendent. I thought you might find his take on Kasich interesting. Please feel free to forward on to your fellow administrators. My friend said his superintendent wants this to circulate.
  
  September 9, 2011
  
  Dear Staff,
  
  I wanted to send this email to you for a week now. It has taken me the better part of this week to make sure I form my words correctly and present to you absolute facts. I am trying to do this below. I feel very passionate that it is my duty as the superintendent of a legitimate public school district to fill you in on an occurrence I had last Thursday.
  
  I was invited to hear Governor Kasich speak at a private “invitation” only event. At first, I declined, but after more consideration, I accepted and attended the event. Ohio House Speaker Bill Batchelder spoke for about 5 minutes and then the Governor spoke for about 20. The majority of people in the room were affiliated with the Republican Party.
  
  When Batchelder spoke, he told this group point blank that Ohio is in the financial shape it is in because public employees have been bilking the state out of money for years. I promised myself that I would not become outraged to the point where I had to leave, so I stayed.
  
  The Governor spoke for about 5 of the 20 minutes on Senate Bill 5. I thought you might be interested in some of the things he said. He told the audience that public employees do not pay a dime into their pension fund and that they do not pay a dime for their healthcare insurance. As you know, this is a bold face lie. The public pension systems of Ohio have noted that 98% of public employees DO pay 10% of their salary to the retirement system. I hope you know that you do as well. Ten percent of your salary goes to STRS and the school district does pay an additional 14% for you. This is no different from an employee who has a pension from his or her company or a matched 401 (k). Nearly every professional employee of any company that is worth its salt has one or both of these benefits. Additionally, many public employees pay a percentage of their health care cost. You pay 20%.
  
  The Governor said that “we are at war with these people.” He also said that he wishes they would just accept Senate Bill 5 because he is going to spend millions in tax payer money to defend it in the campaign. He said if it goes down, he and the legislature are going to “ram it through” in other legislation. He commented that his polls are showing that as many as 70% of Republicans are going to vote the bill down and he doesn’t understand why.
  
  He also tried to tell the people that he tried to sit down with union leadership and they declined. I guess he forgot that the union leadership approached him before Senate Bill 5 passed and he had the doors of the State House LOCKED for the first time ever in history. He locked us out of our building and said he was not discussing anything. His actions made that clear.
  
  Although many people in the room clapped when he said other things, no one clapped during this Senate Bill 5 piece. He entertained about 10 questions. No one asked anything about Senate Bill 5. They all asked about why he is selling the turnpike to a foreign nation and why he is “selling jails” to private companies which may be foreign nations when the major religions have deemed this immoral, unethical and unjust. They also asked about tax abatements, Obama Care and Medicare in Ohio. After every single question, he turned the tables around and made a comment that public employees have caused Ohio to be in financial ruin and that is why he was doing all of these things.
  
  I could tell you more.
  
  I understand that Ohio is in bad financial shape. I really do. I understand that we need reform. You cannot “ram through” reform and you cannot blame the state of the economy on the hard working people of Ohio. The absolute thing that bothered me the most about the whole ordeal was that he lied to the people in that room. He spread a bold face lie as propaganda in order to make his bill look valid. It made me sick.
  
  This Governor is a bully and the legislature is his posse. We have to stand up to this bully AND to his posse. We need to make sure that our family members, our friends, our neighbors—anyone who will listen—know the truth and know that these lies are coming from Columbus. If you don’t stand up for yourself now, this will only be the beginning of a downward turn from which we will never recover.
  
  
  Additional information:
  
  As we speak, HB 136 is moving rapidly through the Ohio house. If passed into law, this bill allows ANY student in ANY public school to take their daily funding, which is now nearly $6,000 per student, and go to the private school of their choice if the family income is less than $95,000 per year. This money is deducted from the public school of residence. There is no regard for separation of church and state. I believe federal funds would follow the student as well. The private school is free to take or turn away any student they choose for any reason. They are free to kick them out whenever they wish. They do are not accountable in any way shape or form as you are as a public school. If this bill passes, MANY of you will loose your job. First of all, we will deal with two different consequences of this bill. #1. Most private schools cost more than $6,000. So who will benefit? Upper middle class students and or the cream of the crop that are given scholarships by the private schools. #2. If the private school costs less than $6,000 per year, the parent gets to bank the extra money. So that means if the parochial schools in our area choose to accept this, they could charge $4,000 per student and the parent would get a check for $2,000 for each kid. The lawmakers in Columbus keep trying to crush public education and we are hanging on by a thread. This and senate bill 5 will be the final nails in the coffin.
  
  If there ever was a time to speak up and be active in government, it is now.
  
  Hang in there,
  
  Dr. XXX

  
  [/INDENT]
• FatHobbit

  

  ernest_t_bass;905374 wrote:[INDENT]Someone sent me this email. I don't know the validity, but they swore up and down to me that it was real, and not faked, etc. He said that he checked it out to make sure it wasn't spam. Don't shoot the messenger, just read.
  
  

  September 9, 2011[/INDENT]
  
  Dear Staff,
  
  I wanted to send this email to you for a week now. It has taken me the better part of this week to make sure I form my words correctly and present to you absolute facts. I am trying to do this below. I feel very passionate that it is my duty as the superintendent of a legitimate public school district to fill you in on an occurrence I had last Thursday.
  
  I was invited to hear Governor Kasich speak at a private “invitation” only event. At first, I declined, but after more consideration, I accepted and attended the event. Ohio House Speaker Bill Batchelder spoke for about 5 minutes and then the Governor spoke for about 20. The majority of people in the room were affiliated with the Republican Party.
  
  When Batchelder spoke, he told this group point blank that Ohio is in the financial shape it is in because public employees have been bilking the state out of money for years. I promised myself that I would not become outraged to the point where I had to leave, so I stayed.
  
  The Governor spoke for about 5 of the 20 minutes on Senate Bill 5. I thought you might be interested in some of the things he said. He told the audience that public employees do not pay a dime into their pension fund and that they do not pay a dime for their healthcare insurance. As you know, this is a bold face lie. The public pension systems of Ohio have noted that 98% of public employees DO pay 10% of their salary to the retirement system. I hope you know that you do as well. Ten percent of your salary goes to STRS and the school district does pay an additional 14% for you. This is no different from an employee who has a pension from his or her company or a matched 401 (k). Nearly every professional employee of any company that is worth its salt has one or both of these benefits. Additionally, many public employees pay a percentage of their health care cost. You pay 20%.
  
  The Governor said that “we are at war with these people.” He also said that he wishes they would just accept Senate Bill 5 because he is going to spend millions in tax payer money to defend it in the campaign. He said if it goes down, he and the legislature are going to “ram it through” in other legislation. He commented that his polls are showing that as many as 70% of Republicans are going to vote the bill down and he doesn’t understand why.
  
  He also tried to tell the people that he tried to sit down with union leadership and they declined. I guess he forgot that the union leadership approached him before Senate Bill 5 passed and he had the doors of the State House LOCKED for the first time ever in history. He locked us out of our building and said he was not discussing anything. His actions made that clear.
  
  Although many people in the room clapped when he said other things, no one clapped during this Senate Bill 5 piece. He entertained about 10 questions. No one asked anything about Senate Bill 5. They all asked about why he is selling the turnpike to a foreign nation and why he is “selling jails” to private companies which may be foreign nations when the major religions have deemed this immoral, unethical and unjust. They also asked about tax abatements, Obama Care and Medicare in Ohio. After every single question, he turned the tables around and made a comment that public employees have caused Ohio to be in financial ruin and that is why he was doing all of these things.
  
  I could tell you more.
  
  I understand that Ohio is in bad financial shape. I really do. I understand that we need reform. You cannot “ram through” reform and you cannot blame the state of the economy on the hard working people of Ohio. The absolute thing that bothered me the most about the whole ordeal was that he lied to the people in that room. He spread a bold face lie as propaganda in order to make his bill look valid. It made me sick.
  
  This Governor is a bully and the legislature is his posse. We have to stand up to this bully AND to his posse. We need to make sure that our family members, our friends, our neighbors—anyone who will listen—know the truth and know that these lies are coming from Columbus. If you don’t stand up for yourself now, this will only be the beginning of a downward turn from which we will never recover.
  
  
  Additional information:
  
  As we speak, HB 136 is moving rapidly through the Ohio house. If passed into law, this bill allows ANY student in ANY public school to take their daily funding, which is now nearly $6,000 per student, and go to the private school of their choice if the family income is less than $95,000 per year. This money is deducted from the public school of residence. There is no regard for separation of church and state. I believe federal funds would follow the student as well. The private school is free to take or turn away any student they choose for any reason. They are free to kick them out whenever they wish. They do are not accountable in any way shape or form as you are as a public school. If this bill passes, MANY of you will loose your job. First of all, we will deal with two different consequences of this bill. #1. Most private schools cost more than $6,000. So who will benefit? Upper middle class students and or the cream of the crop that are given scholarships by the private schools. #2. If the private school costs less than $6,000 per year, the parent gets to bank the extra money. So that means if the parochial schools in our area choose to accept this, they could charge $4,000 per student and the parent would get a check for $2,000 for each kid. The lawmakers in Columbus keep trying to crush public education and we are hanging on by a thread. This and senate bill 5 will be the final nails in the coffin.
  
  If there ever was a time to speak up and be active in government, it is now.
  
  Hang in there,
  
  [INDENT]Dr. XXX

  [/INDENT]

  
  
  If this is real, I would hope they would have at least proof read it before they sent it out.
• jmog

  I can not dispute much of that "email", but the one bold faced lie he stated was that private companies have the same retirement benefit/contributions that the teachers have.
  
  He stated that teachers pay 10% to their retirement and the schools put in 14%. He compared this to the private companies with matching 401k's.
  
  Most private companies 401k's match as little as 0% and as much as high as 6%. I have yet to see a private company that matches more than 6% in a 401k.
  
  So the teachers are getting a total of 24% in their retirement, 14% of which is being put in by the government.
  
  Most people in the private world is lucky to get 6% put in by the company and the person is still typically putting in around 10% max.
  
  So, while he has some very valid points, that one is a "bold faced lie" using his own term.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  FatHobbit;905416 wrote:If this is real, I would hope they would have at least proof read it before they sent it out.

  I noticed a couple, but there weren't that many.
• Al Bundy

  jmog;905418 wrote:I can not dispute much of that "email", but the one bold faced lie he stated was that private companies have the same retirement benefit/contributions that the teachers have.
  
  He stated that teachers pay 10% to their retirement and the schools put in 14%. He compared this to the private companies with matching 401k's.
  
  Most private companies 401k's match as little as 0% and as much as high as 6%. I have yet to see a private company that matches more than 6% in a 401k.
  
  So the teachers are getting a total of 24% in their retirement, 14% of which is being put in by the government.
  
  Most people in the private world is lucky to get 6% put in by the company and the person is still typically putting in around 10% max.
  
  So, while he has some very valid points, that one is a "bold faced lie" using his own term.

  In the private world, the employer is also contributing 6.2% to your social security.
• WebFire

  jmog;905418 wrote:I can not dispute much of that "email", but the one bold faced lie he stated was that private companies have the same retirement benefit/contributions that the teachers have.
  
  He stated that teachers pay 10% to their retirement and the schools put in 14%. He compared this to the private companies with matching 401k's.
  
  Most private companies 401k's match as little as 0% and as much as high as 6%. I have yet to see a private company that matches more than 6% in a 401k.
  
  So the teachers are getting a total of 24% in their retirement, 14% of which is being put in by the government.
  
  Most people in the private world is lucky to get 6% put in by the company and the person is still typically putting in around 10% max.
  
  So, while he has some very valid points, that one is a "bold faced lie" using his own term.

  Not to mention, private companies are not require to pay anything towards retirement, or they can adjust to what they can afford. Schools cannot.
  
  On the flipside, private employees do not have to put any of there salary towards retirement. Public should be no different.
• WebFire

  Al Bundy;905473 wrote:In the private world, the employer is also contributing 6.2% to your social security.

  Do public employees not get SSN benefits?
• wkfan

  WebFire;905474 wrote:On the flipside, private employees do not have to put any of there salary towards retirement. Public should be no different.

  Really?
  
  Ever hear of Social Security??
  
  Forced ponzi scheme for private employees.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  WebFire;905474 wrote:Not to mention, private companies are not require to pay anything towards retirement.

  Private companies are required to pay towards SS.
  
  

  WebFire;905476 wrote:Do public employees not get SSN benefits?

  Not all. I do not.
• wkfan

  WebFire;905476 wrote:Do public employees not get SSN benefits?

  If a public employee has not paid into SS, they do not get any benefits from SS
• Writerbuckeye

  

  This e-mail has never been verified as real. In fact, it appears to be a complete fabrication that is being spread via the Internet by our good "friends" at Plunderbund -- the website devoted to hating anything and everything about Gov. Kasich.
  
  If you believe this, you are no better than folks who believed Internet musings about the lack of authenticity of Obama's birth certificate.
• Writerbuckeye

  

  wkfan;905483 wrote:If a public employee has not paid into SS, they do not get any benefits from SS

  Even if they do pay into SS, they do not get full benefits. I paid into both SS and PERS. When eligible for SS, I will get a significantly reduced amount compared to people who put in the same number of quarters that I did.
• wkfan

  Writerbuckeye;905489 wrote:Even if they do pay into SS, they do not get full benefits. I paid into both SS and PERS. When eligible for SS, I will get a significantly reduced amount compared to people who put in the same number of quarters that I did.

  My wife (teacher..yea, I know...scum of the earth and akin to a serial killer) has the same scenario.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  Writerbuckeye;905485 wrote:This e-mail has never been verified as real. In fact, it appears to be a complete fabrication that is being spread via the Internet by our good "friends" at Plunderbund -- the website devoted to hating anything and everything about Gov. Kasich.
  
  If you believe this, you are no better than folks who believed Internet musings about the lack of authenticity of Obama's birth certificate.

  I told you that I had no idea if it was real, and also said "Don't shoot the messenger." NICE SPIN! (like_that).
• WebFire

  ernest_t_bass;905480 wrote:Private companies are required to pay towards SS.
  
  
  
  
  Not all. I do not.

  Right, I was talking outside of SSN. I guess I shouldn't be though.
• WebFire

  wkfan;905483 wrote:If a public employee has not paid into SS, they do not get any benefits from SS

  I guess what I meant is, are they required to pay into SSN? Is the school required to pay into SSN? Or do they get exemptions because of PERS?
• Writerbuckeye

  

  ernest_t_bass;905492 wrote:I told you that I had no idea if it was real, and also said "Don't shoot the messenger." NICE SPIN! (like_that).

  What spin? I stated factual information as I know it.
  
  If information this damning cannot be verified, it has no place being given any kind of credit for veracity here or elsewhere.
• wkfan

  WebFire;905496 wrote:I guess what I meant is, are they required to pay into SSN? Is the school required to pay into SSN? Or do they get exemptions because of PERS?

  They do not pay into Social Security as they are paying into another retirement fund (PERS, STRS, SERS, etc)
• ernest_t_bass

  

  Writerbuckeye;905500 wrote:What spin?

  Hi, my name is Joke. People call me Joke for short.
• jmog

  Al Bundy;905473 wrote:In the private world, the employer is also contributing 6.2% to your social security.

  So, even if it is the best company in the US, the company is giving 12.2% to retirement. 6% to our own, and 6.2% to the BS SS that will not be around for us younger workers anyway.
  
  Like has already been mentioned, a private company will, and most do, change their match % based on the fiscal responsibilities. During the economic recession many companies halted their match % altogether. Most companies cut it in half and have yet to reinstate it.
  
  I would honestly say that on average companies that even carry a 401k contribute 3%, even if you count the BS SS 6.2%, that is still far less than is REQUIRED for public employees.
• WebFire

  We only do 3%.