Would MJ win 6 rings in todays NBA?

• SQ_Crazies

  

  Haha, no because he can't play himself.
  
  And devil, are you certain of that? Forget the fact that he finally found a real team--just Shaq--I'm not sure I can agree. Definitely can't agree that it's "not even close".
• SQ_Crazies

  

  He stepped up his playoff dominance--but that has something to do with the triangle, because he played well in the playoffs in the 90s too. But it's REAL close IMO.
• Glory Days

  

  SQ_Crazies wrote: Haha, no because he can't play himself.

  knowing shaq, i wouldnt put it past him to try and play himself.
• jpake1

  

  Shaq's best years where when he was winning rings. He was better defensively at a young age because he actually believed in conditioning back then. But he became a smarter player and a great passer.
  
  SQ: Even with those matchups, I still gotta take the 80's. If Magic and LBJ are going to be checking each other, I think that hurts the team a bit in a sense. LBJ wouldn't be able to be the great help defender he is. When he's guarding other SF's, he'd allowed to ball hawk on the wing. It'd be a little bit different guarding the greatest PG of all time when he's controlling the ball. That's just my opinoin though. I also think that Bird would then take it to Melo. Melo is a good player, but he isn't in Bird's league. He isn't in his neighbord yet when discussing all-around player.
• devil1197

  IMO, Shaq's best years were 00-04.
  
  He established himself finally as one of the great big men of all time by simply dominating the playoffs and winning multiple rings.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  Glory Days wrote:

  SQ_Crazies wrote: Haha, no because he can't play himself.

  knowing shaq, i wouldnt put it past him to try and play himself.

  Good point.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  jpake1 wrote: Shaq's best years where when he was winning rings. He was better defensively at a young age because he actually believed in conditioning back then. But he became a smarter player and a great passer.
  
  SQ: Even with those matchups, I still gotta take the 80's. If Magic and LBJ are going to be checking each other, I think that hurts the team a bit in a sense. LBJ wouldn't be able to be the great help defender he is. When he's guarding other SF's, he'd allowed to ball hawk on the wing. It'd be a little bit different guarding the greatest PG of all time when he's controlling the ball. That's just my opinoin though. I also think that Bird would then take it to Melo. Melo is a good player, but he isn't in Bird's league. He isn't in his neighbord yet when discussing all-around player.

  Agree with what you said about Shaq, that's probably what puts 2000 Shaq over the top--he was a smarter player. Same sort of improvement that we're seeing LeBron go through the last few years and especially this year.
  
  And LeBron is a GREAT help defender. Probably one of the best in league history at that. But he's become a very good 1 on 1 defender in the last two years too. I think his athleticism would show out big time against Magic. But as far as Melo and Bird go--I agree that Bird would work Melo, but defensively Bird couldn't handle Melo either. Bird was like LeBron, a GREAT help defender, great at reading passing lanes and stuff like that. But he was never that great of a 1 on 1 defender. I think Melo could score with him. And if you put Melo at the 4 and Durant at the 3--Melo would have a hard time on defense but I'm not sure that 80's team could outscore LeBron, Kobe, Melo, Durant and Shaq. Combined career PPG average of 126.88. That is SICK.
  
  That 80's team is 120.74. I know that doesn't really mean much in terms of who would actually win this match up, just another way to look at things.
• jpake1

  

  LeBron has become a good 1 on 1 defender. But I also think Bird was a pretty good 1 on 1 defender himself. I just think LBJ is at his best on defense when he's allowed to roam. He wouldn't be doing that with Magic because he'd make him pay for roaming. They would both get each other at times for sure. Magic was no punk on defense. He's still the only guy I've really seen guard 1-5 and do it well and often enough not to make it a one time thing. I think Melo would put some points up.. all good players will score on another. I just think Bird would take it to him in every other category and make his team better. If you've got Melo and Durant playing 3-4, I like the 80's team even more. I'd rather have the new era be Wade, Kobe, Melo, LBJ, and Howard. I don't like the idea of Melo or Durant banging down low with those 80 guys.
• Footwedge

  SQ_Crazies wrote:

  mallymal614 wrote:

  SQ_Crazies wrote: Bahahahahaha?! Shaq??? Shaq used to be a good athlete but he was never in his life anywhere near at athletic as Dwight Howard. It wasn't about who was the better player--keep up with the conversation junior..

  I guess people forgot what a freak of nature Shaq was. He didn't really become a power guy until he went to LA. But with the Magic, he use to put on shows. I don't even recall Dwight leading a fast break like a point guard as Shaq did. Shaq may have been stronger and jumped as high (remember we are talking about young Shaq). Let me refresh yall memories.
  
  

  You don't have to refresh my memory.
  
  I'm extremely familiar with the young, freak Shaq. And I'll stand by saying Howard is a better athlete all day long. Shaq never in his life jumped higher than Dwight Howard can unless he used a trampoline.
  
  Oh yeah, this too:
  
  
  
  ^Dwight Howard leading the fast break like a PG.

  Shaq played some point guard in high school. He has gone coast to coast a time or two for Cleveland this season.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  That'd be fine too, I think Wade could even play the 2 and Kobe could play the 3 so you still have LeBron on the point. I think Kobe is a good enough defender to check Bird.
  
  And I definitely agree that LeBron is still at his best on defense when he can roam. Always will be.
  
  Actually, his fast break defense may be his best attribute on that side of the ball. The chase down blocks are just ridiculous and they happen so consistently it's incredible. Especially now because guys know he's coming and he still does it. The most impressive thing about it to me is that he almost never fouls the guy--which is the reason that most guys can't make that play--hard to do it without getting a bunch of body contact. But if you watch most of the replays, they're clean as hell.
• Footwedge

  This thread is another offshoot from the others.
  
  Young people think that the present players are better...older people don't. Whereby there is always an evolution process going on, whereby new records are set. it is offset by the fact that modern sports teams have dilluted talent, due to all the expansion.
  
  Thse stars of the 60's were as good as the stars of the 70's. The stars of the 70's were as good as the stars of the 80's....and so on and so forth through present times. My dad will swear up and down that Bill Dickey was better than Johnny Bench. Or that Babe Ruth was better than Bonds. And so it goes.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  Footwedge wrote: it is offset by the fact that modern sports teams have dilluted talent, due to all the expansion.

  This was true 15 years ago.
• Footwedge

  SQ_Crazies wrote:

  Footwedge wrote: it is offset by the fact that modern sports teams have dilluted talent, due to all the expansion.

  This was true 15 years ago.

  Which pro league has contracted? If the NBA chopped off half their teams..down to 16 for example, do you think the talent on the floor would be the same?
  
  You wouldn't have pathetic teams like the Nets or the Bullets.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  Well no shit Sherlock, but someone still has to be the worst team in the league. The Nets have two All-Star level players.
• jpake1

  

  That kind of thing will happen with a 6'8"-6'9" guy that's fast as fuck with great body control. There's a lot of players that are good at it, but not too many that are that tall, so like you said, he does it almost every single game. I just hope he comes to Miami so I can watch him do it every game instead of the several Cavs games I watch.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  Oh yeah, he's just built perfectly for it--you just have to have long arms (he's tall), be able to jump high and be fast. He's all of the above obviously. The only skill really is to get the timing right, which he's incredible at. It's just awesome to watch, no one does it quite the same because no one is built for it nearly as well as he is.
• Little Danny

  

  Mallymal, great list. I think a lot of people on here, particularly the younger ones, just remember those guys at the end of their career when their skills had waned or never saw them play at all. As 2quick4u pointed out, there is no one today who could handle Hakeem in his prime.
  
  Athleticism is a great thing but what you have to consider is at this level all of these guys are great athletes in some regard. What made MJ great was not just his dunking abilities or his scoring, but an aspect people forget about was how good he was on defense as well. He also had the ability to make players around him much better than they actually were. MJ played at such a high level and demanded his team play with intensity as well. He inspired others to do the impossible because he was getting it done every not.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  What made MJ great was not just his dunking abilities or his scoring, but an aspect people forget about was how good he was on defense as well. He also had the ability to make players around him much better than they actually were. MJ played at such a high level and demanded his team play with intensity as well. He inspired others to do the impossible because he was getting it done every not.

  You just described multiple current players.
• 2quik4u

  

  SQ_Crazies wrote: Bahahahahaha?! Shaq??? Shaq used to be a good athlete but he was never in his life anywhere near at athletic as Dwight Howard. It wasn't about who was the better player--keep up with the conversation junior..

  LOL you dont think Shaq is near the athlete that D12 is ur nuts show me someone else that is 350 and can move like Shaq.
• 2quik4u

  

  SQ_Crazies wrote: And as much as I love Duncan. With that group (LeBron at the 1), I'd strongly consider moving Melo to the 4 and playing Durant at the 3. They'd score so many points and they'd dominate on the break.

  Ok time for you to quit posting. Yea great idea buddy lets take out the best player of the DECADE and put someone who doesn't even play a 4 there.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  Duncan is the best PF ever IMO, but not the player of the decade.
  
  And we're talking about winning games buddy, you don't have to have the "default" lineup to win games. And clearly you ignored the reason, which I think is pretty fucking valid.
  
  And Shaq didn't weigh 350 when he could move the way you're talking.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  And yes, I still think that Dwight Howard is a better athlete than Shaq ever was. He's a better defensive player now than Shaq ever was--defense is pure athleticism.
• Footwedge

  SQ_Crazies wrote: The Nets have two All-Star level players.

  Idiotic post. When Harris or Lopez, make an All Star team, then let me know.
  
  The Nets are 10 and 90 for a reason. Without the delution in talent, they wouldn't be perrenial doormats.
• Lovejoy1984

  

  Harris did last season.
  
  And I wouldn't say the are perrenial doormats either.
  
  They did go to the Championship game 2 times in the 00's.
• 2quik4u

  

  SQ_Crazies wrote: Duncan is the best PF ever IMO, but not the player of the decade.
  
  And we're talking about winning games buddy, you don't have to have the "default" lineup to win games. And clearly you ignored the reason, which I think is pretty fucking valid.
  
  And Shaq didn't weigh 350 when he could move the way you're talking.

  Yes, I know were talking about winning games bro and when you replace the player of the decade for a person who doesn't player the 4, your asking to lose not to win.
  
  And yes im talking about how Shaq moved when he was 350 there is no one like that at all no one!!!!! Amare and Bosh are just about as athletic as Howard.