Run away Run away .. I don’t think so “I’m Standing My Ground”

• Belly35

  

  Some of OC members may not care about weapons but you should also know the law and the rights of those who do have CCW.
  
  “Stand your ground” Ohio Bill 203 will change the CCW owner rights to defend themselves and others in public places, business owner to permit CCW to carry in store.
  
  I do have few problems with this Bill 203:
  
  I believe increasing the CCW permit training time not decreasing it to 4 hours. Presently the training is 12 hours, I think it should be 16 with additional time dedicated to the shooting and operational aspect of a weapon both pistols and rifles. Just knowing how to pull a trigger is not effective. Some level shooting proficiency should be acquired… also at least twice a year visit to a range required.</SPAN>
  
  Out of State new residents do need to apply for an Ohio CCW if they presently have another States CCW with a min. fee.
  
  Other State CCW to be legal in Ohio for short time visitors.
  
  
  http://www.cleveland.com/open/index.ssf/2013/11/ohio_house_passes_gun_bill_wit.html</SPAN>
• vdubb96

  

  I thought you were singing Janie's got a gun by the famous band Aerosmith mofo!
• I Wear Pants

  The current CCW classes are a fucking joke. My bf's sister went to one a few weeks ago and there were multiple people who had never handled a gun before that class, everyone passed. I'm fine with people being able to own guns and concealed carry doesn't bother me much but the standards need to be a lot tougher. Of course that opinion usually results in someone screaming at me about the 2nd Amendment.
  
  I agree with Belly, there should be more training and it should be ongoing.
• Devils Advocate

  

  
• ernest_t_bass

  

  
• LJ

  

  I don't like stand your ground laws. Your firearm should be used as a last resort when someone else puts you in a situation that you have no other way of getting out of. Stand your ground gives you the right to escalate a situation.
• TedSheckler

  

  And without it, it gets you shot in the back as you are forced to retreat.
• Belly35

  

  I Wear Pants;1540195 wrote:The current CCW classes are a fucking joke. My bf's sister went to one a few weeks ago and there were multiple people who had never handled a gun before that class, everyone passed. I'm fine with people being able to own guns and concealed carry doesn't bother me much but the standards need to be a lot tougher. Of course that opinion usually results in someone screaming at me about the 2nd Amendment.
  
  I agree with Belly, there should be more training and it should be ongoing.

  OMG We agree on something .... lets try this ... Not My President.... hahahah
• LJ

  

  TedSheckler;1540213 wrote:And without it, it gets you shot in the back as you are forced to retreat.

  lulz
• TedSheckler

  

  LJ;1540220 wrote:lulz

  didja?
• dlazz

  The OC really needs a political forum for stuff like this.
• Belly35

  

  This what Bill 203 is stating. Before only inside your home (not outside), in a car or relative car could you legally use your weapon without fear of legal repercussions. With this Bill 203 if confronted in the parking lot of Marcs by someone or a group in attempt to rob or do harm to you or your wife &#8230; lock and load. If you see a robbery in progress and someone is being harmed &#8230; lock and load. This Bill provides CCW carriers, to help protect the public is some degree without the liberal lawyer staking claim to jail good citizen and let the criminals rule.
  
  Please also note this is not the Law yet. Ohio Senate must pass this Bill but this seems to be a slam dunk as of now&#8230;
  
  I will be calling my Ohio Senator Rep and requesting additional 16 or same 12 hour training classes to this Bill.
• Belly35

  

  dlazz;1540231 wrote:The OC really needs a political forum for stuff like this.

  This is an educational thread and should be viewed by others OC members to advance their knowledge of social issue.
• LJ

  

  Belly35;1540232 wrote: lock and load. If you see a robbery in progress and someone is being harmed &#8230; lock and load. This Bill provides CCW carriers, to help protect the public

  Ah yes, Vigiliantism. Just what we need to turn this country around amirite?
• Me?

  

  Osama bin Laden and Saddam Hussein signed the petition against this bill, just in case you were wondering.
  
  
  I have my CCW permit. I'm for Stand Your Ground, but agree with Belly, training should be increased. IWP, in my class there were people who had never handled a gun before too--and they passed. But they did the necessary things to pass. It isn't that hard, and IMO it shouldn't be that hard. My class was great because my instructor wasn't an idiot. I think the training needs to be changed, if not longer, at least rewired so to speak. Far more time should be spent on the range than in the classroom. The classroom stuff is simple, most of it is redundant, and a lot of it is common sense. Handling a firearm is SIMPLE. I think you could spent about an hour on safe handling and use an unloaded (obviously) gun in the classroom. Then go to the range. Rather than 8 hours in the class and 4 hours on the range, it should be about 9 hours on the range and 3 in the class. In my class, we ended up spending 6 hours on the range. It's MUCH more effective than the classroom. By the end of the day, everyone in my class could handle their firearm well and shoot reasonably well. I didn't even need the class, I could have passed the test right from the start and there is no formal shooting test really--but the goals that my instructor wanted everyone to accomplish on the range I could have easily done the first try with my off hand and my non dominant eye. It is weird when you're in the class with people who have never even shot a gun before though, when you consider the class is designed around carrying one. I think the process of issuing CCW permits is pretty legit, but I do think it could be improved to make everyone more competent.
• Me?

  

  LJ;1540238 wrote:Ah yes, Vigiliantism. Just what we need to turn this country around amirite?

  If you look at the facts and don't let your emotions get in the way, it does in fact help lower crime rates. An armed society is a polite society, always has been, always will be.
• like_that

  

  Me?;1540242 wrote:Osama bin Laden and Saddam Hussein signed the petition against this bill, just in case you were wondering.
  
  
  I have my CCW permit. I'm for Stand Your Ground, but agree with Belly, training should be increased. IWP, in my class there were people who had never handled a gun before too--and they passed. But they did the necessary things to pass. It isn't that hard, and IMO it shouldn't be that hard. My class was great because my instructor wasn't an idiot. I think the training needs to be changed, if not longer, at least rewired so to speak. Far more time should be spent on the range than in the classroom. The classroom stuff is simple, most of it is redundant, and a lot of it is common sense. Handling a firearm is SIMPLE. I think you could spent about an hour on safe handling and use an unloaded (obviously) gun in the classroom. Then go to the range. Rather than 8 hours in the class and 4 hours on the range, it should be about 9 hours on the range and 3 in the class. In my class, we ended up spending 6 hours on the range. It's MUCH more effective than the classroom. By the end of the day, everyone in my class could handle their firearm well and shoot reasonably well. I didn't even need the class, I could have passed the test right from the start and there is no formal shooting test really--but the goals that my instructor wanted everyone to accomplish on the range I could have easily done the first try with my off hand and my non dominant eye. It is weird when you're in the class with people who have never even shot a gun before though, when you consider the class is designed around carrying one. I think the process of issuing CCW permits is pretty legit, but I do think it could be improved to make everyone more competent.

  Are you still trying to pretend that you are not SQ?
• GoChiefs

  

  LJ;1540238 wrote:Ah yes, Vigiliantism. Just what we need to turn this country around amirite?

  Yes, because the current path the country is on is working perfectly. :thumbup:
• dlazz

  Belly35;1540235 wrote:This is an educational thread and should be viewed by others OC members to advance their knowledge of social issue.

  
• Me?

  

  Yes. I'm pretending that I really am who I know I am.
• LJ

  

  Me?;1540247 wrote:If you look at the facts and don't let your emotions get in the way, it does in fact help lower crime rates. An armed society is a polite society, always has been, always will be.

  Never said anything about being armed. I've had my chl for years.
• Me?

  

  Well, I think you'd be pretty hard pressed to find many vigilantes. Even harder pressed to find some who really screwed up and killed some innocent person. But many stories of someone protecting the life of someone else who was in danger because the law allowed them to do it and they just happened to be there.
• said_aouita

  

  LJ;1540238 wrote:Ah yes, Vigiliantism. Just what we need to turn this country around amirite?

  : thumbup:
• Sonofanump

  vdubb96;1540176 wrote:I thought you were singing Janie's got a gun by the famous band Aerosmith mofo!

  No way!
  
  [video=youtube;bHoPYLQvnQM][/video]
• WebFire

  Me?;1540242 wrote:Osama bin Laden and Saddam Hussein signed the petition against this bill, just in case you were wondering.
  
  
  I have my CCW permit. I'm for Stand Your Ground, but agree with Belly, training should be increased. IWP, in my class there were people who had never handled a gun before too--and they passed. But they did the necessary things to pass. It isn't that hard, and IMO it shouldn't be that hard. My class was great because my instructor wasn't an idiot. I think the training needs to be changed, if not longer, at least rewired so to speak. Far more time should be spent on the range than in the classroom. The classroom stuff is simple, most of it is redundant, and a lot of it is common sense. Handling a firearm is SIMPLE. I think you could spent about an hour on safe handling and use an unloaded (obviously) gun in the classroom. Then go to the range. Rather than 8 hours in the class and 4 hours on the range, it should be about 9 hours on the range and 3 in the class. In my class, we ended up spending 6 hours on the range. It's MUCH more effective than the classroom. By the end of the day, everyone in my class could handle their firearm well and shoot reasonably well. I didn't even need the class, I could have passed the test right from the start and there is no formal shooting test really--but the goals that my instructor wanted everyone to accomplish on the range I could have easily done the first try with my off hand and my non dominant eye. It is weird when you're in the class with people who have never even shot a gun before though, when you consider the class is designed around carrying one. I think the process of issuing CCW permits is pretty legit, but I do think it could be improved to make everyone more competent.

  I agree about the training. And most of the book training can be taught on the range anyway.