Should Penn State get the death penalty?

• se-alum

  

  I still believe the NCAA is over-reaching their boundaries by handing out a punishment here. Punishing PSU serves no purpose, as all the offenders are gone.
• LJ

  

  se-alum;1231385 wrote:I still believe the NCAA is over-reaching their boundaries by handing out a punishment here. Punishing PSU serves no purpose, as all the offenders are gone.

  I agree with this. Like I said before, I think the NCAA needs to wait to see with the DoE does in terms of the Clery Act violations, THEN find some ACTUAL NCAA bylaw violations and hammer PSU on that. Personally I think this is a power grab by the NCAA. They see public outcry from some for them to act, so they are using it as a chance to go after a crimes that are outside the scope of the NCAA.
• WebFire

  se-alum;1231385 wrote:I still believe the NCAA is over-reaching their boundaries by handing out a punishment here. Punishing PSU serves no purpose, as all the offenders are gone.

  What would stop schools from cheating, knowing that by the time they are caught, the offenders are most likely gone? I don't think anyone likes it, necessarily, but how else do you handle it?
• SportsAndLady

  

  A school covered up multiple crimes of child rape...the NCAA can do whatever the hell they want to Penn State, and it would be fair/justified.
• WebFire

  I do find it fascinating that when Michigan did too much stretching, and OSU had a some guys with tattoos and small scale "coverup", it too MONTHS to any sanctions handed down. But with PSU, it's a matter of what, 2 weeks, since a 3rd party report was done. Seems weird.
• LJ

  

  SportsAndLady;1231392 wrote:A school covered up multiple crimes of child rape...the NCAA can do whatever the hell they want to Penn State, and it would be fair/justified.

  Why? That is the DoE's realm as well as the DoJ realm. The DoE can do much more damage to the school than the NCAA can. The DoE could level their own death penalty which basically cuts federal funding to the school and cuts all federal loans to PSU students. Like I said, the NCAA is grabbing for power.
• OneBuckeye

  

  LJ;1231389 wrote:I agree with this. Like I said before, I think the NCAA needs to wait to see with the DoE does in terms of the Clery Act violations, THEN find some ACTUAL NCAA bylaw violations and hammer PSU on that. Personally I think this is a power grab by the NCAA. They see public outcry from some for them to act, so they are using it as a chance to go after a crimes that are outside the scope of the NCAA.

  I agree with this. I think it's Penn State wants sanctions (football related) now rather than later. The Clery Act stuff could take years to conclude. I believe the timing is such that current PSU players will be given the chance to transfer.
• bigkahuna

  WebFire;1231394 wrote:I do find it fascinating that when Michigan did too much stretching, and OSU had a some guys with tattoos and small scale "coverup", it too MONTHS to any sanctions handed down. But with PSU, it's a matter of what, 2 weeks, since a 3rd party report was done. Seems weird.

  I think it's based off of what you said earlier with public outcry as well as the fact that they didn't have to come and do an investigation themselves.
• LJ

  

  OneBuckeye;1231398 wrote:I agree with this. I think it's Penn State wants sanctions (football related) now rather than later. The Clery Act stuff could take years to conclude. I believe the timing is such that current PSU players will be given the chance to transfer.

  I find that a realistic scenario, and with PSU wanting to get any NCAA sanctions out of the way, it clears the path for the NCAA to hand down whatever the hell they want. I just personally think it's bad news for college athletics.
• SportsAndLady

  

  LJ;1231397 wrote:Why? That is the DoE's realm as well as the DoJ realm. The DoE can do much more damage to the school than the NCAA can. The DoE could level their own death penalty which basically cuts federal funding to the school and cuts all federal loans to PSU students. Like I said, the NCAA is grabbing for power.

  I'm just saying I don't feel "bad" for Penn State. The NCAA might be out of line...but who cares? Let them be in this instance.
• LJ

  

  SportsAndLady;1231402 wrote:I'm just saying I don't feel "bad" for Penn State. The NCAA might be out of line...but who cares? Let them be in this instance.

  Because it sets a precedent that could be a slippery slope. I don't care about PSU, they deserve what they get, but this could change the whole landscape of college athletics in the long run.
• OneBuckeye

  

  LJ;1231401 wrote:I find that a realistic scenario, and with PSU wanting to get any NCAA sanctions out of the way, it clears the path for the NCAA to hand down whatever the hell they want. I just personally think it's bad news for college athletics.

  Agreed. Everyone expects the NCAA to punish them and every month they don't it make's PSU look bad (and NCAA) and keeps the focus on them. They know a lot of people will see the NCAA sanctions as the closure to this chapter. There won't be half as much publicity regarding the cleary act trial/findings.
• SportsAndLady

  

  LJ;1231403 wrote:Because it sets a precedent that could be a slippery slope. I don't care about PSU, they deserve what they get, but this could change the whole landscape of college athletics in the long run.

  Well hopefully no other schools let their coordinators buttfuck little boys in their lockerrooms and we won't have to worry about it.
• LJ

  

  SportsAndLady;1231406 wrote:Well hopefully no other schools let their coordinators buttfuck little boys in their lockerrooms and we won't have to worry about it.

  That's not the point. The point is that the NCAA is punishing an athletic program for crimes outside of the NCAA's bylaws. When they level the penalties without any objection from PSU, it basically opens the door to the NCAA being able to say "we don't like what happened here, even though we have no rules against it, we are gonna penalize you"
• OneBuckeye

  

  LJ;1231408 wrote:That's not the point. The point is that the NCAA is punishing an athletic program for crimes outside of the NCAA's bylaws. When they level the penalties without any objection from PSU, it basically opens the door to the NCAA being able to say "we don't like what happened here, even though we have no rules against it, we are gonna penalize you"

  I really wonder how long the NCAA will last before a conference gives them a big F U. They have set precedence that if you cooperate we will hammer you and if you don't you will go scot free...
• SportsAndLady

  

  LJ;1231408 wrote:That's not the point. The point is that the NCAA is punishing an athletic program for crimes outside of the NCAA's bylaws. When they level the penalties without any objection from PSU, it basically opens the door to the NCAA being able to say "we don't like what happened here, even though we have no rules against it, we are gonna penalize you"

  Lack of Institutional Control..?
• LJ

  

  SportsAndLady;1231414 wrote:Lack of Institutional Control..?

  What NCAA bylaws did they lack control over?
• LJ

  

  http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/michael_rosenberg/07/19/penn-state-death-penalty/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
  

  2. This is not the NCAA's job.
  My friend, colleague and eating machine Andy Staples eloquently pointed this out earlier this month: The NCAA exists to enforce NCAA rules. Often, the NCAA doesn't even do that, either through willful disregard, a good-old-administrators network, understaffing or a lack of subpoena power. But when NCAA rules are broken, it is the NCAA's job to determine a penalty. If the NCAA doesn't do that, nobody will.
  This is different. Laws were broken. Most of the key perpetrators are either in jail (Jerry Sandusky); in danger of going to jail (former athletic director Tim Curley, former vice president Gary Schultz, and possibly former president Graham Spanier, though Spanier has not been charged); or dead (Paterno). Former assistant coach Mike McQueary, who witnessed Sandusky assaulting one boy and reported it to his bosses, will probably lose his career. They will all be forever associated with this scandal.
  NCAA sanctions are largely symbolic -- they are supposed to embarrass a university. Well, in the public's mind, Penn State will mean "child rape scandal" for many years. I think the school is pretty well covered on the public-embarrassment front.

• ts1227

  

  SportsAndLady;1231414 wrote:Lack of Institutional Control..?

  
  It's still flimsy because it was covering up shit outside of the NCAA's jurisdiction. But at this point it is what it is and let's just see how big of a nuke Emmert drops on them.
• SportsAndLady

  

  LJ;1231415 wrote:What NCAA bylaws did they lack control over?

  Pres. of Oregon State (talking right now) just said they broke NCAA Bylaws, including lack of control over the athletic department, integrity, and something else I cannot remember.
  
  So yeah, LOIC.
• LJ

  

  SportsAndLady;1231418 wrote:Pres. of Oregon State (talking right now) just said they broke NCAA Bylaws, including lack of control over the athletic department, integrity, and something else I cannot remember.
  
  So yeah, LOIC.

  Flimsy. If PSU were to fight any of the sanctions, I don't think you would see the NCAA coming down with anything right now.
• WebFire

  LJ;1231403 wrote:Because it sets a precedent that could be a slippery slope. I don't care about PSU, they deserve what they get, but this could change the whole landscape of college athletics in the long run.

  Agree. We may not care what happens to PSU, but the NCAA cannot just be reckless and hand down sanctions based off emotions and public outcry.
• isadore

  gosh a ruddies joe just lost the win record
• SportsAndLady

  

  $60M fine
  4 years Bowl Ban
  Scholly's reduced from 25 to 15 for 4 years
  Any current scholarship players can transfer and play immediately
  All wins from '98 to '11 will be vacated
  5 year probation
  Individuals can be hit w/ punishments if necessary.
  
  Dang
• WebFire

  Ouch. And that means all their players, freshman through seniors, can transfer without penalty.