Should Penn State get the death penalty?

• Fab1b

  

  Bob Dole;1227121 wrote:I stopped reading at the first "not fair". It wasn't fair to the kids who continued to be molested while they played hush-up on campus.

  Its not meant in that context yes I understand that but what is done is done! The kids and other potential victims I did list in my thoughts, perhaps it should have been at the top of list I was just adding things as I thought. Do you think any of the victims want PSU Football or athletics shut down?
• vball10set

  No. The NCAA has enough trouble trying to figure out their own rulebook and attempting to be consistent on doling out penalties, so I can only imagine the clusterfuck it would be in their ruling on the death penalty for something that is foreign to just about everyone. Let the criminal justice system do it's thing, and leave the football program to deal with the fallout--it'll be penalty enough.
• Bob Dole

  Fab1b;1227165 wrote: Do you think any of the victims want PSU Football or athletics shut down?

  Does it matter? They're scarred for life. No amount of sanction will ever erase the hell that the University put them through.
• reclegend22

  

  Fab1b;1227165 wrote:Its not meant in that context yes I understand that but what is done is done! The kids and other potential victims I did list in my thoughts, perhaps it should have been at the top of list I was just adding things as I thought. Do you think any of the victims want PSU Football or athletics shut down?

  Exactly. Despite what the popular opinion here seems to be, I don't believe the answer to that question is yes. These kids, like everyone involved, want to successfully move on with their lives and find some sense of happiness. I think they understand that the real culprit is receiving his punishment and will continue to receive it until the end of eternity.
  
  I bet if you polled the victims, most would not want the state of Pennsylvania to lose its pride and joy, the football team that calls Beaver Stadium home, over one man's horrific actions. Perhaps this could be a question for SportsNation?
• WebFire

  reclegend22;1227163 wrote:That's the exact part that I have a difficult time wrapping my head around, only for different reasons than you. If Paterno actually knew firsthand -- or believed, which in my view Paterno chose not to -- that Sandusky was in fact sodomizing children on campus on a regular basis, he could have just gone to the police himself and there would have been zero penalty to him. In fact, in light of helping bring a serial predator to justice, Paterno would have been recognized as an even bigger hero and humanitarian than he already is.
  
  Penn State would have had way more to lose by arranging a coverup than they had to gain. The only thing they would have gained by a coverup is escaping the embarrassment of Sandusky in the news. That would have eventually faded from memory, though, since no other parties were involved in Sanusky's activities, so the idea of a grand coverup just seems pointless. It doesn't make any sense. I think what Paterno, Shultz and Curley are most guilty of is pure negligence and not treating the matter as serious as they should have (i.e. misconstruing Mike McQueary's story as a mix-up).

  Yet, OSU had a weirdo sex offender get close to some recruits, and it cost them a recruit. And OSU did handle it. So I'm not sure I can agree with your statements.
• reclegend22

  

  WebFire;1227175 wrote:Yet, OSU had a weirdo sex offender get close to some recruits, and it cost them a recruit. And OSU did handle it. So I'm not sure I can agree with your statements.

  I'm actually not aware of that situation, but I do stand by my assertion that Penn State would have had WAY more to lose than to gain by deciding to cover it all up.
• Fab1b

  

  Bob Dole;1227170 wrote:Does it matter? They're scarred for life. No amount of sanction will ever erase the hell that the University put them through.

  Yes it does matter. What about the people (and I'm sure this number is huge) that are employed by PSU regarding their athletic programs livelyhoods? They weren't involved but you are gonna shut down the program and take their jobs away too?? This goes beyond playing a game. Peoples lives and careers are at stake, shutting them down to me causes more harm than good!
• FatHobbit

  

  Fab1b;1227075 wrote:2. Not fair to current/former players/current/former coaches who had no knowledge or involvement.
  3. Not fair to the alumni and current/former students who paid $$$$$$ to attend PSU and support their athletics.
  4. Not fair to the Big Ten
  5. Not fair to all the future teams that have already have a scheduled game with PSU along with TV contracts.

  I agree with all of these, but how often does an NCAA penalty affect players/coaches/teams and conferences that had nothing to do with cheating.
  
  The NCAA is so inconsistent I don't think anyone can accurately speculate what they are going to do. (and that's not a dig at people who are speculating. That's what we do on the internet. It's a shot at how inconsistent, unfair and hypocritical the NCAA can be.)
• Tiernan

  I want these bums on the schedule for the next few years, so NO I'd hate to see the NCAA give 'em Death.
• Fab1b

  

  FatHobbit;1227185 wrote:I agree with all of these, but how often does an NCAA penalty affect players/coaches/teams and conferences that had nothing to do with cheating.
  
  The NCAA is so inconsistent I don't think anyone can accurately speculate what they are going to do. (and that's not a dig at people who are speculating. That's what we do on the internet. It's a shot at how inconsistent, unfair and hypocritical the NCAA can be.)

  Yes sanctions will effect people that had no relation to Jerry Sandusky and or others but with that said they don't ever lose regular season games so therefore conference, other teams schedules, TV deals, are not effected. They only lose scholy's, bowl games, and perhaps some coaches that did wrong doing as they should.
• vball10set

  FatHobbit;1227185 wrote: The NCAA is so inconsistent I don't think anyone can accurately speculate what they are going to do. (and that's not a dig at people who are speculating. That's what we do on the internet. It's a shot at how inconsistent, unfair and hypocritical the NCAA can be.)

  My point exactly
• Bob Dole

  Fab1b;1227179 wrote: Peoples lives and careers are at stake

  Peoples lives were at stake for 14 years.
• DeyDurkie5

  

  Underprivileged kids were taken advantage of in a sexual manner by a coach at penn state. Their football team should get the death penalty, plain and simple. Doesn't matter that "the people now didn't have anything to do with it", it's the fact that for years, this was covered up to maintain their image. Put it in their ass, just like sandusky did to those kid's lives.
• Fab1b

  

  Bob Dole;1227241 wrote:Peoples lives were at stake for 14 years.

  Actually longer than that but again there are alot more people that would be effected by this and would lose a ton based on the actions of what 1 man and 5 - 6 people that didn't tell on him. Death penalty is not the answer IMO and I don't think the NCAA will ever use it again. Watch the SMU 30 for 30 and get their perspective now on the death penalty, there is a reason it hasn't been leveled since!
• vball10set

  can a mod make this a poll?
• Fab1b

  

  ^vball its not letting me
• Bob Dole

  Fab1b;1227258 wrote:^vball its not letting me

  It let me. It's a good thing we have moderators around here who know what they're doing.
• reclegend22

  

  The NCAA also shouldn't do anything at all based on a research paper. The Freeh Report, despite what the news media would have you believe, isn't the final say on this matter. For starters, the report doesn't include any interviews from anybody actually involved in the situation at all. Curley, Schultz and Spanier were not available for comment due to obvious legal restraints. Paterno also wasn't interviewed, nor was Mike McQueary, nor anybody of actual relevance. Out of the "millions" of documents that Freeh supposedly sifted through, the only pieces of information offering any real significance are a few ambiguous emails, that, while seemingly damning to Paterno, don't actually prove anything. Do not mistake "reasonable conclusions" for realities.
  
  If the NCAA is going to make some sort of decision on this matter, it should wait until after the trials of Curley, Shultz and Spanier, or at least until these men are more thoroughly interviewed and can elaborate further on the context of the emails presented in the report.
• vball10set

  Fab1b;1227258 wrote:^vball its not letting me

  It worked--thanks
• WebFire

  Fab1b;1227179 wrote:Yes it does matter. What about the people (and I'm sure this number is huge) that are employed by PSU regarding their athletic programs livelyhoods? They weren't involved but you are gonna shut down the program and take their jobs away too?? This goes beyond playing a game. Peoples lives and careers are at stake, shutting them down to me causes more harm than good!

  How many employed at Enron were actually involved in the scandals? Not very damn many. Should they have just let Enron go on?
• WebFire

  reclegend22;1227267 wrote:The NCAA also shouldn't do anything at all based on a research paper. The Freeh Report, despite what the news media would have you believe, isn't the final say on this matter. For starters, the report doesn't include any interviews from anybody actually involved in the situation at all. Curley, Schultz and Spanier were not available for comment due to obvious legal restraints. Paterno also wasn't interviewed, nor was Mike McQueary, nor anybody of actual relevance. Out of the "millions" of documents that Freeh supposedly sifted through, the only pieces of information offering any real significance are a few ambiguous emails, that, while seemingly damning to Paterno, don't actually prove anything. Do not mistake "reasonable conclusions" for realities.
  
  If the NCAA is going to make some sort of decision on this matter, it should wait until after the trials of Curley, Shultz and Spanier, or at least until these men are more thoroughly interviewed and can elaborate further on the context of the emails presented in the report.

  I do agree with this. I think most would.
• Fab1b

  

  Bob Dole;1227264 wrote:It let me. It's a good thing we have moderators around here who know what they're doing.

  You'll see I hardly do any real moderating unless you mess with the HS Wrestling forum
• Fab1b

  

  WebFire;1227277 wrote:How many employed at Enron were actually involved in the scandals? Not very damn many. Should they have just let Enron go on?

  I get that point but this isn't enron. Enron needed shut down, because someone commits a sexual criminal act at your company's facilities should your company be shut down because you didn't report that crime? No you should be fired, possibly arrested and the person who committed the action arrested.
  
  I've thought alot about this, like when USC, OSU, Miami, etc....was in trouble, death penalty this, that, the other. I will admit in my biased fanhood I was screaming for it too until I really gave it some thought. Also watching the 30 for 30 on SMU really makes you think about the "death penalty" in college sports. Most people don't realize the effects the death penalty will have not only on the instituion, but the community, the city, the people, the conference, etc....the economic impact of that decision goes well beyond the football field!
• reclegend22

  

  WebFire;1227278 wrote:I do agree with this. I think most would.

  Would you also agree, then, that the media has inappropriately jumped to rash and severely damaging conclusions based on non-facts in its sensationalizing of Joe Paterno, the child predator accomplice?
  
  I can't believe people. It's as if nobody actually read the report. If they had, they'd see that there are big holes in the information that are filled in with pure conjecture and (possibly) reckless guessing.
  
  ESPN and Tom Rinaldi make me ill.
• WebFire

  reclegend22;1227288 wrote:Would you also agree, then, that the media has inappropriately jumped to rash and severely damaging conclusions based on non-facts in its sensationalizing of Joe Paterno, the child predator accomplice?
  
  I can't believe people. It's as if nobody actually read the report. If they had, they'd see that there are big holes in the information that are filled in with pure conjecture and (possibly) reckless guessing.
  
  ESPN and Tom Rinaldi make me ill.

  Not really. It seemed to be a cover up from the beginning. How do you think people would react to report done by the former FBI head that points in that direction? Public reaction is not a conviction. People thought OJ and Casey Anthony were guilty too.