Indiana @ Ohio State - Sun. 4 pm - CBS

• vball10set

  Laley23;693957 wrote:Well, its just annoying to me for 3 reasons:
  1. Indiana was the first that did the chant, when Jordan Crawford schooled his brother Joe in Assembly Hall. Jordan was a FR and Joe a SR.
  2. When it has been done 3 times already this year, it is unoriginal.
  3. Who cares if Austin is better? Is he coming to OSU? Why do the student care? It doesnt make any sense to me.
  
  The only school who should do it and it would apply is Duke. Any other school...it is just kind of weird and seems out of place.

  I see your point, but to be honest, when do students (except for the Cameron Crazies) make much sense?
• Laley23

  

  jordo212000;693987 wrote:Ok. so when is Indiana going to "break through"? I know everybody loves Crean, but at some point he needs to win right? We had NCAA problems and Matta turned us into a winner in the course of one season

  
  If Im not allowed to put Crean and Knight in the same sentence, we cant put any program in the same sentence as what IU went through except Homer Drew at Baylor. However, he has cheated to get it done, so that turnaround is a little sketchy.
  
  Matta inherited a program with some probation, but he had players returning and could recruit without restrictions I think.
  
  Crean inherited a player where the top 12 players all left the program. He was not allowed to recruit off campus for over a year. He was only allowed 2 Officials Visits (out of 5 for every other coach). He was only allowed half the amount of phone calls as other programs and finally the NCAA didnt level their penalties until many of the 2009 and 2010 recruits had already committed (mid-season) so he had a HELL of a time just to field a team. No one would come of any caliber without knowing they could play in the Tourney.
  
  I have no clue how he was able to sell Maurice Creek and Christian Watford on IU without going to their games and actively recruiting them or being able to have them on campus for a visit. This is the first year essentially and should be looked at as such. By year three, 2012, I think they finish top 3 and compete for the title. Next year they will be top 6 imo.
• centralbucksfan

  Laley23;694017 wrote:I dont think you guys watched him at Marquette. He has always been a bitch lol.

  Probably so. Coaches don't just change. But I think frustrations have gotten the best of him. The "T" today he got, was stupid, and poor timing. The "hook" foul on Watford, was in fact, just that, a good call...then the officials miss a goal tend by IU, then called a questionable charge against OSU..then he gets a tech. Pretty pathetic when you look at the events of the two possessions. Hating Knight for his success is a far cry from hating on Crean for his behavior on the sidelines. Hard to respect the guy when he acts like he does.
• Laley23

  

  vball10set;694018 wrote:I see your point, but to be honest, when do students (except for the Cameron Crazies) make much sense?

  
  This is true. But at least be creative and dont steal 3 other schools chant haha.
  
  I mean, Purdue singing "Party in the USA" last week when Sully was on the line was creative and funny.
  
  and I know this is all IU, but its what I have experienced:
  -Stand up old people (behind the basket is alumni seats on one side, they dont stand during FTs for the opponent)
  -Wheres my laptop (at Marcus Williams of UCONN after he stole the laptops)
  -Jordans better (aforementioned)
  
  Among others I cant recall. Now, they have done some retarded chants as well, and Im sure OSU has done some good and creative ones that make sense. But this just isnt one of them, imo.
• Laley23

  

  centralbucksfan;694027 wrote:Probably so. Coaches don't just change. But I think frustrations have gotten the best of him. The "T" today he got, was stupid, and poor timing. The "hook" foul on Watford, was in fact, just that, a good call...then the officials miss a goal tend by IU, then called a questionable charge against OSU..then he gets a tech. Pretty pathetic when you look at the events of the two possessions. Hating Knight for his success is a far cry from hating on Crean for his behavior on the sidelines. Hard to respect the guy when he acts like he does.

  
  When he wins it will be respect? Thats absurd. Izzo, Weber, Ryan, and K whine ALL GAME LONG as well.
  
  Pritchard got called for a block that couldve been a charge on Sully. I mean, the officials were terrible. Way to many fouls called. This was Creans first tech at IU btw...
• centralbucksfan

  Laley23;694021 wrote:Matta inherited a program with some probation, but he had players returning and could recruit without restrictions I think.
  
  .

  
  Some probation? Matta inherited a program with a HUGE black cloud as the investigation was ongoing with news/rumors of VERY serious allegations (turned out to be true and a NCAA ban). He had "some" players, but not a lot of talent. And he did in fact have some recruiting restrictions in terms of available scholarships. He brought in the Oden class with the NCAA hovering and yet to make any kind of announcement in terms of penalties. Matta/OSU had quite a bit of issues to deal with and he overcame it. Maybe not quite as much as Crean had, but don't kid yourself, it was pretty close. Matta did an unreal job coaching and recruiting with the NCAA breathing down his collar.
• vball10set

  Laley23;694037 wrote:When he wins it will be respect? Thats absurd. Izzo, Weber, Ryan, and K whine ALL GAME LONG as well.
  
  Pritchard got called for a block that couldve been a charge on Sully. I mean, the officials were terrible. Way to many fouls called. This was Creans first tech at IU btw...

  
  I agree with you 1000% on this --they were horrendous!!!
• centralbucksfan

  Laley23;694037 wrote:When he wins it will be respect? Thats absurd. Izzo, Weber, Ryan, and K whine ALL GAME LONG as well.
  
  ...

  
  IF he wins, you mean. And yes, those other guys do as well(no to extent of Crean IMO), but they also walk off the court, look the other coach in the eye with respect, and shake hands like a man. I watched today prior to tip off, and Crean / Matta handshake was a very quick one with Crean doing an about face, quickly walking away from Matta who had taken time to talk with IU asst. coaches.
  Hard to have respect for a guy when he does shit like this....
  
  And yes, I agree the officiating was piss poor...made for a rough game to watch with all the tic tac fouls called.
• Laley23

  

  centralbucksfan;694038 wrote:Some probation? Matta inherited a program with a HUGE black cloud as the investigation was ongoing with news/rumors of VERY serious allegations (turned out to be true and a NCAA ban). He had "some" players, but not a lot of talent. And he did in fact have some recruiting restrictions in terms of available scholarships. He brought in the Oden class with the NCAA hovering and yet to make any kind of announcement in terms of penalties. Matta/OSU had quite a bit of issues to deal with and he overcame it. Maybe not quite as much as Crean had, but don't kid yourself, it was pretty close. Matta did an unreal job coaching and recruiting with the NCAA breathing down his collar.

  
  No it wasnt close. He doesnt get Oden if he cant recruit the kid. I dont care about talent, Matta had a team. Crean didnt have a SINGLE PLAYER!!! It was so bad, that the administration upped the contract from 5 years to 10 when they found out about what Sampson was doing. Loss of Scholarship isnt near as bad as simply not being able to recruit. A black cloud is one thing, Crean actually had to field a team from rec-league players at IU (yes I tried out and got cut after the 3rd round)
• centralbucksfan

  Laley23;694045 wrote:No it wasnt close. He doesnt get Oden if he cant recruit the kid. I dont care about talent, Matta had a team. Crean didnt have a SINGLE PLAYER!!! It was so bad, that the administration upped the contract from 5 years to 10 when they found out about what Sampson was doing. Loss of Scholarship isnt near as bad as simply not being able to recruit. A black cloud is one thing, Crean actually had to field a team from rec-league players at IU (yes I tried out and got cut after the 3rd round)

  
  I don't totally disagree you...but Matta bringing in the top ranked class, with Oden...with NCAA allegations yet to be announced ...was pretty amazing IMO. He didn't just bring in a good class, he brought in a great class.
  
  And, Crean has been there 3yrs now. Yes, he finally has a recruit coming in, with more in the future. But its taken him a while to do so. Matta turned OSU around overnite. Didn't take him 3+yrs.
  BTW, thats pretty cool you tried out. As bad as some of these IU players look...I am surprised you didn't make it!
• jordo212000

  

  Laley, I can understand Crean not winning right away, but man, at what point does the "sanctions" excuse go away? They don't even appear to be close. I guess that was my point.
• stroups

  

  I will only start liking crean if he comes out with an awsome golf instructional video
• Laley23

  

  jordo212000;694083 wrote:Laley, I can understand Crean not winning right away, but man, at what point does the "sanctions" excuse go away? They don't even appear to be close. I guess that was my point.

  
  eh, Watford has a broken hand, Creek never recovered and now has another stress fracture, our 7 footer is ineligible. The sanctions arent really an excuse for bad coaching, which Ive seen a whole lot of with Crean. But it is a reality as to why it has taken him so long to get recruits. He said when he took the job, "2012 is the only class I am not behind in recruiting wise. I will lock the boarders to this state starting with 2012." The fact he got Zeller away from UNC is a small miracle. If you watched IU in the middle of the year, you can see they arent that bad. You cant look at the way they play against the best team in the country...thats just not really fair. It takes mental fortitude to win on the road, and you dont get that with underclassmen, which is all the team is. Plus they dont match up with OSU at all (see my first post in the thread).
  
  They are closer than some believe.
• Laley23

  

  centralbucksfan;694048 wrote:I don't totally disagree you...but Matta bringing in the top ranked class, with Oden...with NCAA allegations yet to be announced ...was pretty amazing IMO. He didn't just bring in a good class, he brought in a great class.
  
  And, Crean has been there 3yrs now. Yes, he finally has a recruit coming in, with more in the future. But its taken him a while to do so. Matta turned OSU around overnite. Didn't take him 3+yrs.
  BTW, thats pretty cool you tried out. As bad as some of these IU players look...I am surprised you didn't make it!

  
  But Im not comparing him to OSU. Someone else did and I simply responded. What Matta did at OSU was amazing. Expecting Crean to be able to do it as well isnt really fair.
  
  Not liking the guy is fine, but some people on here and nationally just arent looking at the big picture and arent giving this guy a fair chance to succeed.
• Laley23

  

  As for the Crean-Matta handshake/respect/whatever. They dont like each other, so what? It isnt as if Crean just walks off the court versus everyone, its only Matta.
  
  Should he hide that in public? Probably. But Matta obviously did something that pissed Crean off at some point, and vice-versa. I dont really see the big deal about that. Having little feuds like this is good for the game.
• Midstate01

  

  It'd make good for a rivalry. If their was one.
• hoops23

  

  In college bball, you're only as good as your next recruiting class.
  
  IU has a pretty good one coming in next year, so this year could be forgotten by this time next season.
• Laley23

  

  hoops23;694307 wrote:In college bball, you're only as good as your next recruiting class.
  
  IU has a pretty good one coming in next year, so this year could be forgotten by this time next season.

  
  It really isnt that great. Everyone keeps saying that, which is just going to make next seasons struggles more amplified nationally, if and when there are struggles. He has 2 players, Cody Zeller and Austin Etherington. The big one, with possibly 3 or 4 Burger Boys, is 2012.
• hoops23

  

  Laley23;694309 wrote:It really isnt that great. Everyone keeps saying that, which is just going to make next seasons struggles more amplified nationally, if and when there are struggles. He has 2 players, Cody Zeller and Austin Etherington. The big one, with possibly 3 or 4 Burger Boys, is 2012.

  
  Ah, I think I just got them mixed up... I knew he had a big one, I thought it was next year though...
  
  Even so, the quality of talent is going to be much higher next season, and some of these current freshman do have some upside.
• Laley23

  

  hoops23;694310 wrote:Ah, I think I just got them mixed up... I knew he had a big one, I thought it was next year though...
  
  Even so, the quality of talent is going to be much higher next season, and some of these current freshman do have some upside.

  
  That I agree with. And it isnt just you. EVERYONE keeps saying the talent is coming next year, when in reality, its just 1 guy.
  
  The biggest thing will be the SOs becoming JRs. I think that is typically the biggest leap in a players career. Hulls, Watford, and Elston as JRs is going to be lightyears better than Hulls, Watford and Elston this year.
  
  Sheehey and Oladipo have shown flashes of talent as well.
  
  The biggest thing is Zeller fills the biggest role of this team. An offensive and defensive post presence.
• Laley23

  

  I love this out of Matta lol. Why did he say it???
  
  When talking about reaching out to Coach Knight about improving his defense and just team in general:

  "I've helped facilitate a few things for him, and he's (reciprocated). But he's like, 'Don't you tell anybody that I'm doing this,'" Matta said.
  
  "He wants us to do well. It's unbelievable. I love talking to him because, No.1, you get so much basketball-wise. And then you get a lesson in history. And then you laugh your (rear end) off because he's one of the funniest human beings I've ever talked to."

• Big Gain

  Laley23;694021 wrote:
  Matta inherited a program with some probation, but he had players returning and could recruit without restrictions I think.

  
  How soon you forget. Matta in his 2nd season won a Big Ten Title with very little talent. In one year he turned Terrence Dials a 3-star recruit into Big Ten Player of the Year, from a lost Junior averaging 9ppg. This is what Matta had. Jamar Butler a Soph and Ivan Harris a Junior were the only players on the roster recruited by anyone higher than a MAC school and Harris didn't do squat until he was a Senior. The rest of the roster: Braydon Bell, Sylvester Mayes, Samuel Payne, all house hold names??? Jekel Foster a 2-star, Ron Lewis a transfer from Bowling Green. Matt Sylvester who was known for one shot in his entire career, Twigs, and JJ. Not another coach in the Big Ten could have won a Big Ten Title with that roster.
• Big Gain

  Zeller weighs 210 pounds, he can defend Sullinger?
• Big Gain

  hoops23;693787 wrote:I don't think if OSU counted on Thomas for that much time, they'd suck. The dude was one of the top recruits for a reason and it's proven that relying on freshman, especially great ones doesn't really hinder your teams performance.

  If Buford leaves early, next year Thomas will average 20 and Sullinger will average 10. Thomas won't pass into Sully.
• Big Gain

  Midstate01;693928 wrote:Haha whatever crean said to matta made matta roll his eyes and shake his head after he got by him.

  
  Crean was pissed because Matta talked to one of the officials leaving the floor for halftime. Crean said, "I don't do that and I don't think coaches should be allowed to." LOLOLOLOLO