Ohio Chatter DEV

believer

I Wear Pants;1090163 wrote:I think the problem Paul supporters have is that people like you have always written him off and always talk about him with that "well he has no chance" tone. If people like yourself did that with the actual shitty candidates maybe people wouldn't vote for them, attitudes and confidence effect elections just like they do the stock market.
...........

If you have ever felt attached to a political party in the modern world congratulations, you're fucking retarded.

Although I'll admit to voting Republican 90% of the time, the only reason I might appear "attached" to the party is because I tend to be a realist and a pragmatist. This country has a two-party system. Third parties rarely - if ever - have any success EXCEPT to skew the vote to one of the major parties or the other thereby serving to tip the political scale in the exact opposite direction the third party had hoped to fix. Therefore, I will always cast my general election vote for the major party candidate whose political views come closest to mine...which - for better or worse - almost always goes Republican.

It may seem "fucking retarded", but when the Paulists help get Obama re-elected by default, at least I'll sleep well at night knowing my vote went the best possible political direction.

HitsRus

If you have ever felt attached to a political party in the modern world congratulations, you're ****ing retarded.

Ah yes, all people who have an opposing viewpoint to yours are stupid and if they aren't they are naive.

****ing incredible this attitude

...said by the same person within 2 consecutive posts. SMH.

Although I'll admit to voting Republican 90% of the time, the only reason I might appear "attached" to the party is because I tend to be a realist and a pragmatist. This country has a two-party system. Third parties rarely - if ever - have any success EXCEPT to skew the vote to one of the major parties or the other thereby serving to tip the political scale in the exact opposite direction the third party had hoped to fix. Therefore, I will always cast my general election vote for the major party candidate whose political views come closest to mine...

Props and reps.
I am likely to vote for Paul in the primary, but I'll be damned if I'm going to vote any thing other than "R" in the fall. There are a lot of things about Paul that I like, and some things that I don't like, but I could say that about all the "R" candidates. What I hope is that Paul goes to the convention with enough delegates to effect change within the party and some of his ideas are written into the platform. That is the way you effect change within the system ( which is what it is). You start at the grass roots level and build up the base for your views. You cannot start at the top and expect the base to fall in line. Even if Paul was elected, he would not have enough support in congress to effect any sort of meaningful change. Right now he has only about 10%...but if he were to build that into the Republican party platform and continue to pick up support, it could set the stage for like minded candidates to be elected to Congress and eventually the presidency in the future.

I Wear Pants

believer;1090221 wrote:Although I'll admit to voting Republican 90% of the time, the only reason I might appear "attached" to the party is because I tend to be a realist and a pragmatist. This country has a two-party system. Third parties rarely - if ever - have any success EXCEPT to skew the vote to one of the major parties or the other thereby serving to tip the political scale in the exact opposite direction the third party had hoped to fix. Therefore, I will always cast my general election vote for the major party candidate whose political views come closest to mine...which - for better or worse - almost always goes Republican.

It may seem "fucking retarded", but when the Paulists help get Obama re-elected by default, at least I'll sleep well at night knowing my vote went the best possible political direction.

Just to be clear, you don't strike me as the type of person who is really invested in one party or the other. I may disagree with some of your views but I believe they are yours and not ones you have simply because your party says so.

Footwedge

I Wear Pants;1090163 wrote:Acting like we have a legitimate choice in elections is pretending that choosing between Coke and Pepsi is a choice between two distinct things. It isn't, they're both sodas they just come in a different colored can. And we're essentially limited to Coke or Pepsi, we can't choose Mountain Dew or something like Jones Soda at all. We have only the illusion of choice and most people are stupid enough to get invested in the argument. "Coke is ruining the soft drink market with it's propping up of the rich!" "Pepsi is stealing from the successful to give to the lazy!".

If you have ever felt attached to a political party in the modern world congratulations, you're ****ing retarded.

Spot on and reps for this.

derek bomar

I Wear Pants;1090163 wrote:If you have been paying attention I've been talking about how shitty Santorum is far before the "MSM" gave a shit. I don't watch that crap.

And you're lying to yourself if you think it's all slanted liberally. The last few times I've watched it was basically "we need to go to war with Iran" propaganda.

I think the problem Paul supporters have is that people like you have always written him off and always talk about him with that "well he has no chance" tone. If people like yourself did that with the actual shitty candidates maybe people wouldn't vote for them, attitudes and confidence effect elections just like they do the stock market.

Funny how you say Santorum won't be able to do what he wants as it violates the constitution yet you believe (I think) that Obamacare and other policies like his violate the constitution. Seems a bit of a contradictory stance to hold.

I don't put much stock into people listening to the constitution because we have shit like the Patriot Act, DMCA (parts of that at least), and will have some form of something like SOPA/PIPA soon. These guys on both sides are trampling all over our liberties and most people are perfectly fine with them doing it.

Acting like we have a legitimate choice in elections is pretending that choosing between Coke and Pepsi is a choice between two distinct things. It isn't, they're both sodas they just come in a different colored can. And we're essentially limited to Coke or Pepsi, we can't choose Mountain Dew or something like Jones Soda at all. We have only the illusion of choice and most people are stupid enough to get invested in the argument. "Coke is ruining the soft drink market with it's propping up of the rich!" "Pepsi is stealing from the successful to give to the lazy!".

If you have ever felt attached to a political party in the modern world congratulations, you're fucking retarded.

well said

majorspark

believer;1090221 wrote:Although I'll admit to voting Republican 90% of the time, the only reason I might appear "attached" to the party is because I tend to be a realist and a pragmatist. This country has a two-party system. Third parties rarely - if ever - have any success EXCEPT to skew the vote to one of the major parties or the other thereby serving to tip the political scale in the exact opposite direction the third party had hoped to fix. Therefore, I will always cast my general election vote for the major party candidate whose political views come closest to mine...which - for better or worse - almost always goes Republican..

I hear you bro. Stem the tide until the good guys come along and set things right. Thats what we are hoping for. But how long can we continue the game when we watch elected candidate after elected candidate have their balls snipped the moment they enter DC? You and I have both expressed our frustration by cutting off our hard earned dollars we in the past have given to the RNC. I have long hoped for an overthrow of the republican establishment from within the base ranks. We had such hopes with the "tea party" movement. Yet even some of those candidates elected riding that wave folded like cheap lawn chairs when it came down to it.

Count me in as one hoping for a brokered convention. Let loose the Ronulans. Lets have the shit hit the fan. Its high time for a little political war within the party. High time to air our grievances. I for one am tired of dining on shit burgers with just a little less shit. I can still taste the shit.

As for you Ronulans. Most of us you have debated against have stated we will likely vote for Paul in our respective primaries. By stating so we recognize that he is the candidate that at this point in time best holds our core convictions. We have our disagreements. But at this point in the general election its not Ron Paul or bust for some. Understand their point of view. The 3rd party BS will fail nationally this round as it has in the past. It will not succeed at the national level unless it is birthed at the grass roots and works its way from the bottom up. People always cry 3rd party when they don't like the national plate they have been served by the two parties. Then fade away until the next nasty platter is served.

Those crying about a 3rd party get out their and get it started. It will take grass roots work. I'll pitch in.

believer

majorspark;1090837 wrote:I hear you bro. Stem the tide until the good guys come along and set things right. Thats what we are hoping for. But how long can we continue the game when we watch elected candidate after elected candidate have their balls snipped the moment they enter DC? You and I have both expressed our frustration by cutting off our hard earned dollars we in the past have given to the RNC. I have long hoped for an overthrow of the republican establishment from within the base ranks. We had such hopes with the "tea party" movement. Yet even some of those candidates elected riding that wave folded like cheap lawn chairs when it came down to it.

Count me in as one hoping for a brokered convention. Let loose the Ronulans. Lets have the shit hit the fan. Its high time for a little political war within the party. High time to air our grievances. I for one am tired of dining on shit burgers with just a little less shit. I can still taste the shit.

As for you Ronulans. Most of us you have debated against have stated we will likely vote for Paul in our respective primaries. By stating so we recognize that he is the candidate that at this point in time best holds our core convictions. We have our disagreements. But at this point in the general election its not Ron Paul or bust for some. Understand their point of view. The 3rd party BS will fail nationally this round as it has in the past. It will not succeed at the national level unless it is birthed at the grass roots and works its way from the bottom up. People always cry 3rd party when they don't like the national plate they have been served by the two parties. Then fade away until the next nasty platter is served.

Those crying about a 3rd party get out their and get it started. It will take grass roots work. I'll pitch in.

Kudos to you sir. I couldn't have said it any better.

I would also enjoy seeing a brokered convention. It would be a refreshing change of pace and a nice shake-up of the party establishment which has clearly lost its way.

pmoney25

Sorry for no embed but I am on my phone

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOaCemmsnNk&feature=youtube_gdata_player

BGFalcons82

FU Bob Schieffer - http://www.theblaze.com/stories/my-child-was-not-stillborn-rick-santorum-gets-heated-with-bob-schieffer-during-prenatal-testing-discussion/

Two things: 1) This issue about Santorum's child that only lived a couple hours, yet the press is convinced if they tell the lie that it was still-born and became a toy, just won't go away. If they repeat it enough, eventually it will stick, eh? 2) Rick is 100% correct in his observation of prenatal TESTING vs. prenatal CARE. I can remember my wife's doctor advocating against amniocentisis unless it was absolutely necessary as it does carry risks. We did not have it done with any of our 3 children. With ObamaKare, the choice is made free (nee stipulated, Kathleen???), and risks are increased. Rick's dead right as it will be used to subsidize the abortion industry.

I Wear Pants

Found out Ron Paul wrestled in high school. I like him even more now.

jhay78

Gallup: Santorum opens double-digit national lead over Romney:

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/gallup-santorum-opens-dougle-digit-national-lead-over-romney-36-26

(CNSNews.com) - Former Sen. Rick Santorum of Pennsylvania has opened a double-digit lead over former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney in Gallup’s national tracking poll of the Republican presidential race.

In the five-day polling period ending on Sunday, Feb. 19, Santorum was first with 36 percent, Romney was second with 26 percent, former House Speaker Newt Gingrich was third with 13 percent, and Rep. Ron Paul of Texas was fourth with 11 percent.

Each day, Gallup publishes the five-day rolling average of the results from its tracking poll of the Republican presidential primary field. Gallup’s tracking poll for the five-day period from Feb. 14-19, surveyed 1,194 registered Republican voters and Republican-leaning independents and had a margin of error of +/- 4 points. Santorum’s 10-point lead in this survey was larger than the poll’s margin of error.

Santorum has gained 20 points in Gallup’s tracking poll in the last two weeks, while Romney has dropped 11 points. In the five-day polling period ending on Feb. 6, Romney led the Republican field with 37 percent, Gingrich was second with 22 percent, Santorum was third with 16 percent and Paul was fourth with 11 percent.

On Feb. 7, Santorum won caucuses in Colorado and Minnesota and a non-binding primary in Missouri. Next Tuesday, Feb. 28, Republicans will hold presidential primaries in Michigan and Arizona.

believer

BGFalcons82;1090970 wrote:Rick's dead right as it will be used to subsidize the abortion industry.

You can count on it.

gut

believer;1091397 wrote:You can count on it.

So liberals pride themselves out of helping the weak, but they're going to favor a woman's choice over the life of a handicapped child?

believer

gut;1091403 wrote:So liberals pride themselves out of helping the weak, but they're going to favor a woman's choice over the life of a handicapped child?

apparently

pmoney25

Santorum is jumping on the social consevative train because when it comes to fiscal conservatism he doesnt have a leg to stand on.

We are at a point where our economy is crumbling, jobs are being lost, americans are dying fighting stupid wars and the biggest story on the campaign trail is birth control and prenatal treatments.

When are people going to wake up and get rid of these clowns who do absolutely nothing to fix this country?

Con_Alma

pmoney25;1091590 wrote:...

When are people going to wake up and get rid of these clowns who do absolutely nothing to fix this country?

I don't want someone who is going to fix the country. I want someone who won't damage it anymore.

We as people are pretty capable of correcting a lot of economic issues. Our entrepreneurial spirit has made this country. We are getting in so deep, however, that we may not be able to recover.

Give us chance. Get the dang "I can save the country" politicians away from the office and the House and we'll be fine. Just don't make it worse.

The only significant thing we need the feds to do is protect the unalienable rights and provide a strong military and protect us. Everything else is simply a social and economic experiment.

believer

pmoney25;1091590 wrote:When are people going to wake up and get rid of these clowns who do absolutely nothing to fix this country?

Well, you and the other Ronulans can write-in your hero's name this November and help Obama win a second term which would, of course, be far worse than voting for the social conservative bandwagon.

Maybe things need to get worse so the people will finally wake-up.

pmoney25

Con_Alma;1091608 wrote:I don't want someone who is going to fix the country. I want someone who won't damage it anymore.

We as people are pretty capable of correcting a lot of economic issues. Our entrepreneurial spirit has made this country. We are getting in so deep, however, that we may not be able to recover.

Give us chance. Get the dang "I can save the country" politicians away from the office and the House and we'll be fine. Just don't make it worse.

The only significant thing we need the feds to do is protect the unalienable rights and provide a strong military and protect us. Everything else is simply a social and economic experiment.

Yea I agree the fed govt needs to get out of our lives. however we do need people to start that change. What has made this country great is people who precipitated change. Just keeping the status quo is a cheap way out. Accepting mediocrity is no way to live.

I Wear Pants

believer;1091612 wrote:Well, you and the other Ronulans can write-in your hero's name this November and help Obama win a second term which would, of course, be far worse than voting for the social conservative bandwagon.

Maybe things need to get worse so the people will finally wake-up.

I disagree. Especially if the candidate is someone like Santorum who scares the shit out of me.

Quotes like:
“It's become part of our national religion, if you will,” he continued. “The point I was trying to make was that the national faith, the national ideal, is rooted in the Christian ideal — in the Judeo-Christian concept of the person.”

Are horrifying. We do not have a national faith or religion, nor were we intended to by the founders.

majorspark

Someone is paranoid.

gut

pmoney25;1091590 wrote: We are at a point where our economy is crumbling, jobs are being lost, americans are dying fighting stupid wars and the biggest story on the campaign trail is birth control and prenatal treatments.

The only explanation I can think of is most Americans aren't as disillusioned with the economy, the deficit, and the 1% as being made out. And why would they be? 90% of the country have jobs but only a little less than half them pay taxes - so for them the economy and everything else is just fine, but the decaying moral fabric of the country really gets their goat!

Romney is simply the guy I would like to see. He at least has the makings and experience of someone who understands economics and business, some who theoretically, at least, has the capability of making an impact on the fiscal condition of this country. His liberal/social leanings don't bother me - that's ultimately the direction of about every advanced economy/society in the world. I don't have any issue with the platform, in fact I can support or agree with much of the liberal platform from an idealistic perspective. My beef is the way liberals plow ahead irresponsibly to push their agenda. It's like letting a blind man drive a car with no brakes and no steering toward the cliff - the liberal answer to this danger would be better crash testing, better airbags, and perhaps a giant super-strength safety net at the cliff's edge or bungee cord attached to the bumper.

I Wear Pants

majorspark;1091717 wrote:Someone is paranoid.

How so?

sjmvsfscs08

I Wear Pants;1091687 wrote:I disagree. Especially if the candidate is someone like Santorum who scares the shit out of me.

Quotes like:
“It's become part of our national religion, if you will,” he continued. “The point I was trying to make was that the national faith, the national ideal, is rooted in the Christian ideal — in the Judeo-Christian concept of the person.”

Are horrifying. We do not have a national faith or religion, nor were we intended to by the founders.

I fucking hate Santorum, but I think he does have a bit of a point here.

I mean, the founders never, ever envisioned a day when people would make up a sizable minority in the US who weren't Judeo-Christian to the max. 100% of them were Christians or at least were modeled after the "Judeo-Christian concept of a person."

That said, you have the right to be whatever religion you want in this country...sorta. And it will stay that way regardless of what this election is about.

It's pretty fucking dumb that the national conversation right now is about social issues. Americans are pathetic.

I Wear Pants

sjmvsfscs08;1091725 wrote:I fucking hate Santorum, but I think he does have a bit of a point here.

I mean, the founders never, ever envisioned a day when people would make up a sizable minority in the US who weren't Judeo-Christian to the max. 100% of them were Christians or at least were modeled after the "Judeo-Christian concept of a person."

That said, you have the right to be whatever religion you want in this country...sorta. And it will stay that way regardless of what this election is about.

It's pretty fucking dumb that the national conversation right now is about social issues. Americans are pathetic.

Do I really need to whip out the quotes from founders showcasing that we are not founded on Christianity?

This idea of Judea-Christian values is stupid because what people are referring to as Judeo-Christian values for the most part is just not being an asshole and personal liberty and the idea that we should help each other out. Which isn't exclusive to Judeo-Christian thinking at all.

The national conversation is about social issues because that's what Republicans seem to always want to do.

majorspark

I Wear Pants;1091723 wrote:How so?

What scares you about Santorum's quote? Is he argueing for establishing a national religion? Note the three words "if you will".

Do these words horrify you?

“If I’m willing to give something up as somebody who’s been extraordinarily blessed, and give up some of the tax breaks that I enjoy, I actually think that’s going to make economic sense, But for me as a Christian, it also coincides with Jesus’s teaching that ‘for unto whom much is given, much shall be required."

Wall Street reform: makes the economy stronger for everyone and abides by God’s command to love thy neighbor as thyself, because it helped people who had been hurt or treated unfairly by financial institutions.

There is a “biblical call” to care for the poor and to follow “the responsibility we’re given in Proverbs to‘Speak up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all who are destitute.’”

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