New World Order and American Sovereignty

• fast_orange

  Friends,
  
  Is it your opinion that we americans will see the emergence of a New World Order (NWO) in the next year? What do you think this will mean for those of us who love our freedoms?
  
  First of all, we are under a declared national emergency with H1N1.
  
  http://www.flu.gov/professional/federal/h1n1emergency10242009.html
  
  For those of you who are not in the "know", that translates to dictorial power to Mr Obama through exectitive orders, and by-passes the senate vote for a term of 6 months.
  
  The second item I wish to mention is the Copenhagen Treaty in Dec 2009.
  
  http://www.infowars.com/climate-treaty-will-create-world-government-dictatorship/
  
  Here’s what it says about the distribution of wealth in the Copenhagen Treaty Draft:
  
  17. [[Developed [and developing] countries] [Developed and developing country Parties] [All Parties] [shall] [should]:]
  
  (a) Compensate for damage to the LDCs’ economy and also compensate for lost opportunities, resources, lives, land and dignity, as many will become environmental refugees;
  
  (b) Africa, in the context of environmental justice, should be equitably compensated for environmental, social and economic losses arising from the implementation of response measures.
  
  I encourage all replies, as I would like to hear some feedback on this important topic.
  
  fast_orange
• eersandbeers

  The new world order already exists. The problem is people don't know how to recognize it. They do not overtly control our governments. That is the stupid way to do it. They control our banking institutions which gives them de facto control of the government. A small wealthy elite group controls the vast majority of the world's resources.
• ptown_trojans_1

  

  No. I understand the concern and value the opinions, but am not a believer.
• Gobuckeyes1

  I don't doubt that this is in the works and has been for some time (since the end of WWII and the formation of the UN)...but it's not going to happen in the next year.
• Elliot Stabler

  He sounds like Glenn Beck
  
  I don't believe this will happen anytime soon
• SQ_Crazies

  

  If you aren't a believer, what that really means is you aren't paying attention. You may think you're paying attention, but you're not.
• LJ

  

  NO name calling.
  
  Let's keep this thread on track
• SQ_Crazies

  

  He called me Glenn. I think I can handle it lol.
  
  I don't even listen to or watch Glenn Beck.
• Elliot Stabler

  LJ...what the hell man.
  
  I'm trying to add some humor here...and you delete my post. Whats up with that?
• SQ_Crazies

  

  Name calling. You called me Glenn, lol. For all he knows that could be my name.
  
  I understand rules, but don't take us back to JJHuddle rules when you couldn't even call someone stupid.
• cbus4life

  SQ_Crazies wrote: If you aren't a believer, what that really means is you aren't paying attention. You may think you're paying attention, but you're not.

  I.E. You can't have a different opinion than mine. And if you do, that opinion is stupid.
  
  I'm certainly paying attention, but not sure what to think, at the moment. Certainly lots of compelling evidence, but i'm not sold completely.
• LJ

  

  SQ_Crazies wrote: Name calling. You called me Glenn, lol. For all he knows that could be my name.
  
  I understand rules, but don't take us back to JJHuddle rules when you couldn't even call someone stupid.

  You can't call someone stupid on this forum. You can call their opinion stupid, but I am enforcing strict rules on no name calling and no personal attacks. Intelligent conversation doesn't need it, and I won't tolerate it.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  cbus4life wrote:

  SQ_Crazies wrote: If you aren't a believer, what that really means is you aren't paying attention. You may think you're paying attention, but you're not.

  I.E. You can't have a different opinion than mine.

  Um...I'm not really sure how to respond considering that isn't anywhere near where I was going with that. I'm a huge advocate of different opinions, but opinions turn to nothing when facts are presented. The NWO is no joke, if you can't see it then you aren't looking deep enough. Almost all of the information that people have attained is out there, but if it isn't mainstream then people either don't believe it or never hear it. Doesn't mean it isn't true.
• cbus4life

  Fair enough.
  
  Like Ptown, i enjoy the links and information and opinions, but i'm not sold.
  
  Doesn't mean i'm not informed, or have not looked enough, just can't form a solid opinion, atm.
  
  But, as i said once on the old politics forum, i appreciate Eeers views on this, and it is very interesting.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  You know people say things like this are crazy...until they get slapped in the face by them.
  
  Just a few examples to ponder:
  
  1. Hitler's Germany. Many people thought those that were saying "look out for this guy" were crazy in the 30's. Need I go on?
  
  2. Ron Paul. He's been labelled as the definition of crazy. He started talking about the Federal Reserve and the economy in the 80's and how it was bound for disaster with it's current setup. People called him a nut job. He predicted everything that our economy just went through 20 years ago--nut job?? Crazy??
• I Wear Pants

  You just lost the debate if we're to follow Godwin's Law.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  Um, so I lose the debate for comparing something to one of the biggest events in the history of man?
  
  I believe Godwin said that the probability of relating something to Hitler or the Nazi's becomes greater as the discussion continues, I don't think he said that whoever does it loses the debate lol. That was just decided by people that followed it--and what difference does it make anyways? It's an observation not a law.
• I Wear Pants

  "For example, there is a tradition in many newsgroups and other Internet discussion forums that once such a comparison is made, the thread is finished and whoever mentioned the Nazis has automatically "lost" whatever debate was in progress" - Wikipedia
  
  And I was mostly joking.
  
  It's just that this type of "We're all being controlled" type of whistle blowing has been going on for a long time and I've yet to see anything that actually substantiates anything that isn't standard going in the political/economic world.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  It's been going on because it's been happening. It isn't a theory, it's reality. But it's not something that happens over night or over a 5 year period for that matter.
• BoatShoes

  So suppose I keep a blind eye and don't start calling for the end of the Fed and don't raise hell about Copenhagen treaties and continue to think people with the last name Bilderberg, Rothschild and Rockefeller really aren't that scary and that secretive ninja bankers aren't going to assassinate me if I protest the central bank? What do you guys, who think this is all going down, think is going to happen to the world? Do you think that Heads of State such as the president are merely pawns for financiers to make money? Is Ben Bernanke at the heart of a global conspiracy and not some economist who thinks he's doing the right thing for the country by propping up inefficiently managed financial institutions and keeping interest rates amazingly low?
  
  How far does it go? My sister in law works at the Cleveland Fed. Is she in on it?
  
  I mean realistically, although the news stinks, there are talented, investigative reporters out there who work for major newspapers. Why aren't reporters for the Cleveland Plain Dealer able to figure this out but obscure web sites like Infowars.com can? I mean, say, Eersandbeers becomes a reporter, does he all of a sudden not care about finding out the truth of something like a global conspiracy because he works for a liberal news media racket? There's got to be at least one freedom losing newspaper journalist who would care enough to uncover something like this right? Is that a fantasy?
  
  I mean where is the hardcore proof? It seems analagous to alien abduction type stuff to me. Where are the well respected guys with Ph.D's who believe this is going on? I will grant you that there are many intelligent people such as Dr. Ron Paul and other libertarians and "true conservatives" who believe strongly in ending the fed and the ills of centralized planning and central banking, etc...these arguments seem rational and that reasonable men could easily hold such beliefs...but, it seems to me, respected Austrians and Libertarians, etc. aren't talking about the Illuminati and NWO, etc. Murray Rothbard didn't start an institute promoting the ending of the NWO, etc.
  
  For instance, a brief scan of "Lord Christopher Monckton" on wikipedia, the guy being interviewed by Glenn Beck, is a guy who calls himself a "world renowned expert" on climate change and is a global warming skeptic but has no science training at all. And, you know, that's fine if you don't believe in global warming...reasonable people can be skeptical of anthropogenic warming and warming in general...but seriously, this is the guy who's your source for the belief that the world is going to be one world government? I mean, to me, citing wikipedia is more credible.
  
  I mean, it sounds like I'm just "attacking the source" instead of the argument, which is a logic fallacy; but I mean when a person is alleging something so grand as a NWO, the burden of proof is high and I don't think the burden is satisfied by obscure message boards and websites...but you know, maybe I'm just a blind sheep I guess? Foolish for not thinking the world is simply as it seems? Could be, I've been wrong before, wrong a lot in fact, but I guess I'm just not convinced. Maybe I need to be a little more open minded and head down a cartesian spiral of doubt.
  
  I mean, I'm open to the idea that the FED is bad for the economy and the antithesis to a healthy free market and that it's demise is therefore justified...but on the grounds of misguided economic policy as opposed to, mysterious, international bankers secretly profiting off of little measly, blissfully ignorant humans.
• I Wear Pants

  ^ This is what I was too lazy/stupid to respond with.
• unique_67

  I pretty much agree with the sentiments of both Ptown and eers.
• fast_orange

  BoatShoes wrote: So suppose I keep a blind eye and don't start calling for the end of the Fed and don't raise hell about Copenhagen treaties and continue to think people with the last name Bilderberg, Rothschild and Rockefeller really aren't that scary and that secretive ninja bankers aren't going to assassinate me if I protest the central bank? What do you guys, who think this is all going down, think is going to happen to the world? Do you think that Heads of State such as the president are merely pawns for financiers to make money? Is Ben Bernanke at the heart of a global conspiracy and not some economist who thinks he's doing the right thing for the country by propping up inefficiently managed financial institutions and keeping interest rates amazingly low?
  
  How far does it go? My sister in law works at the Cleveland Fed. Is she in on it?
  
  I mean realistically, although the news stinks, there are talented, investigative reporters out there who work for major newspapers. Why aren't reporters for the Cleveland Plain Dealer able to figure this out but obscure web sites like Infowars.com can? I mean, say, Eersandbeers becomes a reporter, does he all of a sudden not care about finding out the truth of something like a global conspiracy because he works for a liberal news media racket? There's got to be at least one freedom losing newspaper journalist who would care enough to uncover something like this right? Is that a fantasy?
  
  I mean where is the hardcore proof? It seems analagous to alien abduction type stuff to me. Where are the well respected guys with Ph.D's who believe this is going on? I will grant you that there are many intelligent people such as Dr. Ron Paul and other libertarians and "true conservatives" who believe strongly in ending the fed and the ills of centralized planning and central banking, etc...these arguments seem rational and that reasonable men could easily hold such beliefs...but, it seems to me, respected Austrians and Libertarians, etc. aren't talking about the Illuminati and NWO, etc. Murray Rothbard didn't start an institute promoting the ending of the NWO, etc.
  
  For instance, a brief scan of "Lord Christopher Monckton" on wikipedia, the guy being interviewed by Glenn Beck, is a guy who calls himself a "world renowned expert" on climate change and is a global warming skeptic but has no science training at all. And, you know, that's fine if you don't believe in global warming...reasonable people can be skeptical of anthropogenic warming and warming in general...but seriously, this is the guy who's your source for the belief that the world is going to be one world government? I mean, to me, citing wikipedia is more credible.
  
  I mean, it sounds like I'm just "attacking the source" instead of the argument, which is a logic fallacy; but I mean when a person is alleging something so grand as a NWO, the burden of proof is high and I don't think the burden is satisfied by obscure message boards and websites...but you know, maybe I'm just a blind sheep I guess? Foolish for not thinking the world is simply as it seems? Could be, I've been wrong before, wrong a lot in fact, but I guess I'm just not convinced. Maybe I need to be a little more open minded and head down a cartesian spiral of doubt.
  
  I mean, I'm open to the idea that the FED is bad for the economy and the antithesis to a healthy free market and that it's demise is therefore justified...but on the grounds of misguided economic policy as opposed to, mysterious, international bankers secretly profiting off of little measly, blissfully ignorant humans.

  You make some valid points. I dont live in a cave, nor do I wear a tin foil hat.
  
  However, if you look down the rabbit hole, you will see where this could go.
  
  We have people with PhDs and other credential lie to us...(the people) everyday, they are called senators and congressman.
  
  Some more food for thought:
  
  Ever wonder why your name is in all CAPS on your drivers liscence, or SS card?
  
  When a person discovers your "strawman" or corporate fiction, it upsets them, however, any lawyer or BAR member knows this and could easily explain how commerce law works.
  
  How about your birth certificate? Ever wonder what the numbers on the back mean? SSN?
  
  Ask anyone at the SS office to explain what they are......:huh:
  
  Federal Reserve....its a government entity, right? LOL
  
  My point is, we have been lulled to sleep by the media and years of government education double think.
  
  Thank you for your feedback, I mean that!!
• SQ_Crazies

  

  $$$$$$=influence=power. Think of it like magic, it's easier than it looks--you follow one hand while the other is doing the dirty work and then you're surprised in the end. And you follow that one hand on purpose don't you? Because the magician wants you to.
• I Wear Pants

  I don't understand your point about names being in all caps.
  

  SQ_Crazies wrote: $$$$$$=influence=power. Think of it like magic, it's easier than it looks--you follow one hand while the other is doing the dirty work and then you're surprised in the end. And you follow that one hand on purpose don't you? Because the magician wants you to.

  You've managed to use a lot of words to not actually say anything.