posted by Fletch

That gets screwed every time.  It’s a 40 year job now for no reason but greed by the state.  No other public employee has this crap.  

Most people won't be retiring after 40 years of working.  Even fewer will have the retirement plan you have.  You bitching about he government is like an Exxon employee bitching about polluting internal combustion engines.  

posted by Dr Winston O'Boogie

Most people won't be retiring after 40 years of working.  Even fewer will have the retirement plan you have.  You bitching about he government is like an Exxon employee bitching about polluting internal combustion engines.  

This is the typical BS argument.  Surprised you didnt add the "shut up, you get summers off"

Here is where that ends up. How about you STFU because EVERYONE in this country knows the gig.  If you didnt go get that degree and try to get a job when 400 people applied for it then you dont get to question it.  Nobody is going to be excited about $35,000 a year starting out in a job where you literally cant go take a crap if you want without having someone cover you.  Other jobs dont require a contract to keep peoples parents from railroading you.

So when the state moves the goalpost all the time.....it sucks

posted by Fletch

This is the typical BS argument.  Surprised you didnt add the "shut up, you get summers off"

Here is where that ends up. How about you STFU because EVERYONE in this country knows the gig.  If you didnt go get that degree and try to get a job when 400 people applied for it then you dont get to question it.  Nobody is going to be excited about $35,000 a year starting out in a job where you literally cant go take a crap if you want without having someone cover you.  Other jobs dont require a contract to keep peoples parents from railroading you.

So when the state moves the goalpost all the time.....it sucks

I don't contend teaching is easy.  But it is where you are by choice.  Bitching about the government/tax dollar spending while you are part of the government and paid directly with tax dollars seems counterproductive.  

posted by Fletch

This is the typical BS argument.  Surprised you didnt add the "shut up, you get summers off"

Here is where that ends up. How about you STFU because EVERYONE in this country knows the gig.  If you didnt go get that degree and try to get a job when 400 people applied for it then you dont get to question it.  Nobody is going to be excited about $35,000 a year starting out in a job where you literally cant go take a crap if you want without having someone cover you.  Other jobs dont require a contract to keep peoples parents from railroading you.

So when the state moves the goalpost all the time.....it sucks

Did someone lie to you and convince you that as a dodgeball teacher you would make six figures?

If they did shame on you for being that stupid.

If they didn't, then you knew going in what the job entailed both in oversight, the kids, and the compensation. So why bitch about something you KNEW you signed up for BY CHOICE. 

This is why people can't stand to hear teachers bitch and moan about how bad they have it. No one says the job isn't tough. But not a single profession, that I can think of, bitches more about their job yet hardly any positions know exactly what they are signing up for beforehand like teachers do.

So no, you STFU. If you don't like it, quit and go work somewhere else like everyone else in the USA has the choice to do. 

posted by jmog

But not a single profession, that I can think of, bitches more about their job

I chuckled at the guy who only works 9 months per year bitching about having to work a whole 40 years.

posted by gut

I chuckled at the guy who only works 9 months per year bitching about having to work a whole 40 years.

Not just bitching, but "NO ONE ELSE HAS IT AS BAD AS ME!!!!!" whining. The combination of general stupidity and total lack of dignity is not becoming.

posted by Fletch

  Nobody is going to be excited about $35,000 a year starting out in a job where you literally cant go take a crap if you want without having someone cover you.  

posted by Heretic

Not just bitching, but "NO ONE ELSE HAS IT AS BAD AS ME!!!!!" whining. The combination of general stupidity and total lack of dignity is not becoming.

Damn, I know we have some good posters here, who are teachers, but I have said this shit about teachers for a long time.  Even in college, the education majors tend to bitch the most about how hard they had it. 

posted by like_that

Damn, I know we have some good posters here, who are teachers, but I have said this shit about teachers for a long time.  Even in college, the education majors tend to bitch the most about how hard they had it. 

They’ve obviously been the worst throughout Covid too. I’ll give some of the old ones credit, it used to be a joke to get your retirement in and be set, now it’s a bit more. I mean shit, I don’t plan on working 40 years, but I also won’t get a pension. Young teachers, go into administration.

posted by like_that

Damn, I know we have some good posters here, who are teachers, but I have said this shit about teachers for a long time.  Even in college, the education majors tend to bitch the most about how hard they had it. 

Agreed.  In my experience, the better teachers did not bitch about their profession/job.  It always seemed like the mediocre teachers complained the most.  As a history teacher I had in HS (who was a great teacher) told us once, "This profession was a calling for me and I can't imagine ever doing something different.  I knew I'd never be rich, but I also had a picture of how my career and life would be.  I love kids and I love the certainty of knowing my spot in the world."  I always respected that take on it.  

You missed the point where I said “they move the goalpost” all the time.  Years of service, % of retirement,  evaluation procedures,  licensure,  CBA and MOU’s. Not even mentioning all the crap the state and federal government hands down on testing and curri

Be glad you don't live in CA or IL where those pensions are massively underfunded.

They keep making changes to your pension plan?  Boo-hoo.  Shits happening for the rest of the world that pays in and receives social security.

They're all ponzi schemes, and the population and economy aren't growing like they were when those pensions were set up.  And the rates of return were too high.  All that means the pensions are permanently underfunded.  You're probably going to need to work more than 40 years after those benefit are inevitably cut.

posted by Fletch

You missed the point where I said “they move the goalpost” all the time.  Years of service, % of retirement,  evaluation procedures,  licensure,  CBA and MOU’s. Not even mentioning all the crap the state and federal government hands down on testing and curri

Do you believe that "moving the goalposts" doesn't happen in the private sector? You can't be the delusional can you?

I will give a for instance. Let's say my "goal" as a sales engineer (I am not a sales engineer, this is a for instance from a friend who works for the same company as I do) 2 year's ago wass to bring in $600,000 of new business to get my "full" bonus.

Let's say I blow that goal out of the water and bring in $1,200,000. Do you believe my goal for next year will just be my previous goal plus inflation, say $625,000? 

Nope, new goal will be $900,000. 

Let's say I blow that goal out of the water again and hit $2,000,000 in year 2. Do you believe my year 3 goal will be say that $900,000 plus inflation so roughly $950,000?

Nope, year 3 would be $1,250,000. 

Each year a higher goal is taking money out of "my" pocket (really my friends) as he gets possible/additional bonus money if he goes over his goal. So if you hit $2,000,000 and your goal is $600,000 you make more money than if you hit $2,000,000 and your goal is $1,200,000.

So yes, the private sector absolutely moves the goal posts all the time. Lets not even add in how often the federal government has changed the full social security retirement age on private workers that have put money into their "fake savings account" (what SS was originally sold as). 

I always wonder, the teachers that complain like you, if they EVER worked a non government job in their life because they have no clue how the private sector actually works.

 My favorite is "well our evaluations are 100% subjective and not measurable metrics" lol...yeah, you mean like in the private sector where managers just rate you on a scale of 1-5 or 1-10 on various attributes and that determines your yearly cost of living increase? 

Lol I’m not gonna quote that, but teachers saying you can’t measure their performance is hilarious. Like no one else has ever worked a job. So hard.

posted by iclfan2

Lol I’m not gonna quote that, but teachers saying you can’t measure their performance is hilarious. Like no one else has ever worked a job. So hard.

Yup, that’s one of my favorite “it would all be our supervisors/principal’s opinion!”

Welcome to the real world sweet cakes, that’s how we all get evaluated.

posted by jmog

Yup, that’s one of my favorite “it would all be our supervisors/principal’s opinion!”

That and the "my job is so stressful!".  No, you have no idea.  If you can't handle kids, you're in the wrong profession.  In teaching, you literally can't experience an 80-hr week where you barely have time to eat, constant pressure/deadlines and fear of being fired any minute....and to top it all off you even dream (nightmares) about work because that is your life currently.

And the whole "I'm special and most people can't do this".  No, the skill and talent required are actually pretty common.  Most people who have a college degree - and probably many who don't - are capable of teaching.  And I'm sure you'd find a similar range of competency in that group.  That's true of most jobs, and certainly teachers could do most jobs.  But you don't hear many accountants talking about how irreplaceable they are and how important they are to society.

posted by gut

And the whole "I'm special and most people can't do this".  No, the skill and talent required are actually pretty common.  Most people who have a college degree - and probably many who don't - are capable of teaching.  And I'm sure you'd find a similar range of competency in that group.  That's true of most jobs, and certainly teachers could do most jobs.  But you don't hear many accountants talking about how irreplaceable they are and how important they are to society.

Other than certain specialized secondary education majors like math, physics, chemistry, etc education is literally one of the easiest degrees to get through with a BS degree. This isn’t my opinion, there are many many lists out there. 

So you are right, nearly anyone can do it which is why there are literally 1000s fighting for 100s of jobs in each area of the state. This is also why they start at $35,000, as supply and demand dictates. If 1000 people apply for 100 jobs the pay will be low. If 100 people are looking at 1000 jobs the pay will be high.

For instance, even at the worse time of the last recession in 2008, when unemployment was at like 16%, engineering unemployment never went above 4%. There aren’t enough people graduating each year in engineering to fill the jobs, so they get paid very well.  

posted by iclfan2

Lol I’m not gonna quote that, but teachers saying you can’t measure their performance is hilarious. Like no one else has ever worked a job. So hard.

Based on the severe lack of understanding of our constitution and the electoral college, I would say it’s easily measurable.

posted by jmog

Yup, that’s one of my favorite “it would all be our supervisors/principal’s opinion!”

Welcome to the real world sweet cakes, that’s how we all get evaluated.

Amen.  It’s being a big boy and accepting the world ain’t fair.  If you hate your job, guess what - Indeed.com has many options waiting for you right this very second.  

posted by jmog

Yup, that’s one of my favorite “it would all be our supervisors/principal’s opinion!”

Welcome to the real world sweet cakes, that’s how we all get evaluated.

I guess you dont understand shared attribution and data points.  

posted by Fletch

I guess you dont understand shared attribution and data points.  

Oh I do, I just think its hilarious that no profession complains about their job more than teachers. Teachers complained that their evaluations were purely subjective by the administration then they get something like shared attribution and complain that "well they can't force the students to actually learn, study, etc". 

So when its subjective they complain, when its a metric to hit with the students, they complain more.

In other words stop your bitching, you don't have it worse than people in the real world.

posted by Fletch

I guess you dont understand shared attribution and data points.  

Just assume every profession has its difficulties.  The grass appears greener when you don't know the details.  For example, Ralph works in an adult book store.  He gets to look at naked ladies all day every day.  "Sounds awesome" you say.  True, Ralph can watch porn anytime he wants.  Trouble is, Ralph's title is "Video Booth Mop Technician".  He is in charge of keeping that area of the store clean.  

So it's not all milk and cookies.  There's always more to the story.

At least it's good to see that for a brief period, CC's found a different argument that the entire site can dunk on him for making.

posted by jmog

Oh I do, I just think its hilarious that no profession complains about their job more than teachers. Teachers complained that their evaluations were purely subjective by the administration then they get something like shared attribution and complain that "well they can't force the students to actually learn, study, etc". 

So when its subjective they complain, when its a metric to hit with the students, they complain more.

In other words stop your bitching, you don't have it worse than people in the real world.

The example for the private sector would be having your evaluation be determined on how well others do at their job.  Its fair because you all work at the same place right?

posted by Fletch

The example for the private sector would be having your evaluation be determined on how well others do at their job.  Its fair because you all work at the same place right?

Part of my review includes how my sales team does, how my division does and how the overall company does.  I have limited control over any of this.  Is that what you're meaning?