posted by gut

Oh, I thought she was just there temporarily for an event or promotion. 

Choosing to go there to work is a different level than the WNBA or Sponsor asking you to go for an event.

I think Russia may have done a disservice to themselves, but they also may not care; particularly with the return they got.

But yes, WNBA players have frequented the Russian League in the off-season, and are huge draws -- Griner was a teammate back in the day with Diana Taurausi. Same with men's players who don't make the NBA. Several other leagues pick Americans though not as much as basketball. But I would assume this would ALL stop now. No one will risk that again. 

posted by QuakerOats

Her, having worked there on numerous occasions, makes her super dumb; she clearly knew the rules/laws.

This 'trade' is beyond horrible, but certainly par for the course for the morons running the show.

And former Marine, Paul Whelan, remains in a Russian prison, apparently. 

FJB

Did trump get him out in 2018-2020? I’m confused. 

Once again here we go pretending we care about vets, when the truth is they only get brought up when used for a reason as why we shouldn’t help someone else like the homeless. This dude has been in jail for years and no one cared. And you don’t care now, you are just trying to bang on the libs. 

posted by geeblock

Once again here we go pretending we care about vets, when the truth is they only get brought up when used for a reason as why we shouldn’t help someone else like the homeless. This dude has been in jail for years and no one cared. And you don’t care now, you are just trying to bang on the libs. 

Good point.  The guy is not a current Marine, but a dishonorably discharged former Marine who was convicted of theft.  He was over to Moscow many times engaged in “security” work - whatever that means.  I’m not saying he’s any worse than this WNBA player is, but let’s not act like they arrested Audie Murphy while he was over there bringing food to starving Tussian peasants.

And to QO’s point, why didn’t his favorite president spring the guy loose?  

posted by geeblock

Once again here we go pretending we care about vets, when the truth is they only get brought up when used for a reason as why we shouldn’t help someone else like the homeless. This dude has been in jail for years and no one cared. And you don’t care now, you are just trying to bang on the libs. 

You're living in your own reality if you think people do not care about vets and you're making the point that others try to make about veterans.  An Anti-American WNBA player got more attention than any vet would get, and the Pentagon wonders why they have such a recruiting and retention issue. 

I am at least happy an American is back, even if she is anti American. This is what makes this country great.  Maybe this will humble her.  Just shows how much people bitch about this country, and we still do shit that 95% of all nations would never be willing to do.  There is a lot of honor in that, and it's lost on both sides. 

With that being said, you can spin it anyway you want, but the optics of this trade is just terrible.  I would say there is a 100% chance people will die as a result of this trade, especially when there is a current war involved with Russia and we are aiding Russia's enemy.  You're going to have to accept that reality. First Bergdahl, and now this trade.  The Obama coaching tree just gets fleeced in every trade. 

posted by like_that

You're living in your own reality if you think people do not care about vets and you're making the point that others try to make about veterans.  An Anti-American WNBA player got more attention than any vet would get, and the Pentagon wonders why they have such a recruiting and retention issue. 

I am at least happy an American is back, even if she is anti American. This is what makes this country great.  Maybe this will humble her.  Just shows how much people bitch about this country, and we still do shit that 95% of all nations would never be willing to do.  There is a lot of honor in that, and it's lost on both sides. 

With that being said, you can spin it anyway you want, but the optics of this trade is just terrible.  I would say there is a 100% chance people will die as a result of this trade, especially when there is a current war involved with Russia and we are aiding Russia's enemy.  You're going to have to accept that reality. First Bergdahl, and now this trade.  The Obama coaching tree just gets fleeced in every trade. 

protesting injustice is the most american thing you can do and is the premise this country was founded on so no she is not anti-american. Let me guess she is anti american but the jan 6 jackoffs are pro american?  and no people actually dont care about veterans.  Our vet administration is horrendous. Didnt we just fail recently to help those exposed to chemicals in Iraq?  literally the only time you hear about vets is if someone mentions helping some other group or its veterans day.  this guy wasnt even over there in a military capacity or even honorably discharged from the military, but either way he was in there for two years of the trump administration and wasn't trump meeting with putin?  why didnt he get him out if it was so easy? 

Yes our country is great but just because we do better than other countries doesnt mean we cant improve and there are lots of areas to improve.

posted by geeblock

protesting injustice is the most american thing you can do and is the premise this country was founded on so no she is not anti-american. Let me guess she is anti american but the jan 6 jackoffs are pro american?  and no people actually dont care about veterans.  Our vet administration is horrendous. Didnt we just fail recently to help those exposed to chemicals in Iraq?  literally the only time you hear about vets is if someone mentions helping some other group or its veterans day.  this guy wasnt even over there in a military capacity or even honorably discharged from the military, but either way he was in there for two years of the trump administration and wasn't trump meeting with putin?  why didnt he get him out if it was so easy? 

Yes our country is great but just because we do better than other countries doesnt mean we cant improve and there are lots of areas to improve.

But, but, but Jan 6!  How long are you going to parrot that strawman talking point?  You're missing the point.  Here she is a black-gay woman athlete expressing her anti American views, while smoking weed.  Correct me if I am wrong, but she was never thrown into a labor prison in the US.  The worst outcome for her was that people got mad at her for her statements regarding the US.   Despite her views, the U.S. still traded a very dangerous terrorist for somebody who is extremely irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.  I think we all can agree this country is flawed, but it is admirable they would be willing to do this for their people.  Not many other nations would. If she doesn't come back humbled, she is a moron.  The good news for her is that she won't be thrown into a labor prison if she decides to be a moron.   As for your other strawman arguments:

Vets:  You will find no argument from me regarding how our Government treats vets.  Bush, Obama, Trump, Biden, and the congresses during these eras have had no regard for the young men and women they have put in harms way and they have done nothing to help them when they get out of the military.  My argument was not about whether the Republican party or Democrat party cares about vets. 

Trump's deal: You're mistaking me for a Trump fanboy.  Save those arguments for QO and Spock.  I will say this though, you know the deal was a shitty deal for the Biden administration, when the best counter argument is "what about Trump?"  You have to accept the reality that Biden gave up the one leveraging piece in any hostage negotiation with Russia, and he didn't even get everyone back.  Now there is no longer anything to offer outside of promising not to aid Ukraine.  Meanwhile you have to accept the reality that Griner was let go for a guy that will be responsible for many more deaths to come.  Mel Kiper would give this trade a F.  It was clearly a heavily lopsided trade.  Again, show me another nation willing to do this for someone who is ashamed of their own country. 

We can agree to disagree about her being anti American, but you won’t convince me that people care about vets. This guy was in jail over there for at least 4 years and no one cared and they will go back to not caring after this dies down was my point 

Cracking me up the people spinning this trade like it was a "win." "Oh, Biden outsmarted them! The terrorist they traded would've been A LOT safer in an American prison than where he's going!" Just when you thought the Libs were a bunch of Fetterman's, they say "hold my beer."

Most people know this woman was freed because she was a celebrity (c-list albeit) and therefore she garnered news.  A president in this day-in-age is drawn to the positive press of doing this. 

I hope Paul Whelan gets home.  But there is something very fishy about that guy.  

posted by Dr Winston O'Boogie

Most people know this woman was freed because she was a celebrity (c-list albeit) and therefore she garnered news.  A president in this day-in-age is drawn to the positive press of doing this. 

I hope Paul Whelan gets home.  But there is something very fishy about that guy.  

if its true that he has citizenship in 4 countries that is strange but i also hope he gets home and BG said she is going to dedicate herself going forward to helping americans around the globe get home.

posted by geeblock

Did trump get him out in 2018-2020? I’m confused. 

No, because Trump did not bow down to one-sided transactions, treaties, and trade agreements.

posted by geeblock

We can agree to disagree about her being anti American, but you won’t convince me that people care about vets. This guy was in jail over there for at least 4 years and no one cared and they will go back to not caring after this dies down was my point 

A lot of people cared about him, unfortunately most people didn't even know about him because he is not a black, gay, female basketball star who disrespects her country and made big headlines for all of the above.  

Meanwhile 858 billion military budget and no one blinks 

What makes Griner anti-American? 

I think it is great that she is home. I also think this trade was very in favor of Russia. I think it made the world a more dangerous place. I do not think Whelan was on the table. I am not sure Whelan is a better trade. And I am not sure Whelan getting out of Russian jail is better for the world as he sounds like a real POS, sketchy dude who doesnt have the best interests of USA in his heart. Unless the CIA was lying, and now letting him rot to cover their own asses, but that seems unlikely.

And honest question, do you get Vet status if you are dishonorably discharged?

posted by geeblock

Meanwhile 858 billion military budget and no one blinks 

It's absurd.  The entire federal budget could be cut by 25% and no one would notice.  It is literally disgusting.

posted by QuakerOats

It's absurd.  The entire federal budget could be cut by 25% and no one would notice.  It is literally disgusting.

What are we going to do with 504 more tanks lol 

posted by geeblock

What are we going to do with 504 more tanks lol 

Kill people.

I read Hunter Biden's haiku series of paintings is on exhibit in NYC.  This guy has really turned things around.  It's amazing how art can promote therapeutic healing and self reflection.  All this and only 10% for the "Big Guy".

posted by geeblock

Meanwhile 858 billion military budget and no one blinks 

Are you shocked?  Both parties have had a hard on for the war machine for a very long time. 

posted by Laley23

What makes Griner anti-American? 

I think it is great that she is home. I also think this trade was very in favor of Russia. I think it made the world a more dangerous place. I do not think Whelan was on the table. I am not sure Whelan is a better trade. And I am not sure Whelan getting out of Russian jail is better for the world as he sounds like a real POS, sketchy dude who doesnt have the best interests of USA in his heart. Unless the CIA was lying, and now letting him rot to cover their own asses, but that seems unlikely.

And honest question, do you get Vet status if you are dishonorably discharged?

Not a huge deal, but  since everyone is getting it wrong, he received a bad conduct discharge and not a dishonorable discharge.  There is a difference.  To answer your question, you lose vet benefits with a bad conduct discharge. 

posted by like_that

Are you shocked?  Both parties have had a hard on for the war machine for a very long time. 

After losing to Reagan twice, HW, and GW...then with 9/11, the Dems decided to start supporting military and defense spending.

posted by gut

After losing to Reagan twice, HW, and GW...then with 9/11, the Dems decided to start supporting military and defense spending.

Don’t forget how it’s unpatriotic to not support everything and everyone associated with the military.  

posted by Laley23

Unless the CIA was lying, and now letting him rot to cover their own asses, but that seems unlikely.

posted by ernest_t_bass
CIA covering their own butt is unlikely?  Where do people get this blind allegiance and trust to all things government?   In every single situation, I would put myself on the side of "the government is lying to us" before I would put myself on the side of "The government has our best interest at heart, and is telling us the truth."

So then what if the government was lying about the Russian arms dealer that Biden traded for the WNBA player?  What if he is really a peace loving pacifist e were holding as a political pawn.