AP Sources: US, Cuba Seek to Normalize Relations

• Wolves of Babylon

  Nice to see Rand Paul comments on this and continue to differentiate himself from the rest of the GOP.
  
  He hasn't had many but Obama actually has this one right.
• Glory Days

  

  OSH;1687768 wrote:Why not? Why does it make sense to have the embargo?
  
  I could give a whole list of reasons...but, without a good understanding of any embargo, no reasons would really mean anything.

  Because Castro.
  
  Because Cuban missile crisis.
  
  Because communism.
  
  Because human rights violations.
  
  The embargo could have ended if Castro and his goons stepped down etc. They didn't, we pretty much broke their economy.
  
  We also have embargos against North Korea, Iran, Syria, and Sudan.
• Glory Days

  

  Wolves of Babylon;1687774 wrote:Nice to see Rand Paul comments on this and continue to differentiate himself from the rest of the GOP.
  
  He hasn't had many but Obama actually has this one right.

  the polls I saw show only younger Cubans want the embargo lifted. the older Cubans who actually lived under castro want to keep it.
• gut

  Rand Paul should be our next POTUS....not sure I agree with all his positions or that he's the next guy, but I think he fits excellently with current sentiment. We could definitely do worse.
• Wolves of Babylon

  Glory Days;1687929 wrote:Because Castro.
  
  Because Cuban missile crisis.
  
  Because communism.
  
  Because human rights violations.
  
  The embargo could have ended if Castro and his goons stepped down etc. They didn't, we pretty much broke their economy.
  
  We also have embargos against North Korea, Iran, Syria, and Sudan.

  50 years. The embargo allowed Castro to stay in power. They used it as an excuse to remain in control. Is 50 years enough time to realize a policy failed? 50 years of power, did the embargo really Work? All it really did was make people's life miserable.
  
  We trade with other countries who are communist. China for example. They haven't exactly had the best track record on human rights. Vietnam is another one. Why trade with them and not Cuba?
• Wolves of Babylon

  Glory Days;1687930 wrote:the polls I saw show only younger Cubans want the embargo lifted. the older Cubans who actually lived under castro want to keep it.

  I didn't say popular, I said right. So people over 65 don't agree. Reports I've seen say that people who actually live there now are for the change.
• Glory Days

  

  Wolves of Babylon;1687932 wrote:50 years. The embargo allowed Castro to stay in power. They used it as an excuse to remain in control. Is 50 years enough time to realize a policy failed? 50 years of power, did the embargo really Work? All it really did was make people's life miserable.
  
  We trade with other countries who are communist. China for example. They haven't exactly had the best track record on human rights. Vietnam is another one. Why trade with them and not Cuba?

  No, castro made their life miserable. Obama blinked first. Castro(and his brother) won and will use this to his advantage. like the polls show, most Cubans who actually know cuba, want the embargo. what would have been your solution to fix the castro problem? we also didn't trade with Vietnam for 20 years after the war, so its not like we welcomed them with open arms.
• like_that

  

  gut;1687931 wrote:Rand Paul should be our next POTUS....not sure I agree with all his positions or that he's the next guy, but I think he fits excellently with current sentiment. We could definitely do worse.

  Agreed, unfortunately I don't think he will win the primary.
• queencitybuckeye

  Glory Days;1687938 wrote:ike the polls show, most Cubans who actually know cuba, want the embargo.

  Cubans in Cuba would disagree.
• Glory Days

  

  queencitybuckeye;1687942 wrote:Cubans in Cuba would disagree.

  correct, they would probably support a few tactical airstrikes on the presidential compound....
• OSH

  

  Glory Days;1687929 wrote:Because Castro.
  
  Because Cuban missile crisis.
  
  Because communism.
  
  Because human rights violations.
  
  The embargo could have ended if Castro and his goons stepped down etc. They didn't, we pretty much broke their economy.
  
  We also have embargos against North Korea, Iran, Syria, and Sudan.

  A lot of this post sums much of your "reasons" up. The embargo really did a lot to push Castro aside huh? We'll show you Castro...
  

  Wolves of Babylon;1687932 wrote:50 years. The embargo allowed Castro to stay in power. They used it as an excuse to remain in control. Is 50 years enough time to realize a policy failed? 50 years of power, did the embargo really Work? All it really did was make people's life miserable.
  
  We trade with other countries who are communist. China for example. They haven't exactly had the best track record on human rights. Vietnam is another one. Why trade with them and not Cuba?

  There are MANY places that have done worse, are worse, and there's no embargoes. There is really no "good" reasons why an embargo against Cuba should exist while other places have none. China...was one example. Russia?
  
  188 of the 193 UN countries say it's stupid. Other countries are trading with Cuba, investments on their side...meanwhile we lose out. Some estimations are the US loses $1.2 billion (or as high as nearly $5 billion) annually due to the embargo.
  
  If we have an embargo because of those few "reasons," then how many other countries should we continue to have embargoes with? When do those embargoes end, if they ever do? Why trade or travel anywhere else since there are bad things happening all over? Keep to ourselves and everyone else do the same. It's much better that way since we are American and we are the best.
• Glory Days

  

  OSH;1688079 wrote:A lot of this post sums much of your "reasons" up. The embargo really did a lot to push Castro aside huh? We'll show you Castro...
  
  
  
  There are MANY places that have done worse, are worse, and there's no embargoes. There is really no "good" reasons why an embargo against Cuba should exist while other places have none. China...was one example. Russia?
  
  188 of the 193 UN countries say it's stupid. Other countries are trading with Cuba, investments on their side...meanwhile we lose out. Some estimations are the US loses $1.2 billion (or as high as nearly $5 billion) annually due to the embargo.
  
  If we have an embargo because of those few "reasons," then how many other countries should we continue to have embargoes with? When do those embargoes end, if they ever do? Why trade or travel anywhere else since there are bad things happening all over? Keep to ourselves and everyone else do the same. It's much better that way since we are American and we are the best.

  so because we trade with some communists or human rights violators, we should trade with all of them? we may have not removed Castro from power, but it isolated him. he already took his country's wealth, why would he not take all the money the rest of the free world would invest in Cuba after the embargo is lifted?
• ZWICK 4 PREZ

  

  like_that;1687941 wrote:Agreed, unfortunately I don't think he will win the primary.

  Rand Paul is the only republican I could vote for.
• Con_Alma

  gut;1687931 wrote:Rand Paul should be our next POTUS....not sure I agree with all his positions or that he's the next guy, but I think he fits excellently with current sentiment. We could definitely do worse.

  I disagree for two reasons. He doesn't reflect my views personally. He should only be the next President if he reflects the views of most of the people who vote. I don't think he does.
• Ytowngirlinfla

  

  Con_Alma;1688118 wrote:I disagree for two reasons. He doesn't reflect my views personally. He should only be the next President if he reflects the views of most of the people who vote. I don't think he does.

  He's too conservative and I think that won't work well with the younger population.
• Con_Alma

  Ytowngirlinfla;1688124 wrote:He's too conservative and I think that won't work well with the younger population.

  I disagree that he's too conservative...he's not socially conservative enough for me. He's not aggressive enough with regards to foreign affairs for me.
  
  I agree that his ideology won't work well with the younger population.
• like_that

  

  ZWICK 4 PREZ;1688113 wrote:Rand Paul is the only republican I could vote for.

  I have a lot of liberal/dem friends who feel this way.
• like_that

  

  Ytowngirlinfla;1688124 wrote:He's too conservative and I think that won't work well with the younger population.

  lolwut?
  

  Con_Alma;1688125 wrote:I disagree that he's too conservative...he's not socially conservative enough for me. He's not aggressive enough with regards to foreign affairs for me.
  
  I agree that his ideology won't work well with the younger population.

  He is as close as libertarian as it gets for somebody on the republican ticket. More and more of the younger population has been leaning toward libertarian views with how inept our government has been. As I mentioned earlier, I know quite a few libs who would entertain the idea of voting for him over their democratic candidate. I think he would also rake in a lot of the independent voters, as he wouldn't reek of a "more of the same" type of candidate.
• steubbigred

  good move by the president concerning this ..
  
  
  it is all about the economy stupid..
  
  
  50 years of the old tactics did not work
  
  this will open cuba up once the internet hits the people ..
  
  cuba would be a great vacation spot as well.
  
  plus i want me some cigars without getting them on the black market in pittsburgh
• Con_Alma

  like_that;1688136 wrote:lolwut?
  
  
  He is as close as libertarian as it gets for somebody on the republican ticket. More and more of the younger population has been leaning toward libertarian views with how inept our government has been. As I mentioned earlier, I know quite a few libs who would entertain the idea of voting for him over their democratic candidate. I think he would also rake in a lot of the independent voters, as he wouldn't reek of a "more of the same" type of candidate.

  Agree. Libertarian isn't reflective of my views at all.
  
  As far as appealing to younger voters....I don't know but haven't seen them fleeing to his support in droves. I admit, however, I'm not exactly in touch with the political views of "younger voters"...whatever age group that is.
• Con_Alma

  steubbigred;1688152 wrote:good move by the president concerning this ..
  
  
  it is all about the economy stupid..
  
  
  50 years of the old tactics did not work
  
  this will open cuba up once the internet hits the people ..
  
  cuba would be a great vacation spot as well.
  
  plus i want me some cigars without getting them on the black market in pittsburgh

  What do you mean by it didn't work?
  
  Were we in mass supporting a communist nation even though the restriction to do so was in place?
• OSH

  

  Glory Days;1688087 wrote:so because we trade with some communists or human rights violators, we should trade with all of them? we may have not removed Castro from power, but it isolated him. he already took his country's wealth, why would he not take all the money the rest of the free world would invest in Cuba after the embargo is lifted?

  Is that all you got out of the post? The rest of the world sees it as stupid, except you and Israel (the only country other than the US that thought the UN vote was smart). This is more than just one dictator.
  
  Who cares if it isolated Castro? It didn't do its job. In turn, probably thousands, if not millions, of Cubans died because they couldn't get better financially or health due to our restrictions on them. Not only that, Cuba is 110 miles away from the US...we are the closest country that could benefit from trading. But...why do that? Why not allow other countries to have better relations and get better trading so we can sit on this 50-year embargo to prove a point. Rather stupid.
  
  It hasn't worked for 50 years. It's not going to continue to work. We are long overdue this turn of events.
• steubbigred

  Con_Alma;1688165 wrote:What do you mean by it didn't work?
  
  Were we in mass supporting a communist nation even though the restriction to do so was in place?

  castro stayed in power so therefore it did not work .... it is time to move on and to normalize this situation ....its all about the economy ....this will be a win win win win win for everybvody until those stupid right wing nuts slow progress down like they always do ...
• Glory Days

  

  OSH;1688192 wrote:Is that all you got out of the post? The rest of the world sees it as stupid, except you and Israel (the only country other than the US that thought the UN vote was smart). This is more than just one dictator.
  
  Who cares if it isolated Castro? It didn't do its job. In turn, probably thousands, if not millions, of Cubans died because they couldn't get better financially or health due to our restrictions on them. Not only that, Cuba is 110 miles away from the US...we are the closest country that could benefit from trading. But...why do that? Why not allow other countries to have better relations and get better trading so we can sit on this 50-year embargo to prove a point. Rather stupid.
  
  It hasn't worked for 50 years. It's not going to continue to work. We are long overdue this turn of events.

  Those Cubans didn't die from our restrictions, they died because of Castro. He robbed his country blind. just because we open up restrictions, doesn't mean it will change anything. it will just make the Castro brothers richer.
  
  this idea the embargo hasn't worked is flawed. it crippled Cuba, it worked. that is the point of the embargo.
  
  you still haven't answered the question about what to do with Castro if we open up trade?
  
  If we were to lift the embargo, do you think Cuba should have to meet certain requirements first?
  
  By the way, we already export about $450 million to Cuba. Glands and other organs and animal/human blood are in their top 10 exports.....I don't see the US gaining much from trading with them.
  
  http://atlas.media.mit.edu/profile/country/cub/
• steubbigred

  rand paul is a person that both repubs and dems like but he does not have a full backing of the gop ..
  
  
  rand paul is the most honest politician we have out their ..... i would consider voting for him as an independent.