Penn State @ Ohio State

• centralbucksfan

  thedynasty1998 wrote:
  Looking forward, OSU wins their next 2 games and should be Illinois, and that could potentially put them top 10. That gives them 20 wins and then the two big ones, before finishing up with 3 more games they should win (I think they drop 1-2 to Illinois).
  
  That's a hell of a year and then they head into the Big 10 tournament. With a solid showing, they could get as high of a 3 seed in the tournament which could play out nice for them to make a little run.

  Ill scares me. They are good enough to beat anyone in the Big Ten. They beat OSU twice last year. Going to Ill will not be easy by any means. Certainly winnable...but OSU will have to play well. Going to IU wont' be a cakewalk either IMO. OSU "should" win...but Crean will have IU ready.
  As for Diebler, I am not sure I expect more to be honest. He is what he is, not as athletic as most guys, not as quick. I think he is very limited to a catch and shoot player who lives and dies by the 3. He doesn't get the loose balls..but quite frankly, I don't think he can at times when others are quicker to the ball, stronger, etc. But I have no doubt he plays as hard as he can, all the time. And besides Turner, there is not a player who works harder in practice and stays after then Diebler.
• thedynasty1998

  

  I agree that Illinois will be tough, and I think you almost have to be happy splitting with them.
  
  I don't think Indiana is a threat at all. In their first meeting, I gave Indiana a chance, but was way off. Crean is still a year or two away.
  
  I've never said Diebler isn't a hard worker. I do question his effort often though. As for staying after practice, who cares? I understand coaches like to see that stuff, but in college the guy who worked the hardest and probably put in the most hours was the walk on who never saw the court. It doesn't mean anything if it's not translated onto the floor.
• thedynasty1998

  

  BTW, I appreciate the difference between CBF and Paladin (Big Gain). CBF can argue with me and disagree 100%, but stick to his argument and back it up. That's why I love message boards, because you can get fans of the same team arguing over playing time, personnel or strategy. Someone doesn't always have to be right or wrong.
  
  Paladin on the other hand, he just wants to insult anyone who doesn't agree with him and brings nothing in the form of a debate.
• centralbucksfan

  thedynasty1998 wrote:
  I've never said Diebler isn't a hard worker. I do question his effort often though. As for staying after practice, who cares? I understand coaches like to see that stuff, but in college the guy who worked the hardest and probably put in the most hours was the walk on who never saw the court. It doesn't mean anything if it's not translated onto the floor.

  Who cares? I do. I can appreciate a guy like that, who is a starter, putting in that extra time and effort. If not for that, he wouldn't be the player he is. Nor would Turner who is a gym rat as well.
  Larry Bird used to go out before EVERY game and shoot 400+ shots. Thats WHY Bird is one of the all time greats. So yes, it does matter. And more times then not it does translate to the floor. And its often what seperates players.
• bartsimpson

  With regard to Diebler...no points until the end I can live with. It was pretty obvious that he passed up quite a few shots (especially in the 2nd half) because he wasn't shooting well. I can't blame him for that. I'd rather see him give it up than take a shot if he's not confident that he can make it.
  
  The problem I have is the ZERO rebounds and ZERO assists.....what was he doing for the 40 minutes he was on the court....watching? If that's the case, sit in the stands and pay like everyone else. You don't have to score to be a huge part of a team, but you do have to do SOMETHING!!!
  
  As for wondering about PJ Hill.....it's very, very simple. He's not very good. That and we already have a guy at guard named Turner...maybe you've heard of him. As a couple of you have mentioned, who would he play in place of? Turner got a month of rest with the back injury...he's good to go. You don't put a small PG in in place of anyone other than the PG....no way they can pull Turner, so Hill sits.....not that tough to figure out.
• thedynasty1998

  

  I agree with you that it does matter, maybe I didn't get my point across. I just don't think a guy is to be rewarded for time he puts in after practice. Of course it matters, and it shows that he cares and is willing to work hard. But if he's not producing, there's no excuse. Just because he works harder than anyone else after practice doesn't mean he deserves anything.
  
  As for where do you put PJ Hill? Easy, you put him in as a guard. Just because he's on the floor doesn't mean you have to take the ball out of Turner's hands. He could play off the ball for a few minutes a game. And defensively, OSU would be fine. Hill guards the opposing PG and Turner moves over to defend the off guard.
• bulldog8

  Big Gain wrote: I threw Simmons and Hill under the bus??? Where did I blame them for an Ohio State loss. Do you think Matta is throwing Hill and Simmons under the bus? All I've done is NOT throw Matta under the bus for something as silly and unimportant as substitution minutes.
  
  Where did I say YOU weren't a true fan? YOU said you were interested to see how fan's would react to Matta when Ohio State loses ONE game. IMO a fan who goes nuts over ONE loss is not a true fan. Do you have a guilty conscious?
  
  Don't be a liar. I never said you weren't a true fan because of a comment about Diebler.
  
  You say Matta is wrong. I say you're wrong. Easy decision. No offense, but you are not a top Div1 head basketball coach.
  
  Again, I told you why Matta sticks with Diebler when he isn't having a good game STATISTICALLY. Pay attention this time. After Turner, Matta trusts Diebler more than any other player on the team. Matta considers Diebler his coach on the floor. Obviously Turner also trusts Diebler more than any other player on the team. Who did Turner want to take the most important shot in the game? If Hill or Simmons were in the for Diebler do you think Turner would have wanted either of them to take that shot? HELL NO. THAT is why Matta wanted Diebler on the floor. Who do you think Buford, Lighty, and Lauderdale would want to take that shot, Hill and Simmons or Diebler?
  
  There you go lying again. Show us where I liken Diebler to a god. I'm not the one playing Diebler you idiot, MATTA IS. Who knows more about the Ohio State players, those of your ilk or Matta?? Who sees what the players do in practice, those of your ilk or Matta? Who knows how Ohio State players react to stressful situations, those of your ilk or Matta? Who knows which Ohio State player to trust the most, those of your ilk or Matta? It IS NOT me favoring Diebler over Simmons and Hill, IT IS MATTA, the head coach. Matta is not an internet chat room nobody like you and me. He is the Ohio State head basketball coach. You obviously "fully understand" very little about me OR why Matta makes the decisions he does.
  
  You have every right to disagree with something Matta does. I have every right to agree with his decisions. I disagree with you, I agree with Matta. Hmmmmmm. Because of that, Matta isn't "looking out for what's best for the team". Don't you see how stupid that sounds?

  When you put emphasis on what a true fan is as a direct response to what I said about Diebler and how fans will respond when they blow a game that he does nothing in, you make it sound very much like you're accusing me of not being a true fan. I simply wonder how people will respond when OSU actually loses and Diebler is standing out beyond the arc all game with his thumb up his ass contributing nothing. I understand that Diebler is a great contributor when he's on, but when he's not, there's no reason for him to be on the floor. Sorry, but there is really no debate here. He plays lackluster defense, stands out beyond the arc without hitting the boards, and is no threat in dribble penetration to kick out for an open outside shot. I don't care how much you spread the floor, put freaking Mark Titus out there with his torn shoulder and he can spread the floor for you just as effectively - hell he probably has more rebounds than Diebler does this year anyways. It's obvious that you are very loyal to the players and the coaches, but it's not like i'm on here belittling each and every one of them. I simply question some decisions to spark conversation and you take it more personal than anyone on here. I appreciate your feedback and analysis, but I don't need you to tell me when i'm wrong or right. Give your 2 cents and quit accusing me for the opinions I provide. It's not all that outrageous to think that Diebler is very inconsistent and doesn't always contribute as much as he should. Now if I was saying that Turner doesn't contribute and should be sat down, then I could see you responding like you did and taking it personally. However, if you can't understand that 40 minutes, 3 points, 0 rebounds, 0 assists, and 1 steal is not an efficient night, then you are far too stubborn to be taken seriously.
• Big Gain

  thedynasty1998 wrote: Paladin, your act is getting old. It's one thing to come on here and debate with people with differing opinions of yours, but you attack people time after time and tell them they are dead wrong. Then you use words like neophyte, ignorant and lie to try to belittle people.
  
  You are a fucking idiot.
  
  You said an injury is none of our business? Bullshit. We are fans and discuss things like that. Turner was talked about daily during his injury.
  
  Just because someone isn't the coach at OSU doesn't mean they can't have an opinion. It's people with opinions that get on message boards. How much fun would it be if every comment after the game was, "Good win" and nothing else. Fans like to discuss things. Not sure why that's so hard for you to understand.
  
  So you spoke to Turner after the game, and he told you he trusts Diebler more than any other player on the team. You look foolish with those types of statements.
  
  Why don't you try debating with people going forward without belittling anyone.
  
  Congratulations, because I just added you to the ignore list, and you are the only one on it. That's elite company you fucking loser.

  If something has been purposely exaggerated, if something is untrue, if someone hates or puts down I call it ignorant, that's my opinion. You insist on having your opinions, but you won't allow others to have an opinion. When someone misquotes, distorts, fabricates, defames I call it lying.
  
  Where did I ever say someone isn't allowed to have an opinion. I DARE YOU to prove it deluder.
  
  What did you debate here? What of any worth did you add here? The majority of your opinions are filled with hate and negativity. When someone has a different opinion than yours, what do you do? You call them "morons", you call them "fucking idiots", you say their opinions are "bull shit". You call them "foolish". You call them "fucking losers". Who's attacking? Who's belittling? You don't like it when I say something is ignorant or say someone lies when they purposely misquote. Yet your dirty mouth spews such IGNORANT verbiage? You have proven you are nothing more than a mean, ugly mouthed hater.
  
  Yes this is a place to express opinions, but why are your opinions always negative? Why are you opinions always put downs? Why do your opinions almost always attack players instead of looking for and mentioning the positives. Everyone can't be an Evan Turner, hell you've even attacked him.
  
  You never have anything good to say about Matta. You have more put downs than good things to say about Buford. You put down Lauderdale for not being an inside scoring force, instead of recognizing what his role is and commending him for doing what he's supposed to do. And Diebler? You don't like him. You dislike a college basketball player. You dislike a player when all of his teammates like and respect him. You dislike a player who's coach has complete trust in. You are a small minded, hate monger, pitiful little man.
• Big Gain

  bulldog8 wrote:

  Big Gain wrote: I threw Simmons and Hill under the bus??? Where did I blame them for an Ohio State loss. Do you think Matta is throwing Hill and Simmons under the bus? All I've done is NOT throw Matta under the bus for something as silly and unimportant as substitution minutes.
  
  Where did I say YOU weren't a true fan? YOU said you were interested to see how fan's would react to Matta when Ohio State loses ONE game. IMO a fan who goes nuts over ONE loss is not a true fan. Do you have a guilty conscious?
  
  Don't be a liar. I never said you weren't a true fan because of a comment about Diebler.
  
  You say Matta is wrong. I say you're wrong. Easy decision. No offense, but you are not a top Div1 head basketball coach.
  
  Again, I told you why Matta sticks with Diebler when he isn't having a good game STATISTICALLY. Pay attention this time. After Turner, Matta trusts Diebler more than any other player on the team. Matta considers Diebler his coach on the floor. Obviously Turner also trusts Diebler more than any other player on the team. Who did Turner want to take the most important shot in the game? If Hill or Simmons were in the for Diebler do you think Turner would have wanted either of them to take that shot? HELL NO. THAT is why Matta wanted Diebler on the floor. Who do you think Buford, Lighty, and Lauderdale would want to take that shot, Hill and Simmons or Diebler?
  
  There you go lying again. Show us where I liken Diebler to a god. I'm not the one playing Diebler you idiot, MATTA IS. Who knows more about the Ohio State players, those of your ilk or Matta?? Who sees what the players do in practice, those of your ilk or Matta? Who knows how Ohio State players react to stressful situations, those of your ilk or Matta? Who knows which Ohio State player to trust the most, those of your ilk or Matta? It IS NOT me favoring Diebler over Simmons and Hill, IT IS MATTA, the head coach. Matta is not an internet chat room nobody like you and me. He is the Ohio State head basketball coach. You obviously "fully understand" very little about me OR why Matta makes the decisions he does.
  
  You have every right to disagree with something Matta does. I have every right to agree with his decisions. I disagree with you, I agree with Matta. Hmmmmmm. Because of that, Matta isn't "looking out for what's best for the team". Don't you see how stupid that sounds?

  When you put emphasis on what a true fan is as a direct response to what I said about Diebler and how fans will respond when they blow a game that he does nothing in, you make it sound very much like you're accusing me of not being a true fan. I simply wonder how people will respond when OSU actually loses and Diebler is standing out beyond the arc all game with his thumb up his ass contributing nothing. I understand that Diebler is a great contributor when he's on, but when he's not, there's no reason for him to be on the floor. Sorry, but there is really no debate here. He plays lackluster defense, stands out beyond the arc without hitting the boards, and is no threat in dribble penetration to kick out for an open outside shot. I don't care how much you spread the floor, put freaking Mark Titus out there with his torn shoulder and he can spread the floor for you just as effectively - hell he probably has more rebounds than Diebler does this year anyways. It's obvious that you are very loyal to the players and the coaches, but it's not like i'm on here belittling each and every one of them. I simply question some decisions to spark conversation and you take it more personal than anyone on here. I appreciate your feedback and analysis, but I don't need you to tell me when i'm wrong or right. Give your 2 cents and quit accusing me for the opinions I provide. It's not all that outrageous to think that Diebler is very inconsistent and doesn't always contribute as much as he should. Now if I was saying that Turner doesn't contribute and should be sat down, then I could see you responding like you did and taking it personally. However, if you can't understand that 40 minutes, 3 points, 0 rebounds, 0 assists, and 1 steal is not an efficient night, then you are far too stubborn to be taken seriously.

  If I didn't think you were a true fan I would have put "bulldog" in the sentence. I was speaking about your wish for Ohio State to lose ONE game so you could then see fans attack and blame a player or Matta, those would be the fans I was speaking of. A rather strange wish.
  
  Where did I say Diebler had an "efficient game"? Statistically he had his poorest game of his career. That was rather obvious. All players have a poorest game of the year. Why did Matta keep Diebler on the floor having such a poor game, the same reason I would have. I thought everyone would have figured that out by now.
  
  Your OPINION is that I took the put downs of Diebler "personally". You are WRONG once again. Matta would be the person who WOULD HAVE taken the put downs of Diebler "personally". I'm not OSU's coach, Matta is OSU's coach. I'm not the person deciding who plays what minutes and why. That would be Matta. My opinion is the same as Matta's opinion. My opinion is that Matta knows more about basketball and his players than everyone on here combined.
  
  So, because my opinion is the same as Matta's, instead of agreeing with the opinions of the Matta/Diebler whiners, that means Matta can't be taken seriously?
  
  Because I don't get in line to put down Matta and Diebler with the vast majority on here AND because I fervently support Matta and his team AND because my opinions are the same as Matta's, that puts in the minority on here.
• I drain 3's

  Who or how in the fuck did Paladin (Big Gain) find out about this site. The quality of the college sports forums just took a HUUUUUUUUUGE nosedive.
• thedynasty1998

  

  Please just don't quote his posts, so that I don't have to read his garbage.
• bulldog8

  Big Gain.....You're a joke. I will no longer waste my time with your posts. It's like speaking to a brick wall.