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Notre Dame clings to its independent status, and it's sinking the program

  • NOL fan
    killer_ewok wrote: Anyways, there was a time when Notre Dame wanted to join the Big 10. The Big 10 rejected ND then. Some apparently forget that.
    I'd guess that a lot of those people didn't "forget" about it....but rather never even knew about it because of how long ago that was
  • sleeper
    killer_ewok wrote:
    sleeper wrote:
    rock_knutne wrote:
    sleeper wrote:Yeah, like 100 years ago? How about in 1999? Or now?

    I just thought that was a dumb comment, and pointless to bring up when you are being offered to join now, and your excuse is "well we wanted too back in the day" LOL
    It's not an excuse, ND feels they are just fine as an independant. What I think is dumb is that you make these ridiculous claims when it's the Big 10 who has a hard on for ND to join and not the other way around.
    That's fine, as long as ND is willing to remain mediocre, which seems to be all it takes to retain a delusional fan base.
    Delusional? I prefer "loyal." :)
    Delusional and loyal are totally different things.

    Let me give you an example that you can relate too. I am a Browns fan, they suck, I know they suck, when asked how they will do the following year, I tell people we'd be lucky to win a game and we are terrible. If people say "that 1st round draft pick is going to be something special", I respond "Yeah when the Browns trade him to another team". But I don't care, because I love the Browns and don't care to root for any other team, that's what you call "loyal".

    ND fans are delusional. Year after year they are terrible, mediocre at best, yet you have ND fans and the media claiming they are in the National Title hunt, half their players are eligible to win the Heisman no matter if they go 6-6, and that very few programs have the talent to beat the Irish. If a top notch recruit comes in, all we hear about from ND fans is how he will be the next great multiple Heisman winner and will lead ND to a National title or two.

    Get it now?
  • rock_knutne
    sleeper wrote:
    killer_ewok wrote:
    sleeper wrote:
    rock_knutne wrote:
    sleeper wrote:Yeah, like 100 years ago? How about in 1999? Or now?

    I just thought that was a dumb comment, and pointless to bring up when you are being offered to join now, and your excuse is "well we wanted too back in the day" LOL
    It's not an excuse, ND feels they are just fine as an independant. What I think is dumb is that you make these ridiculous claims when it's the Big 10 who has a hard on for ND to join and not the other way around.
    That's fine, as long as ND is willing to remain mediocre, which seems to be all it takes to retain a delusional fan base.
    Delusional? I prefer "loyal." :)
    Delusional and loyal are totally different things.

    Let me give you an example that you can relate too. I am a Browns fan, they suck, I know they suck, when asked how they will do the following year, I tell people we'd be lucky to win a game and we are terrible. If people say "that 1st round draft pick is going to be something special", I respond "Yeah when the Browns trade him to another team". But I don't care, because I love the Browns and don't care to root for any other team, that's what you call "loyal".

    ND fans are delusional. Year after year they are terrible, mediocre at best, yet you have ND fans and the media claiming they are in the National Title hunt, half their players are eligible to win the Heisman no matter if they go 6-6, and that very few programs have the talent to beat the Irish. If a top notch recruit comes in, all we hear about from ND fans is how he will be the next great multiple Heisman winner and will lead ND to a National title or two.

    Get it now?
    Yeah we get it, you're the delusional one! What would joining a conference do to benefit ND, especially the Big 10?
  • rock_knutne
    Hesston wrote: what is Notre Dames argument for staying independent? I too would like to see them join the Big 10
    There's no argument, it's their preference and falls in line with thier long history of independence.
  • sjmvsfscs08
    THIS IS FUCKING BULLSHIT!!!!! :D
  • sleeper
    rock_knutne wrote:
    sleeper wrote:
    killer_ewok wrote:
    sleeper wrote:
    rock_knutne wrote:
    sleeper wrote:Yeah, like 100 years ago? How about in 1999? Or now?

    I just thought that was a dumb comment, and pointless to bring up when you are being offered to join now, and your excuse is "well we wanted too back in the day" LOL
    It's not an excuse, ND feels they are just fine as an independant. What I think is dumb is that you make these ridiculous claims when it's the Big 10 who has a hard on for ND to join and not the other way around.
    That's fine, as long as ND is willing to remain mediocre, which seems to be all it takes to retain a delusional fan base.
    Delusional? I prefer "loyal." :)
    Delusional and loyal are totally different things.

    Let me give you an example that you can relate too. I am a Browns fan, they suck, I know they suck, when asked how they will do the following year, I tell people we'd be lucky to win a game and we are terrible. If people say "that 1st round draft pick is going to be something special", I respond "Yeah when the Browns trade him to another team". But I don't care, because I love the Browns and don't care to root for any other team, that's what you call "loyal".

    ND fans are delusional. Year after year they are terrible, mediocre at best, yet you have ND fans and the media claiming they are in the National Title hunt, half their players are eligible to win the Heisman no matter if they go 6-6, and that very few programs have the talent to beat the Irish. If a top notch recruit comes in, all we hear about from ND fans is how he will be the next great multiple Heisman winner and will lead ND to a National title or two.

    Get it now?
    Yeah we get it, you're the delusional one! What would joining a conference do to benefit ND, especially the Big 10?
    $$$

    "Oh but ND has so much money" LOL
  • rock_knutne
    sleeper wrote:$$$

    "Oh but ND has so much money" LOL
    You can't believe that? I think it's the other way around, the Big 10 are the ones looking to make more money and thus have been hounding ND to join. Laugh all you want but ND has plenty of cash, more than any school in the Big 10.
  • sleeper
    rock_knutne wrote:
    sleeper wrote:$$$

    "Oh but ND has so much money" LOL
    You can't believe that? I think it's the other way around, the Big 10 are the ones looking to make more money and thus have been hounding ND to join. Laugh all you want but ND has plenty of cash, more than any school in the Big 10.
    I've said before I don't care if ND joins the Big Ten, they will be a perennial bottom feeder with the likes of Indiana and Northwestern, and won't win any bowl game if they happen to accept it. Like I said, enjoy mediocrity, but I'm sure you're used to that already.
  • rock_knutne
    sleeper wrote:I've said before I don't care if ND joins the Big Ten, they will be a perennial bottom feeder with the likes of Indiana and Northwestern, and won't win any bowl game if they happen to accept it. Like I said, enjoy mediocrity, but I'm sure you're used to that already.
    You've said alot of things that ended up being dead wrong so I'll consider the source! BTW, great job at avoiding the topic and my question.
  • Cleveland Buck
    The article does make one good point. No one talks about Notre Dame after they are knocked out of the national title picture each year (unless they are looking for a coach). If they were still competing for a conference title, they would get some run on Sportscenter and Gameday. Recruits watch Gameday and Sportscenter. They don't watch Notre Dame vs. Boston College on NBC.

    Notre Dame doesn't need to join a conference, but I think it would definitely benefit them. They would get more TV money and more exposure as I mentioned above. They can still play national games in the nonconference schedule.
  • rock_knutne
    Cleveland Buck wrote: The article does make one good point. No one talks about Notre Dame after they are knocked out of the national title picture each year (unless they are looking for a coach). If they were still competing for a conference title, they would get some run on Sportscenter and Gameday. Recruits watch Gameday and Sportscenter. They don't watch Notre Dame vs. Boston College on NBC.

    Notre Dame doesn't need to join a conference, but I think it would definitely benefit them. They would get more TV money and more exposure as I mentioned above. They can still play national games in the nonconference schedule.
    You must not watch alot of Sportscenter or Game Day because ND is on all the time and not just when a coach is in the hot seat.

    Recruits don't need to watch ND vs. BC, all they need to know is ALL ND games are televised nationally, even the away games. Again, that's a nice recruiting tool.
  • sleeper
    rock_knutne wrote:
    Cleveland Buck wrote: The article does make one good point. No one talks about Notre Dame after they are knocked out of the national title picture each year (unless they are looking for a coach). If they were still competing for a conference title, they would get some run on Sportscenter and Gameday. Recruits watch Gameday and Sportscenter. They don't watch Notre Dame vs. Boston College on NBC.

    Notre Dame doesn't need to join a conference, but I think it would definitely benefit them. They would get more TV money and more exposure as I mentioned above. They can still play national games in the nonconference schedule.
    You must not watch alot of Sportscenter or Game Day because ND is on all the time and not just when a coach is in the hot seat.

    Recruits don't need to watch ND vs. BC, all they need to know is ALL ND games are televised nationally, even the away games. Again, that's a nice recruiting tool.
    A nice recruiting tool that has netted you 1 bowl win since 1994 LOL
  • rock_knutne
    sleeper wrote: A nice recruiting tool that has netted you 1 bowl win since 1994 LOL
    Speaking of "tools".:s
  • killer_ewok
    sleeper wrote:
    killer_ewok wrote:
    sleeper wrote:
    rock_knutne wrote:
    sleeper wrote:Yeah, like 100 years ago? How about in 1999? Or now?

    I just thought that was a dumb comment, and pointless to bring up when you are being offered to join now, and your excuse is "well we wanted too back in the day" LOL
    It's not an excuse, ND feels they are just fine as an independant. What I think is dumb is that you make these ridiculous claims when it's the Big 10 who has a hard on for ND to join and not the other way around.
    That's fine, as long as ND is willing to remain mediocre, which seems to be all it takes to retain a delusional fan base.
    Delusional? I prefer "loyal." :)
    Delusional and loyal are totally different things.

    Let me give you an example that you can relate too. I am a Browns fan, they suck, I know they suck, when asked how they will do the following year, I tell people we'd be lucky to win a game and we are terrible. If people say "that 1st round draft pick is going to be something special", I respond "Yeah when the Browns trade him to another team". But I don't care, because I love the Browns and don't care to root for any other team, that's what you call "loyal".

    ND fans are delusional. Year after year they are terrible, mediocre at best, yet you have ND fans and the media claiming they are in the National Title hunt, half their players are eligible to win the Heisman no matter if they go 6-6, and that very few programs have the talent to beat the Irish. If a top notch recruit comes in, all we hear about from ND fans is how he will be the next great multiple Heisman winner and will lead ND to a National title or two.

    Get it now?

    Not all ND fans are like that. Therefore, those of us who aren't are nothing more than loyal by your definition. Get it now?


    NOL Fan-Fair enough. It still happened though and now you know. :)
  • slingshot4ever
    The main argument that I am seeing is that basically every ND is is broadcast nationally and it is a good reason for staying independent and bringing in recruits:

    1. If I was a recruit why would I care if the team was nationally televised? I wouldn't be watching the games, I would be playing on the field.
    2. Why is it ND cannot get many top recruits if having all games nationally televised is a great thing to have for reruiting kids? OSU, Florida, Texas, USC, etc. do not have all of their games on nationally every week but continually have top 5-10 recruiting classes.
    3. It does not cost alot of money to see regional games if you live in a different area of the country. You just have to go to a bar (not expensive)

    Kids are sold on the football program in general, not an NBC contract or being able to play all over the country. The program just hasn't been elite for the last ten years.
  • rock_knutne
    Really, does it matter why ND wants to remain independant? Any argument that myself or any other ND fan makes will be seen as stupid because we are fans and not blind haters like the majority of people on this board. So why do any of you care?
  • Legend39
    i've maintained the position for years that the big 11 should allow nd to keep their nbc money, they've earned it by being nd, for whatever reasons. the independent argument would hold water if they truely were, but the big east ends that.

    obviously, the big 11's first choice would be nd. irish fans, take that as a compliment. perhaps the conference is trying to avoid the acc's crime of raiding the big east. whichever schooljoins the big 11, other than nd, will have a domino effect on other conferences that could well change the landscape of college football as we know it. and that may be a good thing in the long run...
  • rock_knutne
    Legend39 wrote:the independent argument would hold water if they truely were, but the big east ends that
    How so? We are talking about the football program, the number one money maker in most schools' athletic departments. ND playing in the Big East in all other sports is a convenience factor and they have made good to the Big East by agreeing to play three of their schools every year in football. The football program not only funds other athletic programs but academic programs too. Heck, back in the days of Rockne, the money generated by the football program basically built the school.
  • thedynasty1998
    slingshot4ever wrote: The main argument that I am seeing is that basically every ND is is broadcast nationally and it is a good reason for staying independent and bringing in recruits:

    1. If I was a recruit why would I care if the team was nationally televised? I wouldn't be watching the games, I would be playing on the field.
    2. Why is it ND cannot get many top recruits if having all games nationally televised is a great thing to have for reruiting kids? OSU, Florida, Texas, USC, etc. do not have all of their games on nationally every week but continually have top 5-10 recruiting classes.
    3. It does not cost alot of money to see regional games if you live in a different area of the country. You just have to go to a bar (not expensive)

    Kids are sold on the football program in general, not an NBC contract or being able to play all over the country. The program just hasn't been elite for the last ten years.
    It doesn't matter to everyone. And maybe it's not a huge factor for recruits, but it certainly helps.

    Notre Dame is one of the few schools that recruits in a National level. OSU recruits Ohio. USC recruits California. Texas recruits Texas. Sure they get the few recruits from out of state every year, but their focus is within their borders.

    That's not necessarily the case with Notre Dame. They recruit everywhere, and it helps to get that name reconition when they are on TV every week. When they can call a recruit in California and ask if they saw the game. How many games are recruits in California going to see Ohio State play?

    It is an advantage. To say it isn't is just foolish.
  • Sage
    Notre Dame is a bunch of bums. They don't want to join because they'd get embarrassed every year by the likes of Northwestern and Indiana.
  • Mr Pat
    They beat Purdue at least ;)
  • jpake1
    Any way you look at it, the TV contract is highly overrated when it comes to recruiting and the kids. Sure, ND loves the money. But HS kids don't really care that much. UF, UT, and USC don't have that kind of contract. It doesn't hurt them from bringing in studs. But that is just one man's opinion that cannot be changed on the matter.
  • Mr Pat
    jpake1 wrote: Any way you look at it, the TV contract is highly overrated when it comes to recruiting and the kids. Sure, ND loves the money. But HS kids don't really care that much. UF, UT, and USC don't have that kind of contract. It doesn't hurt them from bringing in studs. But that is just one man's opinion that cannot be changed on the matter.
    Oh no, please reconsider!
  • dtdtim
    Mr Pat wrote: They beat Purdue at least ;)
    And lost to Michigan.
  • sleeper
    dtdtim wrote:
    Mr Pat wrote: They beat Purdue at least ;)
    And lost to Michigan.
    And Navy.