Duke Mid-Season Thread

• karen lotz

  

  reclegend22;1119787 wrote:I want it to be forgotten as quickly as possible.

  
  Not likely.
• Azubuike24

  

  No first round game, I don't care what it is, unless it's like the #1 overall seed to a 16 can top some of the big stage upsets over the years.
  
  Georgetown-Villanova
  Houston-North Carolina State
  
  These will always be up there, not only because they were title games, but because they were against 2 teams that had they won the title, would have gone down as top 10 NCAA teams of all-time IMO.
  
  George Mason over Connecticut to make the Final Four is up there as well, considering Connecticut was an overwhelming favorite that year.
• wildcats20

  

  I will never let anyone forget this.
  
  Ever.
• ytownfootball

  

  Eh, this Dook loss is merely a footnote, frankly they were doomed against the first athletic team in the tourney they faced. You can read into it what you will, but the bottom line is they couldn't match up athletically with many teams regardless of coaching prowess.
• reclegend22

  

  ccrunner609;1119826 wrote:cool

  Lol.
  
  UNC has lost to a 14. It's a difference of one seed. Even though UNC will act as if Duke lost to ITT Tech, there isn't much of a difference between what Lehigh and Weber State accomplished. Both were under-seeded teams that took advantage of UNC and Duke teams that failed to utilize their advantage in size and rode the tails of shooting stars -- Harold Arcenaux and C.J. McCullom -- to upset victories.
  
  Unfortunately for Duke, 15>14, so we have to hear about it until we die. Or until Carolina loses to the University of Phoenix Online, and that probably ain't happening.
• wildcats20

  

  reclegend22;1119844 wrote:Lol.
  
  UNC has lost to a 14. It's a difference of one seed. Even though UNC will act as if Duke lost to ITT Tech, there isn't much of a difference between what Lehigh and Weber State accomplished. Both were under-seeded teams that took advantage of UNC and Duke teams that failed to utilize their advantage in size and rode the tails of shooting stars -- Harold Arcenaux and C.J. McCullom -- to upset victories.
  
  Unfortunately for Duke, 15>14, so we have to hear about it until we die. Or until Carolina loses to the University of Phoenix Online, and that probably ain't happening.

  
  You can think what you want. Dook lost to a 15 seed. Something Carolina hasn't done. A 15 seed. A game they had no business losing. They were out played, out manned, and out coached.
• ytownfootball

  

  reclegend22;1119844 wrote:Lol.
  
  UNC has lost to a 14. It's a difference of one seed. Even though UNC will act as if Duke lost to ITT Tech, there isn't much of a difference between what Lehigh and Weber State accomplished. Both were under-seeded teams that took advantage of UNC and Duke teams that failed to utilize their advantage in size and rode the tails of shooting stars -- Harold Arcenaux and C.J. McCullom -- to upset victories.
  
  Unfortunately for Duke, 15>14, so we have to hear about it until we die. Or until Carolina loses to the University of Phoenix Online, and that probably ain't happening.

  Do you really think people expected this Dook team to excel in this tournament?
• reclegend22

  

  ytownfootball;1119860 wrote:Do you really think people expected this Dook team to excel in this tournament?

  No. Because I was fully prepared for a first round loss. That wasn't the point of my post, though. My point was about how Duke and Carolina fans each view the embarrassment level the other's losses to Weber State and Lehigh. Believe me, with the amount of Harold "The Show" Arcenaux chants they had to hear, last night was heaven for a Tar Heel fan.
  
  It's their turn.
• reclegend22

  

  wildcats20;1119859 wrote:A game they had no business losing. They were out played, out manned, and out coached.

  Agree with all of that. I might argue, however, that you can't coach a team that isn't willing to be coached. It's becoming more and more clear that this was never a team and there are some players that will really help the program when they either change the way they operate or leave.
  
  I think the staff and the team both checked out long ago, and that's pretty troubling. Losing to a 15 was merely confirmation of that fact.
• ironman02

  Which players are the problem? Just curious.
• reclegend22

  

  ironman02;1119878 wrote:Which players are the problem? Just curious.

  If I had to name two off the top of my head, I'd have a big arrow pointing toward Andre Dawkins (whom God knows I love, or want to love, I really do) and Seth Curry. It is my opinion that Curry just isn't happy with not being "the man." I think he saw the national frenzy that surrounded his brother and thought that's what would happen when he transferred to Duke. The problem is, while he's a very good college player, he just doesn't have the size or quickness to be that kind of star at Duke. Long story short, when Austin Rivers took over control of this team, there was an upset player in the locker-room.
  
  As for Dawkins, he's a textbook streak shooter in the mode of John Starks, so he's not always going to produce offensively. When he is on, he can score in spurts as well as any Duke player I've ever seen besides Jason Williams or J.J. Redick. On his best nights, Dawkins is pretty much unguardable. Unfortunately, if he's off, he simply chooses not to compete or do anything. He's a human light switch. And that's an extremely toxic attitude for a team that needs everyone buying in.
• reclegend22

  

  To add to all of that, one of the Plumlee brothers (I believe Mason) made a fairly disconcerting statement after a game earlier this year regarding the above sentiments, saying something to the effect that not everyone on the team was anywhere near being on the same page and that some of the guys were only willing to do just enough to coast to victory.
  
  By no means am I insinuating that Coach K has lost control of the team's infrastructure, but things definitely need to change.
• robj55

  

  LOL at Duke fans trying to blow this off as no big deal
• LJ

  

  Can we get a SuperMod to change the thread title to "Duke Off-season Thread"?
• Prescott

  This upset is no bigger than prior upsets of a 2 over 15. This duke team has not been able to stop dribble penetration all year and they couldn't contain McCollum on Friday.The dukies didn't guard all year and if the 3's aren't falling they are susceptible to defeat.
  
  Rivers might be the problem. He is a great creator, but sometimes he takes horrible and ill-advised shots.
• friendfromlowry

  robj55;1119901 wrote:LOL at Duke fans trying to blow this off as no big deal

  What are you talking about? Rec has been the only Duke fan talking consistently the past couple days and he said (in his opinion) it was one of the biggest upsets ever. Who else has been on here downplaying it?
• friendfromlowry

  Prescott;1119961 wrote:This upset is no bigger than prior upsets of a 2 over 15. This duke team has not been able to stop dribble penetration all year and they couldn't contain McCollum on Friday.The dukies didn't guard all year and if the 3's aren't falling they are susceptible to defeat.
  
  Rivers might be the problem. He is a great creator, but sometimes he takes horrible and ill-advised shots.

  Pretty much. In his post-game interview, Coach K basically said that the last couple weeks of the season, the team had just been completely off. I had a feeling the tournament wasn't going to be kind to them. I had them losing to the ND-Xavier winner - thought they'd at least be able to survive the first round. They looked shaky all season but towards the end they just collapsed completely.
• swamisez

  

  So glad this season is over. Was hard to watch this group. More often than not they played uninspired and were more of a frustration than a blessing. Twas a fitting end to the season for a team that was arguably the worst Duke basketball team since 1996 (vilify me if necessary, just my opinion).
  
  My Carolina friends were asking me why I wasn't upset and accused me of being in denial as well. I have told people all season that this team was quite poor and I think, as a safety mechanism I didn't invest fully in this team. I love them as people, and am happy to see them get degrees however I knew that I wasn't fully into this season when I turned down Duke tickets more than once and didn't have any desire to go watch them in Greensboro despite the fact I would have got a hospitality pass. It sounds like I am spoiled and yes I know this and acknowledge it, but think that I can feel this way after going to 5/6 Duke football games a year for the past 15 years.
  
  In any event, I want to say it will get better but I know it will not. Amile Jefferson and Shabazz Muhammed will not go to Duke, the class will consist of just Rasheed Suilamon and maybe a graduate transfer. This is what Duke has become, they will continue to build with 3/4 year students and will take lumps for a couple years and will hopefully make a run every 4 years. I suppose that is fine with me as long as the kids stay out of trouble and graduate. That is all I can ask for out of the program as I really don't want to see it become a one and done shop like other programs. Scheyer Singler and Smith had the VCU game, maybe for Thornton Cook and Rivers this was theirs en route to a great run as juniors and seniors.
• friendfromlowry

  ccrunner609;1120273 wrote:Sure, they were 3-2 against the #1 and 2 seeds in the regular season, if this team could of kept it together they could of made a deep run. This team falling apart is a product of coaching. Plain and simple. They have the talent to beat anyone. K has completely lost it.

  I wouldn't say he's completely lost it; they did win the title two years ago. But they have the same problems this season as they've had the past several. No dominant big man, live and die by the three pointer, and they struggle to guard more athletic teams. So no he hasn't completely lost it, but at times they way he coaches can leave a lot of gaping holes just waiting to be exploited.
• karen lotz

  

  Rivers gone, Plumlee testing the waters too.
• swamisez

  

  Think MP2 will test the market as well. Hope both he and Rivers go. Best of luck to Austin, he was a great player but didn't necessarily help the team excel.
• Azubuike24

  

  Unfortunately, with the new NCAA rule, there really isn't "testing the waters."
  
  If you announce, you're gone. April 9th is the NCAA deadline before you are declared ineligible. NBA workouts don't begin until May 2nd, NBA teams aren't given information to contact prospects until April 29th and unless you sign an agent and start talking to team reps before, you can't really operate in the gray area.
  
  Consider anyone who announces 100% gone...IMO.
• wildcats20

  

  swamisez;1125182 wrote:Think MP2 will test the market as well. Hope both he and Rivers go. Best of luck to Austin, he was a great player but didn't necessarily help the team excel.

  ]
  
  I mean yeah, they didn't "excel" but they would have been shit without him.
• Fly4Fun

  

  I don't think the new rule is necessarily bad. I think it could help to keep younger players in college longer to develop their skills more. Not only that, but they'll be farther along on their college "dregree" for later in life if they wan't to complete it.
• Azubuike24

  

  The new rule is awful. It does nothing except put more pressure on kids to decide. The deadline is a whole ONE WEEK after the NCAA title game. That is very little time to discuss the matter with your family, let alone talk to people about your game, stock and possible jump to the NBA.
  
  Add to that, the deadline was moved to BEFORE the NBA even starts their workouts. This means that unless you hire an agent (and sign away your college eligibility), you are very limited as to what information you can solicit from these people without breaking rules. So essentially, there is no more "testing the waters."
  
  Just watch. This rule is going to confuse so many people this year, there will be a rude awakening in a few months. Eligibility issues. Articles in the media. Upset families. It hasn't gotten enough publicity and the bottom line is...this rule is NOT in the best interest of the student athlete.