DoD Budget

• ptown_trojans_1

  

  The SECDEF and Chair of the Joint Chiefs provided a little taste of what the FY13 Defense Budget will look like.
  Pretty much the base budget is going down by $6 Billion. Much of the overall saving comes from not spending as much in Iraq and Afghanistan.
  Base budget goes from $531 Billion to $525 Billion.
  OCO budget goes from $115 to $88 Billion
  
  Other saving comes from shifting forces a smidge, rotating forces in Europe, eliminating some Air groups, retiring some Navy ships and delaying other ones. The F35 is delayed a little to allow for fixes in various aspects of the design.
  
  Military pay will stay the same, the DoD plans to do a smaller BRAC, to realign and close some bases in the next out years.
  Vet benefits will increase, along with a small copay apparently.
  
  The big deal is the Navy plans on delaying 2 years the replacement to the Navy Ohio class nuclear missile sub. The new SSBN (X) is going to cost $11-13 billion a sub. But, it is needed as the Ohio's are due to starting retiring in the 2020s. But, the Navy feels it can delay the cost for a few years.
  
  Overall, not a big drop at all. Just playing with the margins really.
  Story: http://www.defense.gov/news/newsarticle.aspx?id=66940
  
  Numbers: http://www.defense.gov/news/Fact_Sheet_Budget.pdf
  
  And strategy document:http://www.defense.gov/news/Defense_Budget_Priorities.pdf
  Budget is due out next week or so.
  
  What's also funny in here are no plans for the budget committee cuts of $500 billion that may come into place next January if nothing is done.
• sleeper

  

  6 billion? LOL
• I Wear Pants

  Is that supposed to be impressive? $6 billion really?
• ptown_trojans_1

  

  Yeah, I know. Obama is really weak on defense haha.
  
  It's small things here and there, mainly slowing programs.
  The main decrease comes from surprise, the costs we don't have to spend in Iraq and Afghanistan.
• sleeper

  

  Small decreases aren't going to cut it. Need massive reduction in all federal spending, 6 billion is a freaking joke.
• Cleveland Buck

  

  Obama is weak on defense. Where is our defense? Oh, it's on offense. If China showed up at our door with 10 million troops we would be fucked.
• majorspark

  

  6 billion does not even account for the waste.
• sjmvsfscs08

  Cleveland Buck;1067273 wrote:If China showed up at our door with 10 million troops we would be fucked.

  No we wouldn't.
  
  It's worth noting that China can't move ten million, or one million, or even a quarter-million troops across the ocean. They don't have the logistical support, no military other than ours can move a huge number of troops.
  
  Ron Paul is 100% right in saying that we cannot be invaded, and we would know if a country was building up the capabilities to do so (which would take more than a decade to do).
  
  Cut the DoD significantly.
• IggyPride00

  

  
  
  In 10 years the Pentagon budget has more than doubled.
  
  That is one of the huge culprits of the spiraling national debt, and any conversation about getting this nations finances under control has to start there.
• jmog

  IggyPride00;1067680 wrote:
  
  In 10 years the Pentagon budget has more than doubled.
  
  That is one of the huge culprits of the spiraling national debt, and any conversation about getting this nations finances under control has to start there.

  Even most conservatives agree that the DoD needs to cut spending in order to have a balanced budget, but even if you cut the DoD down to 400-500 billion (200-300 less than now) that only cuts the deficit from $1.3 trillion to $1.0-1.1 trillion.
  
  Major cuts need to happen in the other "big ones" as well.
  
  If they can get real about cuts and get the budget balanced, then I would be ok with tax increases to pay the actual principle on the debt down.
• Cleveland Buck

  

  In Ron Paul's Plan to Restore America, he proposes cutting the DOD Budget to $600 billion. People get hysterical like he wants us to be defenseless.
• BGFalcons82

  

  sjmvsfscs08;1067620 wrote:Ron Paul is 100% right in saying that we cannot be invaded, and we would know if a country was building up the capabilities to do so (which would take more than a decade to do).

  We are invaded each and every day along our Southern borders. Hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants stream into American each and every year. And by the way, some of the illegals have terrorism on their mind; they aren't all just looking for nirvana in the land of Obama.
• I Wear Pants

  Hundreds of thousands?
• majorspark

  

  I Wear Pants;1067807 wrote:Hundreds of thousands?

  GTFO gringos.
  
  
• pmoney25

  

  BGFalcons82;1067805 wrote:We are invaded each and every day along our Southern borders. Hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants stream into American each and every year. And by the way, some of the illegals have terrorism on their mind; they aren't all just looking for nirvana in the land of Obama.

  Make sure to check under your bed for terrorists before you fall asleep tonight.
• queencitybuckeye

  The economy has fixed the immigration issue temporarily, the "stream" of illegals is barely a trickle.
• BGFalcons82

  

  pmoney25;1067834 wrote:Make sure to check under your bed for terrorists before you fall asleep tonight.

  Nah, you're probably right. Most of the terrorists come into this country on student visas.
• BGFalcons82

  

  queencitybuckeye;1067893 wrote:The economy has fixed the immigration issue temporarily, the "stream" of illegals is barely a trickle.

  A few facts via Yahoo - http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/illegal-immigration-statistics-show-border-arrests-down-1970-203920009.html
  

  Only 327,577 people were caught crossing illegally from the Mexican border last year

  Wow, that's 27,000 people per month THAT WERE CAUGHT. How many made it? While the number is down, it most certainly is NOT a trickle.
  
  At the height in 2000:
  

  In 2000, when far fewer Border Patrol officers were stationed on the Southern border than today, a record-breaking 1.6 million illegal immigrants were caught trying to cross.

  Wow, that's 133,000 per month THAT WERE CAUGHT.
  
  I haven't been paying attention to the Ronulan's border security policy. My hunch is that is all-ye-in-come-free based on his "everyone should hug everyone" foreign policy.
• Skyhook79

  

  Cleveland Buck;1067273 wrote:Obama is weak on defense. Where is our defense? Oh, it's on offense. If China showed up at our door with 10 million troops we would be fucked.

  Where exactly is "our door"?
• Footwedge

  IggyPride00;1067680 wrote:
  
  In 10 years the Pentagon budget has more than doubled.
  
  That is one of the huge culprits of the spiraling national debt, and any conversation about getting this nations finances under control has to start there.

  The DOD is not the total aggregate of defense spending. If related departments are included, we spend well over a trillion dollars per year...or 7.5% of our GDP. Links available upon request.
• sjmvsfscs08

  BGFalcons82;1067805 wrote:We are invaded each and every day along our Southern borders. Hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants stream into American each and every year. And by the way, some of the illegals have terrorism on their mind; they aren't all just looking for nirvana in the land of Obama.

  
• sjmvsfscs08

  Footwedge;1068035 wrote:Links available upon request.

  Yes, please.
• Footwedge

  sjmvsfscs08;1068089 wrote:Yes, please.

  
  
  Although this a wiki link, all the data is footnoted for sourcing purposes. As listed, the "total package" for defense and defense related expenditures range between 1.03 trillion to 1.45 trillion per year, as cited below.
  
  Moreover, the deferred costs for taking care of our wounded is not truly included either. And our country shells out tens of millions of dollars to the families of Afganis whose civilians have been killed in "collateral damages" incidences.
  
  The annual DOD expense hardly explains the true cost of maintaining our empire
  
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_budget_of_the_United_States
  
  
  Budget breakdown for 2012

  Defense-related expenditure	2012 Budget request & Mandatory spending[SUP][20][/SUP][SUP][21][/SUP]	Calculation[SUP][22][/SUP][SUP][23][/SUP]
  DOD spending	$707.5 billion	Base budget + "Overseas Contingency Operations"
  FBI counter-terrorism	$2.7 billion	At least one-third FBI budget.
  International Affairs	$5.6–$63.0 billion	At minimum, foreign arms sales. At most, entire State budget
  Energy Department, defense-related	$21.8 billion
  Veterans Affairs	$70.0 billion
  Homeland Security	$46.9 billion
  NASA, satellites	$3.5–$8.7 billion	Between 20% and 50% of NASA's total budget
  Veterans pensions	$54.6 billion
  Other defense-related mandatory spending	$8.2 billion
  Interest on debt incurred in past wars	$109.1–$431.5 billion	Between 23% and 91% of total interest
  Total Spending	$1.030–$1.415 trillion

  [edit] Support service contractors
• sjmvsfscs08

  Wow that's prettyy crazy
• ptown_trojans_1

  

  Some of those area little misleading.
  Most of the foreign arm sales are done through the DoD, not State.
  The Energy Budget for nuclear weapons is about right, most of it is for weapons related research.
  The NASA budget shouldn't be counted, as military satellites are used by NGA, and NRO, under the DoD.
  The DoD does use some of the budget for DoD purposes, but it is a small amount, mainly R&D.
  
  Still, overall, it is a lot. But, the bulk of defense and offense money is in the DoD budget.