Central Ohio Down??

• zambrown

  

  lowsingle174;682984 wrote:High level wrestling is a lifestyle not just a sport.

  If you truly have a passion for wrestling, there is no wrestling season, it's 24/7/365.
• bigdogdad

  Cthelites;682987 wrote:Football is bigger up NE than it is here IMO.

  
  How many of those top caliber football players also wrestle? Chances of getting something in the way of money/scholarships for football much greater than wrestling.
• Sid

  Have to agree. There is much more college money for football. But, how much money is there for playing football if you weigh between 103-152. Wrestling is the great equilizer for those young men who are too small to get football scholarships. Albeit not as many schools give wrestling scholarships. Plus, they are restricted on how much money they have to give as a whole. I know this was a little bit off topic...Just saying.
• shameless

  To me..it's not about $ for college. It's about discipline, improvement, and courage. These are lifelong virtues that wrestling demands more than any other sport.
• bigdogdad

  I'm not disagreeing with any of what has been posted. Wrestling is by far the toughest sport any high school athlete can participate in. I've had people argue swimming because the cardio, rugby because of the contact, and probably a few others. But, there is nothing that combines all of these into six minutes of hell. Wrestling got him into shape for all of his other sports and gave him a edge in them also. The shear competitiveness of the sport, man-to-man(sometimes woman), who's are bigger. That is why there is the emotion of the sport.
  Totally agree with the kid has to want it more than the coach. Would have to say of the average team, unless you are a powerhouse program, only a couple of the 12 weights is this the case. Unfortunately what drives kids away are the do or die coaches. Many have wrestled in college and their passion is greater than the kids. I've seen more coaches tossed from tournaments in one season than I have in all other H.S. sports in my lifetime. I know it's off topic, but just my 2 cents on a possible cause.
• Sid

  I agree again...those virtues are a great reason to have your kid/s wrestle. Your off topic as well though. But, for those who are talented..atleast as far as colleges are concerned it IS about $ for college (unless your very well off). If you have a young man/men you are responsible for paying for their education $ is a HUGE concern. I guess you have to be a parent to understand.
  
  Dang, I type too slow bigdogdad beat me to the punch.
• shameless

  Sid;683253 wrote:I agree again...those virtues are a great reason to have your kid/s wrestle. Your off topic as well though. But, for those who are talented..atleast as far as colleges are concerned it IS about $ for college (unless your very well off). If you have a young man/men you are responsible for paying for their education $ is a HUGE concern. I guess you have to be a parent to understand.
  
  Dang, I type too slow bigdogdad beat me to the punch.

  I am a parent. Why are we responsible for paying for their education? My parents didn't pay for any of mine. It is exactly this culture of entitlement that explains why we have soft kids. So if you want a possible cause why we have fewer standout wrestlers maybe it is because we have fewer parents that are teaching their kids the right life lessons.
• squeek

  bigdogdad;683243 wrote:I'm not disagreeing with any of what has been posted. Wrestling is by far the toughest sport any high school athlete can participate in. I've had people argue swimming because the cardio, rugby because of the contact, and probably a few others. But, there is nothing that combines all of these into six minutes of hell. Wrestling got him into shape for all of his other sports and gave him a edge in them also. The shear competitiveness of the sport, man-to-man(sometimes woman), who's are bigger. That is why there is the emotion of the sport.
  Totally agree with the kid has to want it more than the coach. Would have to say of the average team, unless you are a powerhouse program, only a couple of the 12 weights is this the case. Unfortunately what drives kids away are the do or die coaches. Many have wrestled in college and their passion is greater than the kids. I've seen more coaches tossed from tournaments in one season than I have in all other H.S. sports in my lifetime. I know it's off topic, but just my 2 cents on a possible cause.

  
  Bigdogdad
  I have to laugh a bit. For the most part you and your son were tourist to the wrestling scene.
  Yes your son had above average success. Due mostly to athletic ability, size and hard work.
  With all due respect, his wrestling skills had plenty of room for improvement.
  You know little of the time and true commitment it takes to be "elite" at this sport.
  As far as what drives kids from this sport....Coaches committed to building/maintaining a successful program is not near the top of the list!
  I wish your son luck with his football career and hope he takes advantage of the education.
  
  To the topic,
  
  Central Ohio Wrestling is down "sorta".
  
  It has been behind NEO forever and had a couple of good years...back to normal.
  Hopefully someday normal will be even with NEO...just not there yet.
• Sid

  shameless;683295 wrote:I am a parent. Why are we responsible for paying for their education? My parents didn't pay for any of mine. It is exactly this culture of entitlement that explains why we have soft kids. So if you want a possible cause why we have fewer standout wrestlers maybe it is because we have fewer parents that are teaching their kids the right life lessons.

  
  LOL, soft kids? Life lessons? Entitilement? You werent RESPONSIBLE to pay for your kids education? I still think your are a kid, no parent talks like that. Good luck to you
• bigdogdad

  squeek;683309 wrote:Bigdogdad
  I have to laugh a bit. For the most part you and your son were tourist to the wrestling scene.
  Yes your son had above average success. Due mostly to athletic ability, size and hard work.
  With all due respect, his wrestling skills had plenty of room for improvement.
  You know little of the time and true commitment it takes to be "elite" at this sport.
  As far as what drives kids from this sport....Coaches committed to building/maintaining a successful program is not near the top of the list!
  I wish your son luck with his football career and hope he takes advantage of the education.
  
  To the topic,
  
  Central Ohio Wrestling is down "sorta".
  
  It has been behind NEO forever and had a couple of good years...back to normal.
  Hopefully someday normal will be even with NEO...just not there yet.

  
  Squeeky I have no idea who you are so how do you know who I'am? If you would like, send me a PM and we can discuss your opinions instead of hiding behind a screen name. It is idiotic macho caveman attitudes like yours that gives the sport a bad image.
• bigdogdad

  squeek;683309 wrote:Bigdogdad
  I have to laugh a bit. For the most part you and your son were tourist to the wrestling scene.
  Yes your son had above average success. Due mostly to athletic ability, size and hard work.
  With all due respect, his wrestling skills had plenty of room for improvement.
  You know little of the time and true commitment it takes to be "elite" at this sport.
  As far as what drives kids from this sport....Coaches committed to building/maintaining a successful program is not near the top of the list!
  I wish your son luck with his football career and hope he takes advantage of the education.
  
  To the topic,
  
  Central Ohio Wrestling is down "sorta".
  
  It has been behind NEO forever and had a couple of good years...back to normal.
  Hopefully someday normal will be even with NEO...just not there yet.

  
  Well I guess back to the topic. Central Ohio wrestling must be down if a 2 time SQ has no wrestling ability yet makes it to the big show. I would guess if you were to put together a recipe for success, I'd think ability and hard work would be part of the "elite". And to clarify, I never said he was elite nor did he aspire to be. You are correct, we where tourists. When we traveled out of town and out of state for tournaments, paid for hotels and other expenses, we did enjoy the sites and fine dining. I guess since we didn't make him sleep with head gear on 24/7/365 we were bad parents. It's macho caveman attitudes such as yours that gives the sport a bad image. Let's just agree to disagree. BTW, if you would like to PM me with your real identity,since I have no idea who you are, maybe we can discuss this in a adult manner.
• hizzmuther

  funkem123;682833 wrote:Team Ohio Strength was started last year with a bunch of central ohio wrestlers looking to take their talents to the next level. As a team we won The Tournament of Champions in the individual tournament, and we were runner-ups in the dual tournament.

  
  This is important and it's being ignored. This team was some of the best in central ohio and they stood up to competition from all over the country. AND they did this WITHOUT a coach. They met and practiced at Open Mats at various schools. They really didn't have an opportunity to train as a team, but individually, they did what they could. They got closed out of New Albany, but you saw the singlets on many of the teams in that room. These are your passionate kids... your mat rats. They are reorganizing for this "summer" (and by "summer" of course, I mean the other 8 months of the year). I expect them to be even more successful this summer and I expect them to once again not have a coach. I think this is their choice.
  
  We have looked all over central Ohio and CANNOT find a MatSharks... we cannot find a Team Michigan Elite... we cannot find a Prodigy... we cannot find a good quality all star off season team. We have found many opportunities for open mats and to jump on a team for one tournament or another, but these teams tend to be one high school heavy, and not our high school. We have paid a fortune for spring clubs only to find out no tournament wrestling was included in this fee -- no coaching at actual competition.
  
  And in D2... pretty sure Cleveland and NorthEast Ohio is not the reason we are not successful. Comes at us from a different direction.
  College money would be great... but d1 and d2 schools have, like, 9 or 9.9 scholarships for the whole entire team and often have 35 guys on their rosters. Junior Colleges have 16 -- but there are none in Ohio and only 1 in Michigan. Several in Eastern PA, not many total. Several near Chicago.
  
  Just random thoughts.
• queencitybuckeye

  Sid;683253 wrote:I agree again...those virtues are a great reason to have your kid/s wrestle. Your off topic as well though. But, for those who are talented..atleast as far as colleges are concerned it IS about $ for college (unless your very well off). If you have a young man/men you are responsible for paying for their education $ is a HUGE concern. I guess you have to be a parent to understand.
  
  Dang, I type too slow bigdogdad beat me to the punch.

  
  I'm all for the lessons that sports teach, but if it's about the $, you're far better off encouraging your child to spend more time in the library than the wrestling room. The ROI is far better for all but a few.
• american guesser

  

  Look no further than the coaching around central Ohio. You can count the number of great coaches on one hand!
• double arm bars

  It really boils down to the lack of mat skills and knowing how to manage a match.
• squeek

  bigdogdad;683342 wrote:Well I guess back to the topic. Central Ohio wrestling must be down if a 2 time SQ has no wrestling ability yet makes it to the big show. I would guess if you were to put together a recipe for success, I'd think ability and hard work would be part of the "elite". And to clarify, I never said he was elite nor did he aspire to be. You are correct, we where tourists. When we traveled out of town and out of state for tournaments, paid for hotels and other expenses, we did enjoy the sites and fine dining. I guess since we didn't make him sleep with head gear on 24/7/365 we were bad parents. It's macho caveman attitudes such as yours that gives the sport a bad image. Let's just agree to disagree. BTW, if you would like to PM me with your real identity,since I have no idea who you are, maybe we can discuss this in a adult manner.

  
  Tourist,
  0-4 at state (09-10) from a district weight class that went 1-8 in 2010. Typical of poor central performance.
  Nobody mentioned your parenting skills. I think you are a good parent. Nothing macho or caveman about there being a difference
  between being committed to success and going along for the ride. Like I said good luck with college and hit the books.
  I have had two children go though college and can tell you/everyone from experience that the GRADES is where the money is!
• Lou Demas

  Bigdogdad,
  
  I get what your trying to say, if athletic ability was all you needed to get to the State meet there would be either a bunch corn fed county boys or athletic intercity kids going every year. I don't know who you are but I'm sure your kid also had talent for the sport. It also sounds to me that if your son had wrestled 365 days of the year like a lot of elite the kids, he to could been at the elite level.
  
  If we want our central Ohio kids more competitive at the State meet level the best kids need to find a way to train together. If your kid if the big fish in the room, he is in the wrong room.
• huntergreen26

  Squeek,
  
  The wrestler that you are discussing can hardly be thought of in a light manner. Making it to the Schoot twice is quite an accomplishment, and last year alone beat 2 state placers. He drew the eventual state champ in the first round and got caught while winning in the consos. I am not even mentioning his 3.5 GPA and national honor society status. It is unfortunate that he could not compete this year, but sometimes, there are bigger fish to fry, and that fish happens to be a very promising football career. His coaches wish him all the best and support him in his future endeavors. Please don't call out individual wrestlers!
  
  As far as the Central Ohio topic, is it really down? Don't we have to be on top to be "down"? I think many will be pleasantly surprised with the success with Central Ohio this year. I know most people look at the Darby district and D1 when evaluating the talent around Columbus, but if you look at all divisions, its not looking too bad. Plase follow the success of West Jefferson, Olentangy, Hemminger, Wilson, Hutchins, Price, any Central Ohio heavyweight that makes it through. I could go on but won't. Team wise, we will not be competing for a state title (who could against Graham and St. Eds), but there are a host of outstanding wrestlers from the area that will make some noise.
  
  On the open mat side, I do agree. Fewer open mats with more wrestlers is the key but it is very hard to do. Sometimes offering wrestling opportunities at your own school is the only way to get guys on the mats. I know there are many coaches that feel this way.
  
  Bad coaches??? I can't comment on myself but there are some great coaches in the area in Hammonds, Stoll, Branam, Brooks, Andrews, Marinelli, Disabato, etc. I for one am very optimistic about the success of the area this year and in the future. The coaches and wrestlers are doing all the right things and we will continue to get stronger as a whole as interest and desire grow in the area.
• KAgin

  Wrestling matters more in NEO. My sons are youth wrestlers and our local team has traveled north a few times over the last two years. Even at the youth level there is much more interest in the sport there. I have talked to quite a few spectators in the stands at these youth events who didn't have any relation to a kid wrestling but were there to follow their HS team's future kids. In Central Ohio it is all friends and family even at most HS meets.
  
  The talent level of the kids starts the same. The love of the sport by the two areas changes things over time.
• squeek

  huntergreen26;683494 wrote:Squeek,
  
  The wrestler that you are discussing can hardly be thought of in a light manner. Making it to the Schoot twice is quite an accomplishment, and last year alone beat 2 state placers. He drew the eventual state champ in the first round and got caught while winning in the consos. I am not even mentioning his 3.5 GPA and national honor society status. It is unfortunate that he could not compete this year, but sometimes, there are bigger fish to fry, and that fish happens to be a very promising football career. His coaches wish him all the best and support him in his future endeavors. Please don't call out individual wrestlers!
  
  As far as the Central Ohio topic, is it really down? Don't we have to be on top to be "down"? I think many will be pleasantly surprised with the success with Central Ohio this year. I know most people look at the Darby district and D1 when evaluating the talent around Columbus, but if you look at all divisions, its not looking too bad. Plase follow the success of West Jefferson, Olentangy, Hemminger, Wilson, Hutchins, Price, any Central Ohio heavyweight that makes it through. I could go on but won't. Team wise, we will not be competing for a state title (who could against Graham and St. Eds), but there are a host of outstanding wrestlers from the area that will make some noise.
  
  On the open mat side, I do agree. Fewer open mats with more wrestlers is the key but it is very hard to do. Sometimes offering wrestling opportunities at your own school is the only way to get guys on the mats. I know there are many coaches that feel this way.
  
  Bad coaches??? I can't comment on myself but there are some great coaches in the area in Hammonds, Stoll, Branam, Brooks, Andrews, Marinelli, Disabato, etc. I for one am very optimistic about the success of the area this year and in the future. The coaches and wrestlers are doing all the right things and we will continue to get stronger as a whole as interest and desire grow in the area.

  
  Hunter,
  READ my post. I said that he was an above average wrestler that worked hard with athletic skills.
  Just a tourist in the sport. I think his passion is football and that is fine. Great to see that he is dedicated student as well.
  
  He didn't start wrestling as a pee wee, he didn't wrestle his senior season...TOURIST.
  Me beef is with the statement that coaches are driving kids away with there do or die attitude. (Kids fathers words not mine) I don't think he could be referring to you.
  I didn't call the kid out. I did put his accomplishment into some perspective.
  The Central will always have "qualifiers" (Central/East and Central/Dayton) but the real measure is how they do.
  Hunter if you read my posts you will see that we agree on most.
  
  You mentioned a couple of teams and individuals that should do well this year.
  I think compared to the last 2-3 years this years overall success will be less. (Less finalist, less placers, lower winning %)
  Compared to NEO it will be a big gap across the board D1, D2, and D3.
  
  As far as coaching goes. I couldn't agree more. There are many great coaches in central Ohio.(I include you) But as you know to compete at the "elite" level consistently it take a great program.
  Pee wees through High School. I see progress and think that Maddog140 is right when he asked/implied "Is Central Ohio down??"
  
  Hunter two last things
  How would your 2011 team do against your 2009 or 2010 team?
  and
  I am truly pulling for you and all the Central Ohio teams over the next three weeks. Good luck to all.
• ontheline

  

  cruiser_96;682788 wrote:Something else I just thought of... not that it is the sole reason, but who knows...
  
  In Columbus, it's Ohio State or nothing. In NEO, it's CSU, KSU, NDC, Edinboro, John Carroll, BW, ... who am I missing??? Would you count Ashland? Maybe you do, maybe you don't. But my point is, there are viable options to hit that "Perfect ZONE" for kids wanting to do wrestling in college. That zone being far enough from parents to "do" college, but close enough to receive the support (and other $tuff) you need to not crash and burn.
  
  Imagine: 3 kids of various ages, in a college that is 30 minutes for their Alma Mater, revisiting during breaks... that's kind of big. Not to mention - as someone stated previously - the spring and summer opportunities!?!?! Endless possibilities. The college wrestlers have to stay sharp, so they want to roll. 3 Frosh, a soph., and two juniors jump on board and you have an incredible nucleus.
  
  
  Not saying that this happens in every room up there, but I'd take it ANY DAY OF THE WEEK!!! Heck, just getting alumni back in our room gives me a boost! Even if they were a (fellow) 4x sectional qualifier!

  
  You might be on to something cruiser!
• cruiser_96

  

  That just means you are LOSING YOUR MIND!!!!!!!!!!!! when you are agreeing with me!
• hang_loose

  Hunter, Great reply....I don't know how well squeek knows the wrestler you're talking about, but in the wrestling room, you've dealt with him more than anyone else. The guy is way above average in everything he does. I don't think the young man (and remember guys he is still in high school) ever quit anything he set out to do....Gotta be proud of that and he will probably be way above average in life the way he was brought up.
  
  As for squeeks last question, thats why they wrestle on the mat........not paper.
• Con_Alma

  cruiser_96;682788 wrote:Something else I just thought of... not that it is the sole reason, but who knows...
  
  In Columbus, it's Ohio State or nothing. In NEO, it's CSU, KSU, NDC, Edinboro, John Carroll, BW, ... who am I missing???...

  Mount Union!!!
  
  Heidelberg!!!
• cruiser_96

  

  I mentioned Mount Union on Monday to some guys I was having lunch with. Failed to edit and update. The Berg is certainly on the list.