Ohio Cardinal Conference vs. The WCAL

• THE4RINGZ

  

  I am a big WCAL guy, but realistic enough to understand that outside of West Holmes and Madison (depending on the WCAL team) there is no way any team in the WCAL could compete in the OCC.
  
  My reasons:
  
  1. School size...The OCC is primarily a D2/D3 league with the expection of orrville and Clear Fork.
  
  2. The WCAL is a hey diddle diddle straight up the middle league, the OCC is a let's get outside and burn down the field league.
  
  And you jelly city boys can thank me for keeping the trolls away from your thread with this thread.
• BRF

  

  Oh boy oh boy oh boy!
  
  Now you've done it, Ringz. And I thank you in advance from "jelly city" if you keep the trolls off our thread....but I doubt that happens.
• OQB

  

  SMH haha here we go!
• THE4RINGZ

  

  It seemed like a relevant topic. With all those bobcat fans and all.
  
  And BRF you are welcome.
• Bloody Toothbrush

  

  OCC vs WCAL......Not much to debate, OCC hands down....all day long.
  
  About the only thing the WCAL has on Orrville in football is......Northwestern has never lost to Orrville on the grid iron. Granted, it happened long ago but.....its still Huskies 1...Riders 0.
  
  Now that I've done my troll duty by throwing an ancient log from the 60's on the fire...We should have a real debate.....
  
  Who burned that nice little bar/restaurant in downtown Orrville?.....I loved that place.
  
  My suspect is BRF!!!!!
  Here's why.............
  1. He has admitted anger issues with food servers. (see thread on serious business)
  2. He's paranoid about people snooping around his profile (paranoia=guilt)
  3. He's been talking in the 3rd person lately. (telltale sign of instability)
  
  *disclaimer....for amusement purposes only. No need to tell on me.....again.
• THE4RINGZ

  

  Good point Bloody, and I believe it is also The College of Wooster 2 The Ohio State University 1 on the grid iron. Sadly The Fighting Scots won in the 19teens prior to the BCS or we could also claim our mid major school should be playing for a national title game ala boise state, and tcu.
• thePITman

  

  Chippewa 189
  Norwayne 177
  Northwestern 173
  Waynedale 165
  Smithville 161
  Hillsdale 140
  Rittman 120
  Dalton 109
  --------------------
  Tot: 1,234 Avg: 154
  
  Ashland 470
  Wooster 449
  Mansfield Sr 435
  Madison 390
  Lexington 328
  West Holmes 305
  Clear Fork 224
  Orrville 214
  -------------------
  Tot: 2,815 Avg: 352
  
  Boys' enrollment: OCC 2,815 ... WCAL 1,234 (Avg: OCC 352 ... WCAL 154)
  
  On average, OCC schools are 2.3 times larger than WCAL schools. The smallest school in the OCC (Orrville) is 13% larger than the largest school in the WCAL (Chippewa), and we ALL know what would happen if those two schools played in ANY sport (except maybe women's soccer or baseball)!
  
  Here is my 2 cents:
  
  Take a school over twice as large, and the disparity in selection of athletes is quite significant. Just last night we had a 7-on-7 against Wooster. We would only be the 3rd smallest school in the OCC, yet there was still a giant, noticeable difference in the athletes.
  
  Sure, there may be WCAL teams now and then that could not only be competitive in the OCC but challenge for the championship (might not win it, but would challenge) - last year's Hillsdale team (but last year would have been a tough year to break the ice in the OCC), or Smithville in '02 and '04, or Waynedale/Dalton in '03 - but in a normal year, there is very little comparison, in my opinion. The best teams in the WCAL would compete for the bottom 1/2 of the OCC, if that. Middle-of-the-pack OCC would have no problem with any the WCAL in most years, but some years might. Bottom-feeder WCAL schools would never have a chance against a bottom-feeder in the OCC in any given year.
  
  This whole discussion came up because of the prediction of Orrville beating Norwayne in the Region 13 championship. If they were to meet up, it would be a great event for those two schools and for Wayne County, and that's something we all can be excited about! If either team actually gets to the playoffs, let alone the regional championship, is yet to be seen. There are 3 conferences I follow closely every year - the PAC-7, WCAL, and OCC - and I wish all 3 the best this year!
• was_that_it

  Well said PIT. Conversation over. I aggree with 99.9% of your post. The only thing is what 5knots said over on the thread we were all trolling, it can be said that the top two teams in any conference would be competative in another. I am a sucker for the under dogs and would like to think that the top two WCAL teams wouldn't get manhandled in the OCC, any year, the way many think. Then again I drink alot of small school cool-aid.
• BRF

  

  Bloody Toothbrush;842620 wrote:
  *disclaimer....for amusement purposes only. No need to tell on me.....again.

  
  SMH on making fun of a friend of mine's business burning up. Are you ever going to get it through your head that I did NOT "tell on you"?
  
  Anyhow, Pitman, the stats you posted are an interesting read. TY.
• Mr. Russell

  

  I played in both the WCAL and OCC for Regional Qualifying teams, in different sports.
  
  My thoughts are this.
  
  In football, I think the WCAL is clearly outmatched, because of what Pit explained about numbers and things that like, it would be very difficult for WCAL teams to win in that league. Now I do not think it would be as difficult as some think it would be to compete, because many teams are ball control teams that take a lot of time off of the clock and compare very similarly to Clearfork. Specifically teams like Smithville and Norwayne every year, then you have your special Waynedale teams of the past that definitely could beat some OCC teams. Are they going to stop Ashland's Spread? I don't know about that one. Recently Orrville's defenses have been on a roll! So I doubt that a WCAL school could beat them, but in the past, their achilles heel was stopping wing-t football teams. Can MAC schools beaet BIG 1O schools on a consistent basis on the gridiron? No, but every few years, there would be some upsets and almost always good games. Maybe not with the power houses like Ashland, Lexington, and Orrville, but I honestly do not think that in many cases, Mansfield Senior could prepare and stop Smithville's complex Wing-T, or West Holmes would beat a team like Norwayne, Waynedale, or Hillsdale. As far as the crazy Norwayne vs Orrville talk for the regional finals, both schools should know better than to say anything about that. Orrville has been a favorite and an underdog, so you would think that they would have nothing to say about the issue. They have much more pressing games just to make the playoffs, and then the regional finals. Norwayne has never even made a regional final so to predict them to go there is cool, but that is still a longshot given their history. I would think that if both teams made it that far, it would not be the blowout that everybody thinks it would be. Like Orrville people have said before, if you make it that far, you simply cannot be a pushover.
  
  In basketball, it is much more wide open. While in the OCC, we had good teams, but Northwestern would always give us all we could handle. I specifically remember my freshman year get smashed by them on the varsity level, after only beating them by 1 the previous year. Teams like Wooster, West Holmes, Clearfork, and even Ashland in recent years would have clearly gotten beaten by the top schools in the WCAL. There were years when Northwestern would handle Wooster when the two Alberts were still coaching. Smithville's team in 08 probably would have won the OCC after Mansfield Senior's great class from the previous year graduated, and I would think that their team from 09 probably still would have been unblemished in the OCC, as they played many of those teams in the off-season and had no trouble disposing of them. Now, besides that team at the top of the league, could Chippewa and Rittman compete in the OCC? Hell no, but the gap is much closer for the top 4 teams every year in the OCC for basketball than football.
  
  Baseball may even be the closest. PIT would know more than me on this subject, but I am pretty sure that the WCAL champions of the past few years could have won many games in the OCC, but once again, what about the bottom feeders?
  
  Overall, the OCC is definitely a more balanced league than the WCAL, anybody who debates that is silly. But also, anybody who is so proud about the OCC schools being able to beat WCAL schools is also silly. I hate to say, but it is a lose-lose situation, and I have seen many Orrville people agree with that in the past when talking about potential match-ups, it may sound cocky or hesitant on their part but it is legit. You should beat them, so if you win it is not a big deal, but if you lose, the WCAL schools will talk about it for years to come. I really enjoyed playing in the OCC, there was NOTHING like playing for a smaller school in Orrville with the most tradition around and going to Ashland Stadium in football for a conference championship, or The Jungle at Mansfield Senior when they simply did not lose in the conference. However, I think the WCAL is tremendous, for schools so close in size, and with similar athletes to compete in a league in such a close radius is very cool. When my friends from college come and visit, they are in awe of how we can drive twenty minutes in any direction and play a school nearly identical to us. Good topic and good luck to all the teams from both leagues this year!
  
  EDIT: Besides the big school competition, one of the only things I miss about the OCC is BRF's pool at this time of year, to kick off football season!
• Red Rum

  

  I think PITMANs post is pretty much spot on. I also enjoyed reading Mr. Russells take, he has a unique perspective having been in both leagues.
  
  I'm not really sure this topic even merited a thread but I realize the evil Darth 4Ringz couldn't resist the opportunity to stir up trouble in the Wayne Area Empire.
  
  The only real mystery left on this thread is whether BRF will fall into the Turdbrush trap and let Bloody wind him up all over again this year.
  
  Good Luck to all the area football teams!
• BRF

  

  Ah yes, Mr. Russell, those were good times!
• riders1

  

  Now take it easy on BRF today, afterall is Tribe is losing and he is on these threads now because it's not on tv, and from the sounds of it with 5 more errors than hits he's glad he can't see the game , so take it easy on him
  
  BRF,Still have that Feller statue for you to brighten your day
• BRF

  

  Very funny, riders1, very funny!
  
  Red Rum: it's kinda hard not to get wound up when you are the target of practically every post on here by him.
• thedemoralizer7

  having more kids in your school doesnt automatically give you the W. Look at dalton, the smallest school in the wcal who won league in 09 with 30 guys on the roster going against teams like northwestern, hillsdale, and waynedale with about 70 kids on their rosters. I do agree however that the wcal would have alot more motivation playing the occ. If the occ didnt win by 40 then you would be hearing it from us WCAL fans!
• thePITman

  

  It's that time again!
  
  Every year I send and receive lots of updates for high school football games from the PAC-7, WCAL, OCC, and others. Whatever updates I get, I post to my Twitter account (@AndrewMarcum). If you wish to receive text notifications when I post updates, text "follow AndrewMarcum" (without the quotes) to the number 40404. Let me know if you have any questions!
  
  I forgot to mention... in order for me to send updates, I need to receive them. Please send me a PM if you can send updates and need my cell #. Thank you!