Reds vs Cubs Games #16-#19
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Azubuike24
Haha, you answer one question with sarcasm and then right after it, bitch about the team.SportsAndLady;1793065 wrote:600
For real, what's your win prediction? Are you going to bet they aren't one of the 5 worst teams? -
Azubuike24
Same can be said about Phillips. And Hoover. At least they moved swiftly with Jumbo. If a veteran is good, get something for him. If a veteran sucks, get rid of him. In the end, there's no point in rolling them out there.Terry_Tate;1793067 wrote:I don't understand why Simon is getting any starts over Stephenson.
You're best prospects are being directly blocked by veterans.
Stephenson by Simon
Reed by Straily/Melville
Peraza by Phillips
Winker by Duvall/Schebler -
SportsAndLady
I'm not bitching about the team, I'm calling a spade a spade.Azubuike24;1793068 wrote:Haha, you answer one question with sarcasm and then right after it, bitch about the team.
For real, what's your win prediction? Are you going to bet they aren't one of the 5 worst teams? -
Azubuike24
...and so am I. The Reds suck. They were the 2nd worst team in MLB last year, dealt their closer (Chapman), lost a starting pitcher in free agency (Leake), dealt their 3B (Frazier), signed back a scrub and put him in the rotation (Simon). Sure, they are .500, but who really believes that?SportsAndLady;1793071 wrote:I'm not bitching about the team, I'm calling a spade a spade.
I'm definitely optimistic about the team in a year or two. Love the arms they have, even the mediocre prospects (Lamb, Moscot, Lorenzen, etc). They should be able to contend in a year or two if they find a reliable closer and just get solid contributions from Votto, Mesoraco, Suarez, Cozart and Bruce. You can do worse than those 4 as your 1-2-3-4-5.
Really excited for Reed, Stephenson, Garrett and a few others joining DeSclafani, Iglesias, Finnegan and Bailey. -
Azubuike24
...and I'm sorry if I'm always negative, I'll try to tone it down a bit. It just doesn't make a ton of sense to not just go full Astros of 2011-13 or Braves of 2015-17 and actively tank.
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Heretic
I thought that's what they (management) were trying to do. Didn't Phillips reject his trade and didn't the Bruce trade fall through because of injury concerns involving whomever they were going to get for him? Take those two away and as far as veteran, high-paid players go, who would they have other than Votto, whose contract makes him a Red for eternity in all likelihood. I mean, the only reason Simon was even signed was because of all their pitching injuries (as well as a couple of the mediocre relievers like Ohlendorf).Azubuike24;1793074 wrote:...and I'm sorry if I'm always negative, I'll try to tone it down a bit. It just doesn't make a ton of sense to not just go full Astros of 2011-13 or Braves of 2015-17 and actively tank.
Now Price on the other hand seems to be the guy impeding that, with how he keeps giving guys who are sucking chance after chance at the expense of young guys. I was mildly surprised that Hoover still gets to come in during late innings, but that's at least semi-understandable since he's not that old and has been at least solid in more of a 7-8 inning role; but having Simon get starts while they just bring Stephenson up and down when they need a spot start is mind-boggling. After today, I can't see him appearing again, but I was also surprised as hell that he was allowed to get today's start. Great idea; you finally did something against the Cubs, so put in the human gas can and keep him out long enough for every single Cub to shit down his throat. -
Azubuike24
Yes, Phillips rejected the trade, but we also don't know exactly why. Was it the location? Was it Dusty? Was it that the Reds only were dealing him to the Nats because they wanted something the Nats had? It's less about Phillips BEING there, as it is Peraza being blocked.
The Bruce deal is weird. He was all but dealt to the Mets last year for Wheeler, but the Reds backed out. They apparently didn't get much for him in-terms of offers in the off-season, which makes some sense, he had an AWFUL year.
As for that being their plan, it seems they are planning more of a 1-2 year plan vs a 4-5 year plan. In that case, made sense to deal Frazier who was a FA in 2017 and coming up on 30. It made less sense to wait on dealing Chapman, who was rumored to be Arizona bound last year for A.J. Pollock and Archie Bradley (in a package). Given what they spent on Shelby Miller just a few months later, you never know. Then, Chapman got into legal trouble they sold him for half of that value to the Yanks. On top of that, if you were going to use Chapman strictly as a 3 out reliever, you couldn't be worried about his arm and he is plenty young enough to be kept through the rebuild.
To me, the Reds have a 4-5 year plan, but it could be accelerated if their young guys prove ready to go sooner than expected. Say they start 2017 with a proven and experienced young rotation, they start finding some reliable bullpen guys, all of the sudden, you have Bruce and Votto in their prime, Mesoraco, Suarez, Hamilton, Cozart, Winker, etc...still under team control, you have a chance. In the end though, is that enough talent to beat the Pirates, Cubs, Dodgers, etc? I am not sure it is, and they would be better off selling more guys, saving money and getting more picks and higher picks, and just purposely suck for 3-4 years. -
Ironman92
Phillips is still here because he's the MAN in Cincy...he wouldn't be 1/2 as heralded anywhere else.
Who the hell at his age and has never won anything would turn down going to the Nationals? -
Azubuike24
You never know. You could ask him, "Brandon, where will you go?" Wherever that is, you give him to them for free and negotiate how much of his salary they will take. It's not like he's bringing millions of fans to GABP or building up to have incredible future value to the Reds.
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Ironman92
He's where he wants to be. That's crystalAzubuike24;1793100 wrote:You never know. You could ask him, "Brandon, where will you go?" Wherever that is, you give him to them for free and negotiate how much of his salary they will take. It's not like he's bringing millions of fans to GABP or building up to have incredible future value to the Reds.
clear. Plays everyday adding to career counting stats, announcers and fans love him and he bats fourth lol.
29 other teams...they aren't offering much of that. -
SnotBubbles
sherm03;1792782 wrote:I hate having friends in Chicago. So much shit talk last night.
Try being a Cubs fan living in Ohio (within 2 hours of Cincy). Especially from 2009-2014. The shit talking goes both ways. I've learned to just keep my mouth shut, even now that the tables have turned. I get a kick out of seeing old posts from 2-3 years ago on my social media though.SportsAndLady;1792820 wrote:Welcome to my world.
Makes me despise the Cubs that much more. -
se-alum
Stephenson and Winker should definitely be with the big club, but i'm sure it has to do with options and team control. Also, Barnhart should be the everyday catcher, better defensively and not a big drop off, if any from Meso, and we know with injury history, Meso isn't long for the catching position.
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SportsAndLady
Agree on Barnhart/Meso. I've always been very critical of Meso. When you take into effect his health and offensive cold streak issues, he's just not very goodse-alum;1793509 wrote:Stephenson and Winker should definitely be with the big club, but i'm sure it has to do with options and team control. Also, Barnhart should be the everyday catcher, better defensively and not a big drop off, if any from Meso, and we know with injury history, Meso isn't long for the catching position.
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Azubuike24
I'm less opposed to Winker being in the minors simply because if the Reds ever use Mesoraco in LF (that's probably his future spot, or DH when it comes to the NL), he could fill in there. Duvall and Schebler aren't great, but both aren't guys you just release. They could be useful reserves in the future, so giving them PT in a season like this isn't so bad.
Stephenson, totally agree. He was close to making it out of spring. He's had 2 of the 4 best starts of the whole year for the team, and Tim Melville has gotten 2 starts, Alfredo Simon 3 starts. -
se-alum
I don't see Meso ever being a LF'er with the Reds. If he's not there in this rebuilding year, he's not going to be there when they're competitive.Azubuike24;1793611 wrote:I'm less opposed to Winker being in the minors simply because if the Reds ever use Mesoraco in LF (that's probably his future spot, or DH when it comes to the NL), he could fill in there. Duvall and Schebler aren't great, but both aren't guys you just release. They could be useful reserves in the future, so giving them PT in a season like this isn't so bad.
Stephenson, totally agree. He was close to making it out of spring. He's had 2 of the 4 best starts of the whole year for the team, and Tim Melville has gotten 2 starts, Alfredo Simon 3 starts.