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Cleveland Cavs at Detroit Pistons

  • KnightXC1
    I never said the Pistons were going to be contenders this year because they are a piece or two and a year or two away from that. However, the healthy team I saw on opening night is completely different than what you saw last night. When healthy, the Pistons have 5 guys (Rip, Gordon, Bynum, Stuckey, Charlie V) who can put in 20 on any given night and more then likely 2 will each game. The 3 rookies they have are going to be good players and the defense is already much better than last year. If they get healthy, they can make a push for a 6th seed in the East, especially after the brutal opening month of the season they had.

    As for Lebron, I will never take anything away from what the man can do on the court. I was lucky enough to see him play his junior and senior year of high school in Toledo and I have never been more impressed with a high school player (William Buford, now at OSU is a close second). He is a freak athlete that is incredibly gifted in so many ways and could average 40 during a season if he wanted to. Unlike the panzie who retired yesterday, he plays for and with his teammates and gets them involved to take pressure off of himself, which is one of the things I really like about his game.

    That said, going on and on about possibly leaving during the playoffs the last two years instead of doing what he did this year and say he won't talk about erked me a lot. The whole Orlando thing really dropped him down for me as it was just a lack of class on his part. His reasoning was garbage and not one person I have seen has backed him on that, not one. He whines after any call that goes against him (a lot of players do, I realize this, especially star players) and gives off the impression that he is entitled to get calls. Granted he may not get every call but no one does so just move on and stop whining. You would not have even been able to tell he get hit on the head during that dunk last night if not for a slow motion replay. If he would just play and lower the amount of whining, I probably would not have near the problem with him.

    Amazingly gifted player who will probably be a first ballot hall of famer barring any career threatening injury in the next year or two and go down as one of the greats. Just don't care for how he handles himself, that's all.
  • devil1197
    Knight, every single damn NBA player complains about not getting calls. Don't be ignorant.
  • ytownfootball
    LeBron, arguably also gets hammered more than any other player in the league by virtue of his penetration. I think it's proportional.
  • 94hoops
    Pistons had their 3 best players play in this game IMHO. Gordon is their best player, missed second half though. Stuckey is thei second best player and Villanueva third best. Prince, 4th best player and Hamilton although still a nice player his game has peaked and he is now on the downside of his basketball career.

    Nice win for the Cavs.
  • Fab4Runner
    wildcats20 wrote:
    Fab4Runner wrote: Oh snap now we have a legit hater on here and not just Mantooth. LOL @ people who dislike LeBron. I love that all anyone can come up with is him not shaking hands after one game....wouldn't really call that him acting like an ass "most of the time". There is a reason most players in the NBA picked him when asked who they would like to have as a teammate. He is an amazing athlete, basketball player and above all else a great guy and role model.
    LeBron sucks. :D
    Hi. I hate your guts.
  • KnightXC1
    94hoops - Stuckey is not their second best player, not even close. Rip and Tayshaun are so vital to the team because it allows them to bring Gordon off the bench with Bynum which almost no team can match with their second unit. Tayshaun is important for his defense and ability to play in the post.

    Devil - I won't disagree but some do after every call and others don't. Just man up, admit you fouled or traveled and move on.
  • hoops23
    Stuckey is most definitely the Pistons 2nd best player. He may even be in the running as their best.

    You're still stuck on the Pistons of old in Tayshaun and RIP... While nice players, they're not the guys who will be carrying the Pistons, but Stuckey is able to do that because he can score with the ball, instead of waiting for it to be passed to him.
  • SQ_Crazies
    Um, he doesn't mess up. He does everything right. He's a great player. The media has to stretch further than Stretch Armstrong to come up with something negative to write about him. He's a great player. He pretty much always says the right thing. He's a great player. In Knight's case, he OWNS your team ever since he destroyed your dynasty with probably the best playoff performance ever. Did I mention that he's a great player?

    Haters are haters. Ask most why and they'll come up with ridiculous reasons and talk in circles all night, making themselves sound like morons all the while. Point is, if he played for the Pistons, Knight would love him. Jealousy is a son of a bitch isn't it? No point in listening to this clown, or any of the other haters for that matter. He is everything everyone wants--so naturally when they don't have him, they'll hate him.
  • KnightXC1
    Ltrain - Stuckey is nowhere near being the Pistons second best player. He is incredibly inconsistent and makes a lot of poor decisions at the PG position. He has been very consistent at being outplayed by Will Bynum for about the entire season. Rip is still better than Stuckey and it's really not that close. I know Rip and Tay are not going to be carrying the team in the future, as it will be Gordon, Charlie V, Stuckey, Bynum, and the three rookies. But they are two very vital parts of the team now.

    SQ - ah, we meet again on the Free Huddle. Before I make my counter point, let me first say I enjoy discussing the NBA with you as most of my friends could care less about the NBA so it's nice to be able to go back and forth with someone.

    I am not going to reiterate everything I have mentioned on this thread about Lebron. Great player, but he is a whiner. I have friends who are big Cavs fans and some who are just Lebron fans and even they agree that he should keep his mouth shut more often. And I will be dead honest about this point, if he played for the Pistons and was discussing possibly leaving in the middle of a playoff run like he has done the past 2 seasons, I would be pissed about it. I was pissed at Larry Brown when he did it in 05 during the playoffs because it was just a distraction and made Larry look bad. I actually applaud James for finally saying he is not going to talk about the offseason for the rest of the year because quite frankly, he shouldn't.

    I am not jealous of Lebron and have no reason to be. I am not a hater because if that were the case, I would say "he sucks, he can't win, Kobe is ten times better, etc". He is an amazing talent and will be for another 10 years, but he says and does some things I don't like, that is all. He was in the wrong after the Magic series and his reasoning just erked me a lot. He played great in that series but got no help, which isn't his fault. But to not shake hands and say what he did was such a bad example for someone who is looked up to by millions of kids. If he played for someone besides the Cavs, perhaps you wouldn't love him as much either.
  • hoops23
    So a guy who is averaging 17+ ppg and 5+ rpg isn't "close" to being your best player?

    hmmm...

    The only thing Rodney needs to do, is learn how to play the PG effectively. He's more of a 2 guard who is playing the PG spot. Once he learns this, he'll be a REALLY good player.

    I do agree that he needs to get more consistent in terms of his jump shot, but other than that, he's pretty consistent.
  • wes_mantooth
    Fab4Runner wrote: Oh snap now we have a legit hater on here and not just Mantooth. LOL @ people who dislike LeBron. I love that all anyone can come up with is him not shaking hands after one game....wouldn't really call that him acting like an ass "most of the time". There is a reason most players in the NBA picked him when asked who they would like to have as a teammate. He is an amazing athlete, basketball player and above all else a great guy and role model.
    Whoa, whoa, whoa......don't bring me into this. You are a chick....get out of the pro sports forum and back into the kitchen where you belong.
  • KnightXC1
    Ltrain - Don't get too caught up into Rodney's stats. His overall play has not been what it should be. His PPG will stay up as long as Rip, Tay, and Gordon are out but once all of them are back, he will probably drop to 12-13 a game with Rip and Gordon both around 20. Yes, his jumper needs to be more consistent and he is a 2 guard playing at the point. His decision making is really the thing that has to improve in order for him to make that next step. But when the whole team is healthy, he is behind Gordon, Rip, and Charlie V.
  • 94hoops
    Ltrain-

    No sense in arguing with knightxci. We obviously see it different then he does and he is entitled to his opinion. Anyway you slice it, even with their best players, they will be no match for the cavs as long as the Ltrain stays in Cleveland
  • SQ_Crazies
    KnightXC1 wrote: If he played for someone besides the Cavs, perhaps you wouldn't love him as much either.
    Well, you're very wrong about that. I've made it very clear in the past that I'm a LeBron fan first--if he goes to the Knicks, I'll be more a fan of the Knicks than the Cavs. Although I'll always have a spot in my heart for the hometown team, it's just a coincidence that my favorite player plays for them. Same way with the NFL--I quietly root for the Browns, but I wouldn't call myself a Browns fan. In fact I love to watch the Steelers. Other than baseball, when it comes to professional sports I'm more a fan of players than teams.
  • SQ_Crazies
    And I enjoy arguing with you as well, more than most because you add intelligent conversation whether I agree with it or not. But I'm not going to argue with what you just said, we could go until our fingers are numb and not get anywhere so it's pointless. The only thing I'll say about your argument, when it comes to him whining I'll agree he does it a lot. But in all unbiased honesty, I'll say 90% of the time he whines he has a legit complaint. Sure there are some times when he doesn't, but the game happens just as fast for the players as it does for the officials. But I think you view it the wrong way, that's the competitor in him--he wants every call to go his way. And then there is the fact that he is who he is--it is no secret that star players get favorable calls, and really considering this is a huge business, they should. It goes beyond just the game being played in the pro's (that's part of the reason I'm not as much of a professional TEAM fan), but some people don't get that. Just like some people don't understand why every player in the NBA isn't committed to winning a championship. Some people don't care, they're there to collect their check--it's still a job to them. But LeBron whines for a reason most of the time, he either really believes he should have gotten the call (and in most cases, based on replays, he is right--but I don't hold it against the officials, they have a very difficult job) and sometimes he does it to make sure he gets the next call, or they pay attention to something specific. Nothing wrong with that, like I said it's the competitor in him, but I understand how it rubs you the wrong way.
  • Fab4Runner
    wes_mantooth wrote:
    Fab4Runner wrote: Oh snap now we have a legit hater on here and not just Mantooth. LOL @ people who dislike LeBron. I love that all anyone can come up with is him not shaking hands after one game....wouldn't really call that him acting like an ass "most of the time". There is a reason most players in the NBA picked him when asked who they would like to have as a teammate. He is an amazing athlete, basketball player and above all else a great guy and role model.
    Whoa, whoa, whoa......don't bring me into this. You are a chick....get out of the pro sports forum and back into the kitchen where you belong.
    I will punch you right in the balls next time we hang out. After I make you a sandwich.
  • KnightXC1
    ^^LOL

    SQ - I agree on that point. Having been a basketball ref for 4 years, you can never make every call, nor make the right call every time. I guess my biggest problem in the NBA is that Lebron/Kobe/Wade will get one call but Stuckey/Varejao won't get the same call. Players do whine to get future calls and it works most of the time. Some whine more than others and the ref in me hated players that whined because it made me less inclined to call something for them later. I just told them to go play and move on. which is what I wish more NBA players would do but obviously that won't change. And I take note that you are more a Lebron fan than a fan of his team. Need to remember that for future reference and arguments :)
  • wes_mantooth
    Fab4Runner wrote:
    wes_mantooth wrote:
    Fab4Runner wrote: Oh snap now we have a legit hater on here and not just Mantooth. LOL @ people who dislike LeBron. I love that all anyone can come up with is him not shaking hands after one game....wouldn't really call that him acting like an ass "most of the time". There is a reason most players in the NBA picked him when asked who they would like to have as a teammate. He is an amazing athlete, basketball player and above all else a great guy and role model.
    Whoa, whoa, whoa......don't bring me into this. You are a chick....get out of the pro sports forum and back into the kitchen where you belong.
    I will cup your balls next time we hang out. After I make you a sandwich.
    Thanks
  • SQ_Crazies
    Knight--Like I said, there is a reason for that. Kobe/LeBron/Wade--that's where the money is at. Whether you like it or not that's how it is and how it will be--and basketball isn't the only sport guilty of it. How often do you think a great left tackle gets away with holding as opposed to a rookie LT in the NFL? Another part of the reason is, in that football sense, they won't even pay attention to that guy because they expect him not to hold. Or in basketball, sometimes the officials get caught up looking at the wrong thing, especially with a star player. You can't fault them for getting caught up in the amazement of what they just did either. But as far as LeBron is concerned, just be glad he isn't on the free throw line more often--I'm not complaining, but within the rules he really should be. Just throwing a number out I'd say he gets fouled about 80% of the time he drives to rim--it might get called 50%, even half that and only 40% of the time. He's got that Shaq syndrome, he's so big and powerful (different from any other player) that sometimes he gets fouled and since he doesn't go flying onto the floor it's hard to tell.

    But NBA officials have a hard job, professional basketball moves so fast it's hard to see everything.
  • KnightXC1
    Oh I agree with that. Same thing in baseball where A-Rod will get a call on balls and strikes that Grady Sizemore won't. It's sad that sports are like that but it is what it is. I hate that stars get calls and others don't. Makes College Basketball much more interesting because everyone gets a fair shake for the most part.
  • SQ_Crazies
    You can't hate that stars get calls--it's part of the reason the NBA is what it is. Same with baseball, football, whatever. The stars bring the money.
  • KnightXC1
    Well while stars bring in the money, they play under the same rules as rookies do. I realize it won't change but it's not right that because someone is better than someone else that they are entitled to calls the rookie shouldn't get. Everyone should be on an equal playing field but they aren't.
  • wes_mantooth
    ^^^True, but you know that will never happen.
  • SQ_Crazies
    You aren't still missing the point are you? Whether you like it or not that's how it is and will be. It doesn't matter if it's fair, that isn't the point. It's a business before it's a game at the professional level. A lot of people need to realize that about all professional leagues.
  • KnightXC1
    I realize that to the fullest extent and have for a long time now. Doesn't mean I have to like it.