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Would you "harass" this woman?

  • BR1986FB
    Would not "harass" because a) not my style to harass and b) don't find her attractive.
  • TedSheckler
    BR1986FB;1669298 wrote:Would not "harass" because a) not my style to harass and b) don't find her attractive.
    Shorter: Would not harass, I like men.
  • like_that
    TedSheckler;1669300 wrote:Shorter: Would not harass, I like men.
    If you find her attractive, then you actually might like men.
  • BR1986FB
    like_that;1669302 wrote:If you find her attractive, then you actually might like men.
    Agreed.

    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to like_that again.
  • Laley23
    O-Trap;1669277 wrote: I completely agree with you that if you speak to someone, you're wanting them to pay attention ... at very least to what you've said. Otherwise, there's no point in speaking at all.

    However, why do you think that 99% of unprompted greetings are for sexual reasons? Hell, I greet strangers all the time in passing, just to be cordial.

    And again, I'm not saying I'm certain that any one of them is platonic in motivation. I actually think you're probably right. I'm just saying that I don't see anything that tells me for sure, and greeting someone with some socially-acceptable platitude isn't without precedent in our culture.
    I greet people as well, if we make eye contact or if it's a small passing like a grocery store etc. But I find it hard to believe anyone is randomly greeting someone walking down a crowded street in NYC. If that's the case, your gonna be out of breath quickly.
  • O-Trap
    Laley23;1669317 wrote:I greet people as well, if we make eye contact or if it's a small passing like a grocery store etc. But I find it hard to believe anyone is randomly greeting someone walking down a crowded street in NYC. If that's the case, your gonna be out of breath quickly.
    Perhaps. As I said, I think you're probably right about the motivation, but I admit that my agreement is purely speculative, and is, thus, not good enough for me to state as fact that they are all necessarily sexually motivated.

    In theory, virtually any good deed or act of kindness could be sexually motivated.
  • Laley23
    O-Trap;1669332 wrote:Perhaps. As I said, I think you're probably right about the motivation, but I admit that my agreement is purely speculative, and is, thus, not good enough for me to state as fact that they are all necessarily sexually motivated.

    In theory, virtually any good deed or act of kindness could be sexually motivated.
    Also true. And frankly, there is NOTHING wrong with it, IMO. If you are sexually motivated, but keep it polite and courteous, nothing at all wrong.
  • Fab4Runner
    Some of the comments were harassment, and some were not. Saying hello or have a nice evening is perfectly fine. Making comments about her body and following her (super creepy, btw) is not fine. I've dealt with my fair share of catcalls. They do not bother me (not much does...I am very hard to offend), but that doesn't mean other men or women aren't allowed to dislike them or find them offensive.

    And if any of you really think that all of those people were just being nice and friendly and doling out pleasantries...come on. Did you see any of those same men saying hello or good morning to the men who were walking by? No. If this was some super friendly neighborhood where every single man and woman said hello to every other man and woman...then yes, we could say they were just being nice. That's not what some of these men were doing.
  • Zoltan
    Fab4Runner;1669336 wrote: And if any of you really think that all of those people were just being nice and friendly and doling out pleasantries...come on. Did you see any of those same men saying hello or good morning to the men who were walking by? No. If this was some super friendly neighborhood where every single man and woman said hello to every other man and woman...then yes, we could say they were just being nice. That's not what some of these men were doing.
    Who care's if the motivation was sexual? Every man/woman has ever had sex, gotten married, had kids, etc. started with a first meeting. If I go up to a woman and say, "Hi, how are you doing?" is that OK even though sexual attraction is what motivated me?

    It's completely OK to approach a woman based on a sexual attraction, it's just not OK to do it an offensive manner.
  • Fab4Runner
    Zoltan;1669342 wrote:Who care's if the motivation was sexual? Every man/woman has ever had sex, gotten married, had kids, etc. started with a first meeting. If I go up to a woman and say, "Hi, how are you doing?" is that OK even though sexual attraction is what motivated me?

    It's completely OK to approach a woman based on a sexual attraction, it's just not OK to do it an offensive manner.
    Yes, that is okay. Making sexual remarks to a stranger, talking specifically about her body, and then following her very closely is not okay, and should not just be accepted as such. Am I bothered when it happens to me? No, not really. But I completely understand why some people are not fine with it.

    Again, saying hello, etc. is no big deal. It's polite even. But that's not what was happening the majority of the time in this video. If you think someone is attractive and you want to meet them, try something besides whistling or creepily following them.
  • O-Trap
    Fab4Runner;1669336 wrote:And if any of you really think that all of those people were just being nice and friendly and doling out pleasantries...come on. Did you see any of those same men saying hello or good morning to the men who were walking by? No. If this was some super friendly neighborhood where every single man and woman said hello to every other man and woman...then yes, we could say they were just being nice. That's not what some of these men were doing.
    Ultimately, what I think about their motives is irrelevant. The behavior itself is seemingly not sexist, and I don't like the idea of trying to assume someone's motives, since my own reasons for doing something don't necessarily have anything to do with someone else's. If I help one homeless man I pass on the street, I should hope my motives aren't called into question because I don't help several ... or all ... of them.

    The notion that we might treat someone based on our assumptions of their motives just doesn't sit well with me, I guess. Actions we can judge, because they're what we can "see."
  • Fab4Runner
    O-Trap;1669348 wrote:Ultimately, what I think about their motives is irrelevant. The behavior itself is seemingly not sexist, and I don't like the idea of trying to assume someone's motives, since my own reasons for doing something don't necessarily have anything to do with someone else's. If I help one homeless man I pass on the street, I should hope my motives aren't called into question because I don't help several ... or all ... of them.

    The notion that we might treat someone based on our assumptions of their motives just doesn't sit well with me, I guess. Actions we can judge, because they're what we can "see."
    When someone stares at a woman's ass and whistles or says God damn, or creepily follows her while trying to give her his number...those motives aren't clear to you? I agree that not every dude in the recording had the same motive. Some of them probably were just being friendly and saying hi. But I think it's silly to say that I am assuming motives for dudes who are openly talking about her body and making suggestive comments. The motive is clear! And yes, the actions are clear as well. Some of these guys are creeps, and they should learn some manners.
  • thavoice
    Fab4Runner;1669351 wrote:When someone stares at a woman's ass and whistles or says God damn, or creepily follows her while trying to give her his number...those motives aren't clear to you? I agree that not every dude in the recording had the same motive. Some of them probably were just being friendly and saying hi. But I think it's silly to say that I am assuming motives for dudes who are openly talking about her body and making suggestive comments. The motive is clear! And yes, the actions are clear as well. Some of these guys are creeps, and they should learn some manners.
    Maybe they werent looking at the girls butt.......see video....
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VswuVZ_0ZAI
  • thavoice
    and apparently there is a rebuttal by some comedian with a guy walking around for 10hours
  • O-Trap
    Fab4Runner;1669351 wrote:When someone stares at a woman's ass and whistles or says God damn, or creepily follows her while trying to give her his number...those motives aren't clear to you?
    Well, I'd say the actions themselves are all that is necessary for denouncing the behavior.

    Might his motives be to look normal in front of friends despite the fact that he's secretly gay? Sure. The beauty of dealing with the actions themselves is that it still doesn't let that person off the hook. Staring at a woman's ass and cat calling is inappropriate, regardless of the motives. It's not that I can't guess at the motives. It's that I don't think I need to, because the actions themselves are enough to denounce.
    Fab4Runner;1669351 wrote:I agree that not every dude in the recording had the same motive. Some of them probably were just being friendly and saying hi. But I think it's silly to say that I am assuming motives for dudes who are openly talking about her body and making suggestive comments. The motive is clear! And yes, the actions are clear as well. Some of these guys are creeps, and they should learn some manners.
    They certainly should. It seems to show a belief that it's okay to behave that way, and that is certainly not acceptable.

    I'm sorry if I was unclear. I'm not saying that we might not be able to guess someone's motives or beliefs based on their actions. All I'm saying is that the actions ought to be what we condemn.
  • TedSheckler
    thavoice;1669354 wrote:and apparently there is a rebuttal by some comedian with a guy walking around for 10hours
    You're on the ball!
  • ernest_t_bass
    If a woman is wearing tight yoga/spandex pants, and her ass is hanging out for all to see (and it looks good), I'm gawking, and I'm gawking hard.
  • sherm03
    DeyDurkie5;1669060 wrote:Not in the sense that she got harassed but in the sense that this dumb bitch actually took the time to put a camera to herself as she walked the streets
    Glory Days;1669186 wrote:I like how she tried to claim she dressed very plain.........by wearing a skin tight shirt with DDs.
    like_that;1669223 wrote:LOL this video is pathetic. That's just at typical walk in NYC. You are always going to get random people trying to say something to you in NYC. T Outside of the guy creepily walking by her and the dumbass who couldn't get a hint, that girl can go fuck herself. OMG, people think i am attractive!!!!
    This girl had nothing to do with the creation or promotion of the video. She was just an actress hired to do the walking around.
  • Glory Days
    sherm03;1669377 wrote:This girl had nothing to do with the creation or promotion of the video. She was just an actress hired to do the walking around.
    why would they have to hire someone?
  • vball10set
    O-Trap;1669077 wrote:The notion of setting up a non-profit for this is, really, just a way for people to get paid.

    To be fair, some of those reactions were disrespectful, but some were just people being polite.

    "How are you this morning?"

    "Have a nice evening."

    "Hello. Good morning."

    "How are you doing? Good?"

    "God bless you. Have a good day, alright?" (from a guy who then walks alongside her for 5 minutes ... because of course nobody could possibly walk the same route for a five-minute stretch in a big city, right?)


    Don't get me wrong. Talking to someone as though they're a sex object isn't okay. However, this vilifies far more than that. It vilifies pleasantry and simple friendliness by assuming that those things are motivated by sex, and anyone who applies any critical thinking to the video will notice this, I think.

    Potentially a good experiment, but a disingenuous delivery of the results.
    THIS
    Laley23;1669187 wrote:The whole thing is stupid.

    But, I personally thought every one of the comments carried sexual connotation.
    No they don't...since when is greeting someone carry sexual connotations? That's a pretty conceited observation in my opinion.
  • Laley23
    vball10set;1669503 wrote:
    No they don't...since when is greeting someone carry sexual connotations? That's a pretty conceited observation in my opinion.
    Then explain to me why someone is saying have a good night to just 1 woman? Unless of course they are saying it to everyone they pass (100 people a minute in NYC)...

    Stop being naive, it's because they found her to be somewhat attractive.
  • sherm03
    Glory Days;1669497 wrote:why would they have to hire someone?
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/actress-who-highlighted-street-harassment-receives-rape-threats-online-9824803.html
    Shoshana B Roberts volunteered to be filmed secretly by a camera hidden in a backpack in front of her. The man carrying the backpack, Rob Bliss, came up with the idea after noticing the street harassment his girlfriend regularly faced.
  • thavoice
    So his gf wasnt hot enough to be used for this experiment?
  • sherm03
    thavoice;1669535 wrote:So his gf wasnt hot enough to be used for this experiment?
    Or he didn't want her to have to deal with the backlash that this chick is dealing with...
  • thavoice
    sherm03;1669538 wrote:Or he didn't want her to have to deal with the backlash that this chick is dealing with...
    I dont think he and that lady expected this backlash. I think they expected everyone to be as "outraged" as they were!