Archive

Bullying and Social Media

  • JU-ICE
    This was just an update in the Newark Advocate: http://t.co/zSpkqAP8Og

    Basically, a fourth grader has been disciplined for cyber bullying. The article states it did not happen during school, but was a violation of the schools Code of Conduct.
  • hasbeen
    Fly4Fun;1400430 wrote:Are fights now a zero-tolerance situation where they don't account for the circumstances?

    It's been a while since I was in grade school, but in the 90's the staff generally tried to figure out the circumstances and handle punishment appropriately.
    I believe that fighting is a zero tolerance policy in most places.
    Gblock;1400431 wrote:most of the time its student A getting on student B's page and saying im going to kick your A** or You suck d*** or your mom sucks d*** etc..

    as far as the police..they dont really have time for this around here. i doubt you would get very far with that. plus, while they dont mind coming to the school with this issue, most around here probly wouldnt "snitch" to police
    Again, not sure why suspending the kid from school for that is helping. The school shouldn't discipline for that. If there needs to be some intervention, sure, but not discipline. Make the parents do their job.
    JU-ICE;1400442 wrote:This was just an update in the Newark Advocate: http://t.co/zSpkqAP8Og

    Basically, a fourth grader has been suspended for cyber bullying. The article states it did not happen during school, but was a violation of the schools Code of Conduct.
    If a 4th grader wears his pants below his waist outside of school, does he get suspended?
  • Manhattan Buckeye
    The article doesn't say suspended (unless I read it incorrectly). Just disciplined. You know, a talking to, as in stop being stupid.
  • Benny The Jet
    Fly4Fun;1400430 wrote:Are fights now a zero-tolerance situation where they don't account for the circumstances?
    For the most part yes. If you put your hands on another student you will be some sort of consequence. It's believed that there is always an alternative in school instead of fighting. Tell them to stop, if it continues, tell a teacher, if it continues then it's on the teacher once they are made aware. I'm not saying it's right...but it's the way it is.
  • Gblock
    well i guess looking up the suspensions they are labled under bullying and also school disruption. there is no designation for cyberbullying even tho i know that to be the case. i guess they are saying that once it gets talked about, argued about in school, that it becomes a school issue. they dont go looking for it.
  • JU-ICE
    Manhattan Buckeye;1400445 wrote:The article doesn't say suspended (unless I read it incorrectly). Just disciplined. You know, a talking to, as in stop being stupid.
    Fixed
  • redstreak one
    For those of you asking why schools have these policies, ask yourself do you think they want to do this? Do you think boards of education, superintendents, principals and teachers want to have to handle these types of problems? The majority would be no, now there are some out there I am sure that love to get involved in everybody elses lives, but the majority are forced by parents, and the public in taking care of them. What is funny is law enforcement and our courts would laugh most of this stuff out of the courtroom or police station, but heaven forbid the school not look into it and handle it! lol
  • hasbeen
    redstreak one;1400579 wrote:For those of you asking why schools have these policies, ask yourself do you think they want to do this? Do you think boards of education, superintendents, principals and teachers want to have to handle these types of problems? The majority would be no, now there are some out there I am sure that love to get involved in everybody elses lives, but the majority are forced by parents, and the public in taking care of them. What is funny is law enforcement and our courts would laugh most of this stuff out of the courtroom or police station, but heaven forbid the school not look into it and handle it! lol

    Not disagreeing but at some point schools needs to give responsibility back to the fucking parents.
  • gut
    To me there are, or should be, parallels to the workplace. Harass a colleague outside of work and you likely will be fired. Besides maturity, which would dictate more leniency and alternatives, I don't see a significant difference vs. the classroom. It's the same goal - an atmosphere conducive to what you are trying to accomplish (learning in this case), and as such I think a code of conduct should apply outside the school walls.

    Think about how backwards that is - we recognize that mature adults' productivity and livelihood can be threatened by such harassment, but with kids it's just part of growing up, with absolutely no distinction for the degree and type of bullying?

    What I'm saying is being part of the school community imposes certain responsibilities on those kids. And if a parent is unwilling or unable to control their kid, I think the school should have options up to and including expulsion.
  • hasbeen
    gut;1401586 wrote:To me there are, or should be, parallels to the workplace. Harass a colleague outside of work and you likely will be fired. Besides maturity, which would dictate more leniency and alternatives, I don't see a significant difference vs. the classroom. It's the same goal - an atmosphere conducive to what you are trying to accomplish (learning in this case), and as such I think a code of conduct should apply outside the school walls.
    I agree with this, but you can't get fired from school on a first offense(usually). I truly believe suspensions are handed out too often. The kids don't care is they get suspended because their parents let them treat it like a vacation.
  • Manhattan Buckeye
    gut;1401586 wrote:To me there are, or should be, parallels to the workplace. Harass a colleague outside of work and you likely will be fired. Besides maturity, which would dictate more leniency and alternatives, I don't see a significant difference vs. the classroom. It's the same goal - an atmosphere conducive to what you are trying to accomplish (learning in this case), and as such I think a code of conduct should apply outside the school walls.

    Think about how backwards that is - we recognize that mature adults' productivity and livelihood can be threatened by such harassment, but with kids it's just part of growing up, with absolutely no distinction for the degree and type of bullying?

    What I'm saying is being part of the school community imposes certain responsibilities on those kids. And if a parent is unwilling or unable to control their kid, I think the school should have options up to and including expulsion.
    IMO you state the real issue even if you disagree. We can't expect kids to act like adults because they aren't. If an adult is harassing a co-worker or anyone else it is evidence of one being a sociopath (for example University of Chicago law professor Brian Leiter - how he hasn't been fired yet is beyond me) and it isn't acceptable.

    You can't just say "besides maturity" because it is all about maturity. Maturity is why kids can't vote, can't get a credit card, can't do a lot of other things and are treated like kids. I would guess everyone as a child was "teased" or "bullied" at some point. How the child deals with it is part of growing up. I can see how the internet makes such more public, but the issue itself has always existed.
  • gut
    Manhattan Buckeye;1401721 wrote: You can't just say "besides maturity" because it is all about maturity. Maturity is why kids can't vote, can't get a credit card, can't do a lot of other things and are treated like kids. I would guess everyone as a child was "teased" or "bullied" at some point. How the child deals with it is part of growing up. I can see how the internet makes such more public, but the issue itself has always existed.
    Learning maturity is also part of growing up. I'm not sure when kids know better, but I'd suggest it's at a pretty young age. Learning there are consequences to actions is something responsible parents begin instilling at a very young age.
  • hasbeen
    gut;1401772 wrote:Learning maturity is also part of growing up. I'm not sure when kids know better, but I'd suggest it's at a pretty young age. Learning there are consequences to actions is something responsible parents begin instilling at a very young age.
    And if the parents don't do that, the schools have to? I'm not sure I like that.
  • Benny The Jet
    hasbeen;1401779 wrote:And if the parents don't do that, the schools have to? I'm not sure I like that.
    I don't think the schools HAVE to, but they do one way or another. Example, homework not turned in that day = no recess. Not very effective for high schoolers, but works on elementary.
    Another example would be if you keep your notes in order and worksheets in order, you can use them on your test. If you're not responsible enough to be organized, you won't have the benefit of having them to help you.
  • Tiernan
    Take Their Phones Away.

    and I'm talking about 2 wks first offense, one month for second and permanently for third. And No excuses from the whiney parents that their kid needs his phone for emergencies. FK that...most of us grew up w/o cell phones "for emergencies" and some - Fkn - how we survived.
  • Gblock
    the problem for schools is the PR issue. if the student kills themselves/runs away or does anything crazy, the first thing the parent does is go on news/newspaper and tell how many times they told the school the child was being bullied and the school did nothing.
  • hasbeen
    Benny The Jet;1401824 wrote:I don't think the schools HAVE to, but they do one way or another. Example, homework not turned in that day = no recess. Not very effective for high schoolers, but works on elementary.
    Another example would be if you keep your notes in order and worksheets in order, you can use them on your test. If you're not responsible enough to be organized, you won't have the benefit of having them to help you.
    We're talking about things that happen outside of school.
  • redstreak one
    hasbeen;1400665 wrote:Not disagreeing but at some point schools needs to give responsibility back to the ****ing parents.
    How? In loco parentis, in place of the parent has been taken to the extreme by society!
  • Gblock
    http://news.yahoo.com/middle-schooler-says-administrator-bullied-her-opening-her-124813672.html

    this is a lil extreme but along the lines of what things i have seen in schools.
  • gut
    hasbeen;1401779 wrote:And if the parents don't do that, the schools have to? I'm not sure I like that.
    As it relates to behavior that adversely affects the school's community, yes. If you want to be part of that community, then you have to live up to and adhere to certain standards and code of conduct. The parents can choose to intervene to change behavior, or they can find a new school for their kid. Not sure how that's the school taking away responsibility from the parents.
  • FatHobbit
    Gblock;1403838 wrote:http://news.yahoo.com/middle-schooler-says-administrator-bullied-her-opening-her-124813672.html

    this is a lil extreme but along the lines of what things i have seen in schools.
    from the article
    Off camera, one of them reportedly told the station that school officials possess far-reaching authority to investigate issues related to student safety — authority that could even exceed the power that mere police have to investigate mere crimes.
    nice
  • hasbeen
    gut;1403841 wrote:As it relates to behavior that adversely affects the school's community, yes. If you want to be part of that community, then you have to live up to and adhere to certain standards and code of conduct. The parents can choose to intervene to change behavior, or they can find a new school for their kid. Not sure how that's the school taking away responsibility from the parents.
    I'll bring up the dumb baseball example again: If Johnny and Joey get into a fight on the baseball field(not a school sponsored event) and then there is tension in class, but nothing that breaks school rules happens. Should Johnny and Joey be suspended?

    What I'm arguing is that it shouldn't be the schools responsibility to discipline students for things that happen outside of school events.
  • Gblock
    hasbeen;1403850 wrote:I'll bring up the dumb baseball example again: If Johnny and Joey get into a fight on the baseball field(not a school sponsored event) and then there is tension in class, but nothing that breaks school rules happens. Should Johnny and Joey be suspended?

    What I'm arguing is that it shouldn't be the schools responsibility to discipline students for things that happen outside of school events.
    if there is tension in the class then yes you are disrupting the educational environment and upon investigation could or could not lead to a suspension. most likely not in the situation described, most likely a warning. however if during that investigation..threats or other hateful comments were made on fb, then yes you could see a suspension..but again this is a case by case situation imo
  • gut
    hasbeen;1403850 wrote: What I'm arguing is that it shouldn't be the schools responsibility to discipline students for things that happen outside of school events.
    And I'll use the workplace example again. Sexually harass a women outside of work and you will likely be fired. Courts have repeatedly decided that, yes, the company has a responsibility to act. It's the same thing about fostering an productive environment. Same thing if two workers got in a fight at a bar. The employer has no responsibility to police such behavior, but they are entirely within their bounds to not tolerate such behavior brought to their attention (and in some cases they MUST address it once they have knowledge).

    If that fight you mention was posted on youtube, providing factual evidence, would schools be out-of-bounds to issue a suspension and has that sort of thing never happened?

    So now let's talk about proof of mental bullying...Is it more effective and efficient for police to be involved in that (as they could be with fighting and other things)? Or is it much more simple and straightforward for the school to enforce a code of conduct? As I said, it's hardly an earth-shattering or unprecedented concept.
  • gut
    I'd make a distinction from a school having to be ACTIVELY responsible for enforcing a code of conduct outside its walls vs. being presented with evidence of such.

    I believe the school is within its bounds to apply a code of conduct to violations regardless of where those violations occur. The code of conduct stands on its own - it doesn't make sense that the location of a violation would affect whether or not you are removed. While the school is clearly responsible to enforce that within its walls, not being responsible/liable outside its walls does not mean it has no authority to act.