NCAA cites Boise State with lack of institutional control

• enigmaax

  Side note, wonder if this was directed at anyone in particular:
  

  
  When the university learned about the major violation in the women's tennis program, the school immediately fired the head coach and assistant coach.
  
  "I'm hopeful the infractions committee will understand. It's not as though we tolerated an individual who would commit a major violation," school president Bob Kustra told The Idaho Statesman.

• Pick6

  

  dwccrew;759420 wrote:Sigh* Do you really not know how a non-profit works? There is no profit left over after all expenses, operating costs, employee wages, etc. are paid out. Any profit left over would be given back to member schools, thus the organization is non-profit.

  
  yes I know how a non-profit works. what I am taking from Fly4fun is that the people who work for the NCAA arent making loads of money, and by making, im talking about their wages. Thus they are making their loads of money off of student athletes...but like I said, from what I'm understanding from him, he is trying to dispute that.
  
  I could not be understanding though, but I dont see where else he is going with it.
• Gardens35

  Self Imposed Sanctions...http://www.ktvb.com/news/Boise-State-sanctions-five-of-its-sports-programs-121261619.html
• HitsRus

  

  Haha,,,,not for profit. the top 14 executuives of the NCAA made over $6 million last year....the President nearly $ 1million himself.
  In fact, most NCAA execs make over $200K.
  http://chronicle.com/article/Pay-for-Top-14-NCAA-Executives/124358/
  
  Yeah, I guess they didn't have to pay any shareholders, so they gave it to themselves. All the while, justifying their existence by continuing to enforce picayune rules and levying over the top suspensions and sanctions. Everyone is familiar with the Ohio State situation, and all one has to do is to look at the sequalae of a couple of 19 year olds selling stuff that they thought was theirs.....none of which gave Ohio State an on field competitive advantage over any team that they beat last year. The system is obviously broken when such a minor violation can bring such a cascade of events. Really, FIVE games? Tell me how that's not abuse of the student athletes whose talent pays those lavish salaries.
  Somebody asked what my suggestion is? Pretty simple...that is... keep it simple.
  Get rid of 400 pages of rules and keep it so that a 19 year old can understand it. Levy appropriate suspensions. No one gets 6 months in jail for a first offense minor traffic violation. Athletes shouldn't lose half a season for piddly ass stuff either.
  I understand the need for the NCAA in concept, and the need to protect amateurism in athletics. But no one is served by the big business, heavy handed, tactics that is currently being administered.
• SportsAndLady

  

  HitsRus;759887 wrote:Haha,,,,not for profit. the top 14 executuives of the NCAA made over $6 million last year....the President nearly $ 1million himself.
  In fact, most NCAA execs make over $200K.
  http://chronicle.com/article/Pay-for-Top-14-NCAA-Executives/124358/
  
  Yeah, I guess they didn't have to pay any shareholders, so they gave it to themselves. All the while, justifying their existence by continuing to enforce picayune rules and levying over the top suspensions and sanctions. Everyone is familiar with the Ohio State situation, and all one has to do is to look at the sequalae of a couple of 19 year olds selling stuff that they thought was theirs.....none of which gave Ohio State an on field competitive advantage over any team that they beat last year. The system is obviously broken when such a minor violation can bring such a cascade of events. Really, FIVE games? Tell me how that's not abuse of the student athletes whose talent pays those lavish salaries.

  
  Seriously?
  
  Non-profit..non-profit
  
  They're non-profit
  
  
  
  Non-profit
• Pick6

  

  HitsRus;759887 wrote:Haha,,,,not for profit. the top 14 executuives of the NCAA made over $6 million last year....the President nearly $ 1million himself.
  In fact, most NCAA execs make over $200K.
  http://chronicle.com/article/Pay-for-Top-14-NCAA-Executives/124358/
  QUOTE]
  
  Thank you, call them whatever you want, they are still hoarding away millions of dollars earned by student athletes.

• karen lotz

  

  HitsRus;759887 wrote:Haha,,,,not for profit. the top 14 executuives of the NCAA made over $6 million last year....the President nearly $ 1million himself.
  In fact, most NCAA execs make over $200K.
  http://chronicle.com/article/Pay-for-Top-14-NCAA-Executives/124358/
  
  Yeah, I guess they didn't have to pay any shareholders, so they gave it to themselves. All the while, justifying their existence by continuing to enforce picayune rules and levying over the top suspensions and sanctions. Everyone is familiar with the Ohio State situation, and all one has to do is to look at the sequalae of a couple of 19 year olds selling stuff that they thought was theirs.....none of which gave Ohio State an on field competitive advantage over any team that they beat last year. The system is obviously broken when such a minor violation can bring such a cascade of events. Really, FIVE games? Tell me how that's not abuse of the student athletes whose talent pays those lavish salaries.
  Somebody asked what my suggestion is? Pretty simple...that is... keep it simple.
  Get rid of 400 pages of rules and keep it so that a 19 year old can understand it. Levy appropriate suspensions. No one gets 6 months in jail for a first offense minor traffic violation. Athletes shouldn't lose half a season for piddly ass stuff either.
  I understand the need for the NCAA in concept, and the need to protect amateurism in athletics. But no one is served by the big business, heavy handed, tactics that is currently being administered.

  Where was the outcry when USC was sanctioned? Did buying Reggie Bush's parents a house help with on field performance? Most fans called for the death penalty there. Funny how now the rules should be changed so athletes can understand them. They are told repeatedly they can't sell stuff that is given too them. Stop making excuses for the athletes because its OSU.
• Pick6

  

  karen lotz;759953 wrote:Where was the outcry when USC was sanctioned? Did buying Reggie Bush's parents a house help with on field performance? Most fans called for the death penalty there. Funny how now the rules should be changed so athletes can understand them. They are told repeatedly they can't sell stuff that is given too them. Stop making excuses for the athletes because its OSU.

  
  last time I checked a house in LA is worth a LITTLE more than selling some gifts.
• karen lotz

  

  Pick6;759958 wrote:last time I checked a house in LA is worth a LITTLE more than selling some gifts.

  
  Why does that matter? Does it help with on field performance? That was HitsRus' point.
• sleeper

  

  karen lotz;759969 wrote:Why does that matter? Does it help with on field performance? That was HitsRus' point.

  
  It gives USC an unfair recruiting advantage by giving them an extra incentive to play there. At least these athletes sold their own stuff, it wasn't like OSU was involved in the unfair advantage.
  
  And seriously, you throw a lot of stones for a school that has had a kid negligent killed with no repercussions, let's keep things in prospective here.
• stlouiedipalma

  The way I see it, ANY violation of NCAA rules could be seen as creating an on-field performance advantage. If I sold memorabilia to get some money, I don't have to worry about having enough cash in my pocket to do what I want. If the school paid for a car, or paid for my folks to live the high life, I have one less thing to worry about, one less distraction. Even if they illegally bought me lunch, it's one less thing on my mind and I can then devote my full attention to my job, playing for the university. It may not be a tangible benefit, but if I am comfortable and distraction-free I can be a better player.
• karen lotz

  

  sleeper;759979 wrote:It gives USC an unfair recruiting advantage by giving them an extra incentive to play there. At least these athletes sold their own stuff, it wasn't like OSU was involved in the unfair advantage.
  
  And seriously, you throw a lot of stones for a school that has had a kid negligent killed with no repercussions, let's keep things in prospective here.

  
  
  So its an unfair recruiting advantage that "dudes be getting hookups on tats since 03" or whatever Pittman tweeted. Can you be sure that players weren't selling stuff to Rife as far back as that? Its not throwing stones. Try to stay on topic here.
• enigmaax

  sleeper;759979 wrote:It gives USC an unfair recruiting advantage by giving them an extra incentive to play there. At least these athletes sold their own stuff, it wasn't like OSU was involved in the unfair advantage.

  
  What was the Bush family benefactor's association with USC? And who gave the OSU guys the stuff they sold?
• sleeper

  

  karen lotz;759986 wrote:So its an unfair recruiting advantage that "dudes be getting hookups on tats since 03" or whatever Pittman tweeted. Can you be sure that players weren't selling stuff to Rife as far back as that? Its not throwing stones. Try to stay on topic here.

  "Come to Notre Dame, where you can negligently kill someone and our president will take responsibility and pay a measly fine." What a joke.
  

  enigmaax;759987 wrote:What was the Bush family benefactor's association with USC? And who gave the OSU guys the stuff they sold?

  Bush wouldn't have went to USC if his parents weren't giving a LA apt. The players earned their stuff at OSU from winning games.
• karen lotz

  

  sleeper;759989 wrote:"Come to Notre Dame, where you can negligently kill someone and our president will take responsibility and pay a measly fine." What a joke.
  
  
  
  Bush wouldn't have went to USC if his parents weren't giving a LA apt. The players earned their stuff at OSU from winning games.

  Not surprised you failed to address my post. You spend a lot of time talking about something as irrelevant as Notre Dame football. Why is that?
• sleeper

  

  karen lotz;759992 wrote:Not surprised you failed to address my post. You spend a lot of time talking about something as irrelevant as Notre Dame football. Why is that?

  
  Not this again.....
  
  ND is irrelevant because they never win any game that anyone outside of South Bend cares about while pretending they are "back" every season, only to lose to teams that are garbage and try to rationalize an otherwise mediocre at best program. Talking about ND does not make them relevant. If that was the case, ND would be national champions every year.
• enigmaax

  sleeper;759989 wrote: Bush wouldn't have went to USC if his parents weren't giving a LA apt.

  Well, no. The guys providing the cash had nothing to do with USC. He was already in LA, hence the home that was purchased for them in LA. One guy, isolated case.
  

  sleeper;759989 wrote: The players earned their stuff at OSU from winning games.

  
  Right. How many other schools give trinkets out for winning regular season games that are then sold for a thousand dollars?
  
  So, a guy with no ties to the school paying one player versus a guy buying school-issued goods for nearly a decade from multiple players. Which recruits are more likely to hear about the perks of being at that school?
• karen lotz

  

  sleeper;760017 wrote:Not this again.....
  
  ND is irrelevant because they never win any game that anyone outside of South Bend cares about while pretending they are "back" every season, only to lose to teams that are garbage and try to rationalize an otherwise mediocre at best program. Talking about ND does not make them relevant. If that was the case, ND would be national champions every year.

  
  
  I'm not saying the talk makes them relevant. I'm asking why you feel its so necessary to constantly talk about them. You post more shit about Notre Dame in threads you are allowed to post in than you talk about Ohio State. Just strikes me as kind of odd.
• HitsRus

  

  http://www.ktvb.com/sports/Petersen-responds-to-NCAA-allegations--121188199.html
  
  Read this.
  Look how stupid this is.
  The "total reimbursement" is $5000....and for that coaches are losing jobs, and sanctions against BSU programs are levied....an investigation that will take months. Really?
  
  Some would like to make this about OSU. Read this and weep. It is one thing to smack a school for violations that quadruple a scholarships value. It's quite another to go apeshit about a $5 sandwich or about prospective athletes sleeping on a couch in a player's room, or some extra spending money for a quarter. There is no sense of balance or justice. If you are going to have 400 pages of piss ass rules, then keep the punishments in proportion to the crimes.
  
  

  Why does that matter? Does it help with on field performance? That was HitsRus' point.

  don't cherry pick lotz...that was only part of my point.
  
  
  
  Some of you guys are like the 'pencil necked, paper pusher' in Ghostbusters....SMH
• karen lotz

  

  HitsRus;760034 wrote:http://www.ktvb.com/sports/Petersen-responds-to-NCAA-allegations--121188199.html
  
  Read this.
  Look how stupid this is.
  The "total reimbursement" is $5000....and for that coaches are losing jobs, and sanctions against BSU programs are levied....an investigation that will take months. Really?
  
  Some would like to make this about OSU. Read this and weep. It is one thing to smack a school for violations that quadruple a scholarships value. It's quite another to go apeshit about a $5 sandwich or about prospective athletes sleeping on a couch in a player's room, or some extra spending money for a quarter. There is no sense of balance or justice. If you are going to have 400 pages of piss ass rules, then keep the punishments in proportion to the crimes.
  
  
  
  
  don't cherry pick lotz...that was only part of my point.

  
  Ok you rambled on about how 5 games is too many.
  
  What happened with the tennis team? Honestly I don't know... Boise State was hit with lack of institutional control right? Those penalties are going to be more severe because it isn't an isolated event. It isn't as if the only issue was a $5 sandwich or sleeping on the couch. Don't cherry pick.
• enigmaax

  HitsRus;760034 wrote:http://www.ktvb.com/sports/Petersen-responds-to-NCAA-allegations--121188199.html
  
  Read this.
  Look how stupid this is.
  The "total reimbursement" is $5000....and for that coaches are losing jobs, and sanctions against BSU programs are levied....an investigation that will take months. Really?
  
  Some would like to make this about OSU. Read this and weep. It is one thing to smack a school for violations that quadruple a scholarships value. It's quite another to go apeshit about a $5 sandwich or about prospective athletes sleeping on a couch in a player's room, or some extra spending money for a quarter. There is no sense of balance or justice. If you are going to have 400 pages of piss ass rules, then keep the punishments in proportion to the crimes.

  
  From the NCAA's standpoint, how do you know the extent until you investigate? I understand your point about the punishment and may or may not agree, just because you can't really afford to open the door if you're the NCAA. Going light because "it was only X amount" could plant the seed that it is okay to give a little here and there - the risk is worth the reward. And you are right back into that cycle of how much is enough to get the recruit but not too much in case the NCAA finds out.
  
  It is a tough spot because you pretty much have to hammer everyone if you're serious about the rule, but then, when half of your members at any given time are serving some sort of probation for breaking the same rule ... there just isn't a real simple answer.
  
  The NCAA can't really just turn its head because that jeopardizes the amateur and tax-exempt statuses and (as mentioned in other topics) changing the financials has a much larger impact than what anyone really wants to take on (even if some fans don't realize the correlation).
  
  I still think the rules are well intended, there are just too many variables to appropriately handle them.
• dwccrew

  

  Pick6;759435 wrote:yes I know how a non-profit works. what I am taking from Fly4fun is that the people who work for the NCAA arent making loads of money, and by making, im talking about their wages. Thus they are making their loads of money off of student athletes...but like I said, from what I'm understanding from him, he is trying to dispute that.
  
  I could not be understanding though, but I dont see where else he is going with it.

  Now I understand what you may be implying. It could have got lost in translation. Yes, I agree the executives are making a boat load of money.
• Manhattan Buckeye

  stlouiedipalma;759982 wrote:The way I see it, ANY violation of NCAA rules could be seen as creating an on-field performance advantage. If I sold memorabilia to get some money, I don't have to worry about having enough cash in my pocket to do what I want. If the school paid for a car, or paid for my folks to live the high life, I have one less thing to worry about, one less distraction. Even if they illegally bought me lunch, it's one less thing on my mind and I can then devote my full attention to my job, playing for the university. It may not be a tangible benefit, but if I am comfortable and distraction-free I can be a better player.

  
  Agree 100%, and I'm getting sick of explaining what "improper benefits" means - it doesn't just mean taking cash from boosters. I really wonder what some OSU fans would say to justify Rhett Bomar's actions if he was an OSU rather than Oklahoma player. I can hear it now, "I don't get why he was kicked off the team, it isn't fair! Maybe he was just calling in sick for the 35 hours a week he wasn't working."
• HitsRus

  

  I'm not entirely familar with that case MB, but again you are making this an OSU issue, when it's really an issue about what you can expect when you have a 400 page book of rules, 19 year old kids, and big money at stake. You are going to get violations. What's important is that it be punished appropriately.
• Manhattan Buckeye

  HitsRus;760178 wrote:I'm not entirely familar with that case MB, but again you are making this an OSU issue, when it's really an issue about what you can expect when you have a 400 page book of rules, 19 year old kids, and big money at stake. You are going to get violations. What's important is that it be punished appropriately.

  
  A very fair point, I can certainly understand arguments that some violations are punished worse than others, and that it shouldn't be the case. I'm no fan of the NCAA.
  
  The OSU thing really sticks to me, this was a clear violation that the compliance department should have caught or taught (the rhyme not intended). IMO OSU had a major screw-up, I didn't play I-A sports but I worked in the department and they made sure any outside employment, contact with boosters, etc. was on the up and up. These things matter.