Archive

A Playoff is the best, most exciting way to crown a champion

  • Mooney44Cards
    Saints (11-5) AT Seahawks (7-9)

    Lets not forget that this is the system that 95% of you are pointing to as the example of what college football should be.

    Good call guys, lets get this awesome playoff started.
  • SportsAndLady
    Lol yes

    Thread win
  • rydawg5
    that settles it. let old dudes and some macbooks decide who is best instead
  • hoops23
    Mooney44Cards;622717 wrote:Saints (11-5) AT Seahawks (7-9)

    Lets not forget that this is the system that 95% of you are pointing to as the example of what college football should be.

    Good call guys, lets get this awesome playoff started.
    The NFL is decided by division winners, it's not the NFL or the playoff systems fault that this is the FIRST TIME in NFL history that a team under .500 wins the division.

    At the end of the day however, the champion will be DECIDED ON THE FIELD. Not by computer points or human voters.
  • dazedconfused
    Mooney44Cards;622717 wrote:Saints (11-5) AT Seahawks (7-9)

    Lets not forget that this is the system that 95% of you are pointing to as the example of what college football should be.

    Good call guys, lets get this awesome playoff started.

    let's apply the current system to baseball as i imagine you're a reds fan with that avatar. "great seasons cincinnati and atlanta but unfortunately our computers have determined that the giants and phillies are the best teams in the nl and they'll play for the chance for the world series. but don't worry, you guys can play for the kellogs golden flake trophy in the autumn spectacular in kansas city, mo. does it mean anything? well, not really seeing as how philadelphia and san francisco have already been pre-determined to be in the championship but look at all the extra practice you'll get for next season. enjoy"

    seem fair?
  • lhslep134
    dazedconfused;622733 wrote:yea, and an unranked team just played in a bcs bowl game. what's your point?

    And an "unranked" team is hosting a playoff game. What's your point?
  • believer
    So we're now comparing the playoff system for the 32 team professional National Football League against 120 semi-professional FBS colleges as proof that a playoff system at the 1-A collegiate level would experience similar scenarios as the Seahawks vs. Saints?

    First, apples to oranges. Second, total bullshit.

    Collegiate football implements successful playoff systems at every level except FBS (1-A).

    It's not because a playoff system isn't viable at the FBS level. It's because the NCAA, the BCS bowls, ESPN, and the presidents of the BCS "worthy" conferences love the MONEY the "system" brings. It's not about crowning the best FBS football team of the season. It's about lining pockets.

    Mid-major conferences containing schools with successful programs like Boise State and TCU will NEVER see a BCS NC under the current system. A playoff system at the FBS level is the only way a true national champion can be determined. A playoff system will also make it possible for teams that lose late in the season to still make a run at the NC.

    TCU's appearance in the Rose Bowl was a token gesture by the BCS "system" to pay homage to the "little guys" and "prove" how the BCS system "works." The trouble is the "little guy" beat the team from the BCS-worthy conference (thanks once again to the Big 10) which only served to expose the flaw in the "system."

    In addition, teams like TCU will continue to seek membership in alleged BCS-worthy conferences like the Big Least to give them a fair shot at making the NC title game thereby decimating the "mid-major" conference line-up's in the process.

    Hypothetically let's say a true playoff system were implemented with the conference champion of each FBS conference getting an automatic bid. Let's say the MAC champion makes an unlikely run deep into playoff's...maybe even makes it to the NC. Wouldn't that have positive consequences for that MAC team and the conference in general in terms of exposure and recruitment? Wouldn't that make the competition from the MAC perhaps a little better so we won't have to listen to arrogant fans from alleged BCS-worthy conferences like the Big 10 laugh, scoff, and bitch about playing inferior in-state MAC cupcakes?

    Meantime, I suppose we'll just have to deal with those pesky Boise State's and TCU's from non-BCS worthy conferences every season and ask, "What if?"
  • enigmaax
    believer;622740 wrote:So we're now comparing the playoff system for the 32 team professional National Football League against 120 semi-professional FBS colleges as proof that a playoff system at the 1-A collegiate level would experience similar scenarios as the Seahawks vs. Saints?

    First, apples to oranges. Second, total bullshit.

    Collegiate football implements successful playoff systems at every level except FBS (1-A).

    It's not because a playoff system isn't viable at the FBS level. It's because the NCAA, the BCS bowls, and the presidents of the BCS "worthy" conferences love the MONEY the "system" brings.

    Mid-major conferences containing schools with successful programs like Boise State and TCU will NEVER see a BCS NC under the current system. A playoff system at the FBS level is the only way a true national champion can be determined.

    TCU's appearance in the Rose Bowl was a token gesture by the BCS "system" to pay homage to the "little guys" and prove how the BCS system "works." The trouble is the "little guy" beat the team from the BCS-worthy conference which only served to expose the flaw in the "system."

    In addition, teams like TCU then seek membership in alleged BCS-worthy conferences like the Big Least to give them a fair shot and making the NC title game thereby decimating the "mid-major" conference line-up's.

    I suppose we'll just have to deal with those pesky Boise State's and TCU's from non-BCS worthy conferences every season and ask, "What if?"

    The only problem with this is that you assume those TCUs and Boise States would make a playoff. IF a playoff is ever implemented, it isn't going to exclude any of the big six conferences, it isn't going to use the BCS forumula (because the "BCS" as it were, would be dead), and those teams are simply going to be left out in the cold with still no title shot and the addtional lack of money that comes with a BCS bowl.

    Careful what you wish you for.
  • enigmaax
    hoops23;622731 wrote:The NFL is decided by division winners, it's not the NFL or the playoff systems fault that this is the FIRST TIME in NFL history that a team under .500 wins the division.

    At the end of the day however, the champion will be DECIDED ON THE FIELD. Not by computer points or human voters.

    It is the systems fault in that four team divisions is a ridiculous way to divvy up and award automatic berths. But, that doesn't mean the NCAA would have to follow that model. Problem is, as I mentioned in the above post, even if there were an 8 team playoff in college football, the same six big conferences would get autobids to it. So, it wouldn't solve the biggest problem people seem to have with the BCS - leaving the little guy out.
  • believer
    enigmaax;622741 wrote:The only problem with this is that you assume those TCUs and Boise States would make a playoff. IF a playoff is ever implemented, it isn't going to exclude any of the big six conferences, it isn't going to use the BCS forumula (because the "BCS" as it were, would be dead), and those teams are simply going to be left out in the cold with still no title shot and the addtional lack of money that comes with a BCS bowl.

    Careful what you wish you for.
    You assume that there would only be a playoff system for the BCS conferences? I'm suggesting eliminating the BCS altogether and implementing a 20 team playoff similar to the FCS 1-AA method with the conference champion of each FBS conference getting a bid and supplemented by at-large teams.

    The BCS bowls would not be left out in the cold because they would continue to rotate the NC and serve as final round playoff sites. I'm telling you it can be done and they can still make money at it.

    I would also suggest the Cotton Bowl, Capital One Bowl, Outback Bowl, Alamo Bowl and Sun Bowl be put in the playoff mix.

    The other 3,000 minor bowls can still field consolation bowls in the month of December while the playoff bowls are being played out.
  • enigmaax
    believer;622747 wrote:You assume that there would only be a playoff system for the BCS conferences? I'm suggesting eliminating the BCS altogether and implementing a 20 team playoff similar to the FCS 1-AA method with the conference champion of each FBS conference getting a bid and supplemented by at-large teams.

    The BCS bowls would not be left out in the cold because they would continue to rotate the NC and serve as final round playoff sites. I'm telling you it can be done and they can still make money at it.

    I would also suggest the Cotton Bowl, Capital One Bowl, Outback Bowl, Alamo Bowl and Sun Bowl be put in the playoff mix.

    The other 3,000 minor bowls can still field consolation bowls in the month of December while the playoff bowls are being played out.

    Yeah, that is fun to talk about. It will never happen that way. The only way a playoff is going to happen is if the big boys would continue to make as much money and that would require their inclusion - and it would absolutely NOT involve awarding an automatic bid to a Sun Belt champion. I still think a playoff is a pipe dream, but even if it does eventually happen, it isn't going to be about making it "fair" for some little guy school.

    On a side note, all the harping and complaining by the government did more to set a playoff back than anything. For starters, the squeaky wheels found a way to get oiled (save Boise State, and nobody gives a shit about them). Now any school that wants to earn the same respect as TCU and Utah (even BYU, to an extent) is going to have to dominate for a decade - basically, the little guys are now starting from scratch again. Secondly, any thought of a playoff would now pretty much preclude this autobid for the big conferences as I mentioned because it would just cause more uproar. When you add those two things together, Big Six will not give up its status plus the biggest of the little boys are now parts of the Big Six, playoffs are going to lose steam even in the eyes of fans.
  • queencitybuckeye
    Mooney44Cards;622717 wrote:Saints (11-5) AT Seahawks (7-9)

    Lets not forget that this is the system that 95% of you are pointing to as the example of what college football should be.

    Good call guys, lets get this awesome playoff started.

    Great logic, particularly as there were no mismatches in the bowl games.
  • sherm03
    queencitybuckeye;622760 wrote:Great logic, particularly as there were no mismatches in the bowl games.

    Has nothing to do with mismatches. People screaming for a playoff have the battle cry of "settling it on the field."

    Mooney just pointed out that even in a playoff scenario, crappy teams make it in ahead of better teams. So the idea of getting the best teams and settling it on the field doesn't hold water because the best teams don't always make it into the playoffs because conferences/divisions/leagues don't have an equal distribution of talent.
  • queencitybuckeye
    sherm03;622799 wrote:Mooney just pointed out that even in a playoff scenario, crappy teams make it in ahead of better teams. So the idea of getting the best teams and settling it on the field doesn't hold water because the best teams don't always make it into the playoffs because conferences/divisions/leagues don't have an equal distribution of talent.

    Weak argument IMO. What's important is not that a weak team or two sneaks into the playoffs, it's that no deserving team is left out, which is absolutely not the same thing.
  • Con_Alma
    " A Playoff is the best, most exciting way to crown a champion"

    An important point overlooked by many is that crowning a clear National Champion is not the goal of those key stake-holders who run the BCS right now.
  • sherm03
    queencitybuckeye;622803 wrote:Weak argument IMO. What's important is not that a weak team or two sneaks into the playoffs, it's that no deserving team is left out, which is absolutely not the same thing.

    The point is that deserving teams are left out because those one or two weak teams sneak in.
  • enigmaax
    Con_Alma;622813 wrote:" A Playoff is the best, most exciting way to crown a champion"

    An important point overlooked by many is that crowning a clear National Champion is not the goal of those key stake-holders who run the BCS right now.

    Exactly. Fans want a champion and a tournament because fans are conditioned to expect that. The BCS is basically a bone being thrown by adding a "championship" game. The NCAA has never recognized a Division IA/FBS champion and doesn't need to. College football can already call itself the best, most exciting sport on a week-to-week basis and that is with an entire history of mere paper champions. A playoff isn't going to enhance that in any meaningful or necessary way.
  • Con_Alma
    Very, well stated enigmax.
  • queencitybuckeye
    sherm03;622820 wrote:The point is that deserving teams are left out because those one or two weak teams sneak in.

    Disagree with your definition. New York, for example, isn't out because Seattle is in, they're out because they self-destructed. Are they better than Seattle? Yes. Are they "deserving"? In absolutely no way. Every team deserving of a chance to win the championship is in the playoffs. That one or two others are also in doesn't change that.
  • Tiernan
    Go Seahawks!

    Underdog victories are the essence of Sports. A D1 CFB Play-off would be the most widely watched sporting event in history (and yes that includes that Euro-trash, Latin-loony thing called the World Cup).
  • darbypitcher22
    Eastern Washington or Delaware will be this year's National Champion
  • Mulva
    This is like starting a sarcastic "The bowl system is the best, most exciting way to crown a champion" thread and then posting the Little Caesars Bowl match up as the example why.
  • queencitybuckeye
    Mulva;623083 wrote:This is like starting a sarcastic "The bowl system is the best, most exciting way to crown a champion" thread and then posting the Little Caesars Bowl match up as the example why.

    Agreed. Looking at the ends of the bell curve is kind of a weak way to make one's argument. It ignores the built-in rebuttal that of the other 10 games that will be played, almost all of them will be competitive, and most likely a couple of them will be absolutely great. Everyone should miss out on these great games because of one that appears to be a mismatch.
  • trep14
    Mulva;623083 wrote:This is like starting a sarcastic "The bowl system is the best, most exciting way to crown a champion" thread and then posting the Little Caesars Bowl match up as the example why.

    Hahaha so true. We can't have a playoff because we have to protect the Little Caesars Bowl though.
  • Sykotyk
    It's a matter of qualification. Seattle qualified under a fair and consistent system that didn't rely on style points, voters, or the whim of a Harris pollster in BFE. Everyone knows going into an NFL season what you MUST do to make the playoffs. Win your division and you're in. Simple as that. If you fail to win your division, there's two consolation prizes that is based on overall record over the entire conference. Fail to be one of the two best non-division winners, and you sit at home.

    No mystery there. Nothing 'unfair' about it. What would be unfair is if you got what you wanted and the NFL announced the Giants would take the Seahawks spot in the playoffs because it would bring the NY market and they'd sell more tickets and have more people watching.

    That is unfair.

    Sykotyk