BCS Buster: Boise State vs. Virginia Tech

• enigmaax

  Jordo:
  
  1. I don't buy any of that as any excuse nor do I have sympathy. There's a reason they are seen as "little guys". There's a big difference and those schools should really be glad that they've gotten some of the catering that they have received. But, give an inch and someone asks for a mile.
  
  2. Again, if you find a million reasons not to do something, you are not entitled to the prizes for actually doing it.
  
  3. The point is that the reason these teams are so successful is exactly the issue up for debate. They play at a lesser level. The argument for Boise is ALWAYS what they've done over the past five years. You can make a case within a single season for them. It is ALWAYS "they have proven they can beat the big boys..........over five seasons, once a year." You would not make that case for any other team and they are not an exception. And as soon as you go trying to use that as support, you have to consider what they did before that. It will lead you right back to the main point - they look really good at a lower level. Don't lump a bunch of seasons or a handful of games together and say that proves something if you are going to ignore the whole history and where that history has lead them.
  
  trep - Really I find your argument incredibly silly. If you can't tell the difference between any BCS school's schedule and the following: Nevada, Idaho, Louisiana Tech, New Mexico State, Hawaii, Fresno State, Utah State, and San Jose State then you are probably never going to get it. It isn't just that Baylor is slightly better than NM State or TT would finish 3rd in the WAC (they'd be 1st or 2nd anyway)....it is that ten of the teams on Texas' schedule would compete for a WAC title. And every single one of those WAC teams would be fighting it out in the basement of any BCS conference. Look at the records and scores of those teams. Even bad BCS schools hammer good WAC schools regularly. There just is no comparison at all.
  
  I never said all top BCS teams play a schedule full of top competition. But here's the thing and be honest...if you switch Texas and Boise State's schedule, would you expect Texas to go undefeated? Would you expect Boise State to go undefeated? No one would hesitate on Texas. You'd really have to evaluate Boise against some of those schools - just like you would with Texas. Thing is, Texas actually plays that schedule that you have to stop and think about and Boise doesn't. That doesn't entitle Boise to anything.
• trep14

  enigmaax;473452 wrote:
  trep - Really I find your argument incredibly silly. If you can't tell the difference between any BCS school's schedule and the following: Nevada, Idaho, Louisiana Tech, New Mexico State, Hawaii, Fresno State, Utah State, and San Jose State then you are probably never going to get it. It isn't just that Baylor is slightly better than NM State or TT would finish 3rd in the WAC (they'd be 1st or 2nd anyway)....it is that ten of the teams on Texas' schedule would compete for a WAC title. And every single one of those WAC teams would be fighting it out in the basement of any BCS conference. Look at the records and scores of those teams. Even bad BCS schools hammer good WAC schools regularly. There just is no comparison at all.

  I didn't deny that BCS schools routinely beat up on some of the WAC teams not named Boise State and Fresno State. And I do see your point, that playing a slate of BCS conference teams is tougher than what Boise State goes through and you are more likely to trip up. But that argument essentially boils down to "which bad team is better - Baylor or San Jose State? Well Baylor is better so Boise State shouldn't have an opportunity at the national championship!". So yeah, you see BCS schools beat up on WAC teams. What you don't really see are schools like Texas Tech or Baylor beating the upper-tier teams that Boise State has. Texas Tech's only win of note over the past few years was that game that they eeked out against Texas in 2008. And I would put Tx Tech 3rd in the WAC, behind Boise and Fresno State. Spin it however you want, but you can't deny the success Boise State has had over good competition, conference be damned. I don't get that everyone can write these wins off as flukes, too. Its not like Boise is sneaking up on anyone since the Oklahoma game. Teams are ready for them and they still keep winning. Like Jordo said, this team has talent. I think they'd have as good of a chance as anyone running the table, BCS conference or not.
• ytownfootball

  

  But those "bad" teams in bigger conferences also play a tougher schedule, and take their licks/injuries. You seem to give no credence whatsoever to those teams who actually have to have some depth to compete at the same level that Boise does without it.
• enigmaax

  Well trep, Texas Tech beat six BCS schools last year. Boise State has beaten six in its history.
  
  Fresno State is 5-9 against BCS schools in the last five years and their best WAC finish was 3rd. Texas Tech is 17-2 against non-BCS teams and 46-18 overall (that'd be 29-16 against BCS schools). It sure doesn't take much hype to fool you.
  
  And Baylor? Baylor is one of the worst FBS programs around. But they are 10-3 against non-BCS in the last 5 years. They'd have been good enough for 2nd in the WAC every single one of those years. Now, try to sell me on the fact that you'd buy Baylor as a top team if they switched to the WAC this year and went undefeated. Go ahead, tell me they'd deserve a national title shot.
  
  The very fact that you are using Texas Tech and Baylor as some kind of measuring stick - and not measuring up - tells you what you really need to know.
• trep14

  enigmaax;473549 wrote:Well trep, Texas Tech beat six BCS schools last year. Boise State has beaten six in its history.
  
  Fresno State is 5-9 against BCS schools in the last five years and their best WAC finish was 3rd. Texas Tech is 17-2 against non-BCS teams and 46-18 overall (that'd be 29-16 against BCS schools). It sure doesn't take much hype to fool you.
  
  And Baylor? Baylor is one of the worst FBS programs around. But they are 10-3 against non-BCS in the last 5 years. They'd have been good enough for 2nd in the WAC every single one of those years. Now, try to sell me on the fact that you'd buy Baylor as a top team if they switched to the WAC this year and went undefeated. Go ahead, tell me they'd deserve a national title shot.
  
  The very fact that you are using Texas Tech and Baylor as some kind of measuring stick - and not measuring up - tells you what you really need to know.

  
  LOL please tell me you are kidding about Baylor. Yeah they are 10-3 against non BCS competition....because most of the teams they play aren't even FBS teams! Did you actually look at who they've played? They played Northwestern State like 4 years in a row, got a game or two against Texas State in there, and then capped off their cream-filled desert with Sam Houston State (all wins for Baylor mind you). And Texas Tech actually had a few non D1A opponents too. Now Tx Tech (and schools on their tier) may consistently beat the mid-major teams that they face, but that still doesn't change the fact that just because Texas Tech can beat New Mexico State, Texas is a better team than Boise State. That is just flawed logic and anyone who has ever picked up a football in their lives knows it. And also, Fresno State can held their own against BCS opponents. If they could play with Cincy and Wisky last year, well I think they could play with Texas Tech.
• Ty Webb

  

  Plain and simple....
  
  If Boise State,Ohio State,and Alabama all go undefeated...Boise will get the nod over Ohio State
• ytownfootball

  

  Ty Webb;473581 wrote:Plain and simple....
  
  If Boise State,Ohio State,and Alabama all go undefeated...Boise will get the nod over Ohio State

  
  And Boise State will have beaten who to leap frog OSU in the polls?
• Ty Webb

  

  Virginia Tech and Oregon State
  
  Ohio State's only good non-conference win(if they get it) will be Miami
• Mulva

  

  Ty Webb;473595 wrote: Ohio State's only good non-conference win(if they get it) will be Miami

  
  Good thing non-conference only makes up 1/3 of the season then.
  
  There aren't going to be 3 undefeated teams though, so it's a moot point.
• Ty Webb

  

  You're right Mulva....there will be 2
  
  Alabama and Boise State
• enigmaax

  trep14;473578 wrote:LOL please tell me you are kidding about Baylor. Yeah they are 10-3 against non BCS competition....because most of the teams they play aren't even FBS teams! Did you actually look at who they've played? They played Northwestern State like 4 years in a row, got a game or two against Texas State in there, and then capped off their cream-filled desert with Sam Houston State (all wins for Baylor mind you). And Texas Tech actually had a few non D1A opponents too. Now Tx Tech (and schools on their tier) may consistently beat the mid-major teams that they face, but that still doesn't change the fact that just because Texas Tech can beat New Mexico State, Texas is a better team than Boise State. That is just flawed logic and anyone who has ever picked up a football in their lives knows it. And also, Fresno State can held their own against BCS opponents. If they could play with Cincy and Wisky last year, well I think they could play with Texas Tech.

  
  Ha ha. Now you are going to start qualifying wins? You want to ignore 90% of Boise State's schedule but you are going to qualify crappy mid-level teams' wins? What is your support for Boise again? They've won four decent games in their history so that means they are for real? Or is it just that you think they look really good so they should get a title shot? Does who you beat count or not?
  
  Even funnier is that you cap it all off with "Fresno State can play with anyone". They LOST the games you are talking about. They have a LOSING record against BCS schools.
  
  Now, answer this question - if Baylor moved to the WAC this year and went undefeated would they deserve a national title shot?
• Footwedge

  ytownfootball;473019 wrote:Interesting, no choice of a VT win by more than 7?
  
  I'm in the camp that feels feels Cinderella needs bitch slapped back to reality. The last thing I want to hear about all season long is how good Boise State looks hanging 40+ on the likes of this turrible schedule...
  
  Wyoming at Laramie, WY 6:00 pm
  CBS College Sports
  Sat, Sep 25 Oregon State Bronco Stadium TBA
  ABC/ESPN
  Live Stats
  Sat, Oct 02 New Mexico State * at Las Cruces, NM 6:00 pm
  
  Sat, Oct 09 Toledo Bronco Stadium 6:00 pm
  Live Stats
  Sat, Oct 16 San Jose State * at San Jose, CA 6:00 pm
  
  Tue, Oct 26 Louisiana Tech * Bronco Stadium 6:00 pm
  ESPN 2
  Live Stats
  Sat, Nov 06 Hawai'i * Bronco Stadium Noon
  Live Stats
  Fri, Nov 12 Idaho * at Moscow, ID 7:00 pm
  ESPN 2
  Fri, Nov 19 Fresno State * Bronco Stadium 7:30 pm
  ESPN 2
  Live Stats
  Fri, Nov 26 Nevada * at Reno, NV 8:15 pm
  ESPN2
  Sat, Dec 04 Utah State *
  
  
  VT by a lot...

  
  Oregon St. Utah State and Idaho could present problems. The rest of the schedule is loaded with cupcakes.
  
  I see Boise St whipping VT tonight...thus punching their ticket to the title game. When this happens, there will be more and more clamor for a 4 team playoff which is long overdue.
• dave

  these VTech unis are sweeeeeet.
• Footwedge

  Ty Webb;473581 wrote:Plain and simple....
  
  If Boise State,Ohio State,and Alabama all go undefeated...Boise will get the nod over Ohio State

  LOL. Never happen. I do think OSU and Boise might play for the title though.
• Footwedge

  enigmaax;473452 wrote:Jordo:
  
  1. I don't buy any of that as any excuse nor do I have sympathy. There's a reason they are seen as "little guys". There's a big difference and those schools should really be glad that they've gotten some of the catering that they have received. But, give an inch and someone asks for a mile.
  
  2. Again, if you find a million reasons not to do something, you are not entitled to the prizes for actually doing it.
  
  3. The point is that the reason these teams are so successful is exactly the issue up for debate. They play at a lesser level. The argument for Boise is ALWAYS what they've done over the past five years. You can make a case within a single season for them. It is ALWAYS "they have proven they can beat the big boys..........over five seasons, once a year." You would not make that case for any other team and they are not an exception. And as soon as you go trying to use that as support, you have to consider what they did before that. It will lead you right back to the main point - they look really good at a lower level. Don't lump a bunch of seasons or a handful of games together and say that proves something if you are going to ignore the whole history and where that history has lead them.
  
  trep - Really I find your argument incredibly silly. If you can't tell the difference between any BCS school's schedule and the following: Nevada, Idaho, Louisiana Tech, New Mexico State, Hawaii, Fresno State, Utah State, and San Jose State then you are probably never going to get it. It isn't just that Baylor is slightly better than NM State or TT would finish 3rd in the WAC (they'd be 1st or 2nd anyway)....it is that ten of the teams on Texas' schedule would compete for a WAC title. And every single one of those WAC teams would be fighting it out in the basement of any BCS conference. Look at the records and scores of those teams. Even bad BCS schools hammer good WAC schools regularly. There just is no comparison at all.
  
  I never said all top BCS teams play a schedule full of top competition. But here's the thing and be honest...if you switch Texas and Boise State's schedule, would you expect Texas to go undefeated? Would you expect Boise State to go undefeated? No one would hesitate on Texas. You'd really have to evaluate Boise against some of those schools - just like you would with Texas. Thing is, Texas actually plays that schedule that you have to stop and think about and Boise doesn't. That doesn't entitle Boise to anything.

  
  Boise State is better than texas this year...by quite a bit in fact. It's a shame that their schedule is so putrid. They could run the table in any conference this year if things broke their way...including the SEC or the Big 10.
• ytownfootball

  

  I see Boise with the weight of the world on their shoulders, a long way from home playing for their entire season right out of the gate. I see them folding like a Big Lots lawn chair.
  
  At least I hope.
• 2quik4u

  

  Footwedge;473651 wrote:Oregon St. Utah State and Idaho could present problems. The rest of the schedule is loaded with cupcakes.
  
  I see Boise St whipping VT tonight...thus punching their ticket to the title game. When this happens, there will be more and more clamor for a 4 team playoff which is long overdue.

  
  lol fresno state just beat cincy but they are a cupcake gtfoh
• dave

  ytownfootball;473663 wrote:I see Boise with the weight of the world on their shoulders, a long way from home playing for their entire season right out of the gate. I see them folding like a Big Lots lawn chair.
  
  At least I hope.

  
  People always say Boise will fold but they never do.
• ytownfootball

  

  dave;473676 wrote:People always say Boise will fold but they never do.

  
  They did play football in Boise before 2005.
  
  Recent track performance is not necessarily and indicator of future performance.
• LJ

  

  lol, are Herbie and Musberger not even at the game?
• karen lotz

  

  LJ;473692 wrote:lol, are Herbie and Musberger not even at the game?

  
  
  lol, they are definitely in front of a blue screen probably in Bristol. This crowd is insane.
• Tiger2003

  

  The Va Tech Uniforms are sweet as hell
• LJ

  

  Yeah, I'm not sure Boise has even ever seen a hostile environment like this
• enigmaax

  Footwedge;473651 wrote: I see Boise St whipping VT tonight...thus punching their ticket to the title game.

  
  Won't be surprised if this happens.
  
  Boise IS good...that point has never been disputed. The matter is simply that they never have to go through what other top teams go through for a whole season. I would normally hope anyone kicks the hell out of VT, but this may be the only shot of keeping Boise out of the title game.
• dave

  what a badass crowd