Toledo--- St. Johns vs. St. Francis

• vball10set

  game to be played Friday,2/12 at UT at 6:30...any thoughts??
  
  I say SJJ by 8...tough,emotional rivalry game
• scout2

  SFS by 3....Yogiz top scorer. SFS outside shooting prevails on this one!
  
  
  
  game to be played Friday,2/12 at UT at 6:30...any thoughts??
  
  I say SJJ by 8...tough,emotional rivalry game
  [/quote]
• hookshot

  Upsets happen quite frequently in basketball. If SFS wins this one, it will be a significant but not shocking upset. These two teams are not very close in ability.
• Swamp Fox

  hookshot wrote: Upsets happen quite frequently in basketball. If SFS wins this one, it will be a significant but not shocking upset. These two teams are not very close in ability.

  I would agree with all you have said but I don't think that the upset will occur in this one and for that reason I think St. Johns will have a little too much for the Knights and win by around 7. I would add however, that my early season accuracy in predicting scores has taken a turn for the worse recently. (1. e. Super Bowl and a few others!):huh:
• SFSFan

  I think everyone has seen what relying on outside shooting is doing for SFS - they are battling for the 4th spot in the playoffs... They should be way better working inside - but seem to struggle with a consistent inside game. Sure, Storm can have some outings where he puts up 24 or so, but he also misses at least another 20 on short layups. As a result, SFS relies on 3 point shooting - and all of their guards seem to miss WAY more than they make. Goldsmith had a couple good outings in a row a few weeks back, but then got cold. Focht misses more than he ever makes, but can be streaky. Yodzis' game is a shorter jumper or drive...so that's not going to put him as a leading scorer against SJJ. It'd definitely help if Fockler can be a go for Friday night - not sure of the status on his broken hand...but would be nice to have another big forward available to bang the boards and make some put backs. The only way SFS wins is if Stanley has a good game - mid 20s - if Goldsmith is hot from 3, if Focht learns to pass the ball a little or happens to catch fire on the 3, and if Yodzis has another big body inside to work the boards and drive the lanes...one strong forward isn't going to be enough. SFS is going to have to fire on all cylinders to walk away with a win. Hope it happens - but haven't seen it yet this season...
• ross ford81

  SFSFan: You didn't mention Syroka. Isn't he one of your better guards?
• KnightXC1

  

  ^^No, he isn't.
  
  The big problem SFS has (and has had for 3 years now) is the inability to consistently use Storm in the offense. It is like the Kobe or Lebron effect in that those players should touch the ball almost every time down the court. There are way too many possesions where Storm will be on the block on the guards never get him the ball or throw it at his waist where a defender can take it away. That alone contributed greatly to SFS losing to Rogers because Syroka and Goldsmith couldn't make good entry passes to a kid that is 6'10". There is no excuse for him to not average 20 and 10 with his size advantage over everyone in the city.
  
  As for the game Friday, SFS's guards have to play well but they are overmatched by Norrils and Springs which has been a problem at guard for a few years now. Storm has to have a big game and limit Loving from getting easy baskets. Storm also has to stay out of foul trouble, which really hurt SFS against Whitmer in the first half (although one of the calls was pretty soft). Getting Fockler back will help a bunch as it takes pressure off of Strom and Yodzis down low. But everything for the Knights comes down to the guard play. If the guards can score and actually get Storm the ball in good position, the Knights can spring the upset. First few possessions will be very slow and grinded out then it may open up a little. I hope the Knights find a way but SJ is playing extremely well right now.
• slingshot4ever

  SJJ by 6.
• SFSFan

  Syroka is okay - but his decision making has to improve along with his passes. Sometimes he's very sharp, other times, not so much...
  
  Not so sure SFS's only problem is figuring out how to use Storm...fact is, in the last three years, Storm hasn't truly improved a ton. Again, I'm not sure I'd be looking to continue passing to a kid who misses so many short little shots...and last Friday's game, to have only a couple points and be outrebounded by Yodzis on his own team - come on. I think, over time, teammates must lose confidence in who should be their rain maker on the court - and maybe they are limiting his touches because he misses so many? I don't know - but I do know if the kid was more consistent and aggressive underneath, they'd all be feeding him the ball.
  
  The other issue - and some of this is Storm's, not the guards - when they do throw passes to him - he waits for the ball to get to him, versus taking a step forward or trying to jump for it, even a little. Often times, whomever is guarding him - they simply step in front of the pass or jump higher than Stanley jumps, and take the ball away. He never moves to the ball...so it makes it pretty easy for many opponents to guard against some of those passes. But whatever, he's a kid - maybe he'll get a lot better in college...he's got his free ride already!
  
  I hear Fockler is a go for SJJ...so that will definitely help - and not sure the difference will be the guard play - unless Brandon, Ken, and Ben (there, mentioned Syroka!) have lights out shooting... The game isn't going to be won on perimeter shooting - SFS isn't strong enough to win based on that - and that's why they are struggling for 4th place right now. I think the key to this game for SFS is the play of the forwards - both on defense and offense. If Yodzis, RJ, Fockler have strong games - and the guards look to feed them the ball down low or in the lane (which they fail to do quite a bit), then SFS has a shot. Either way - it will be a fun game - always is.
• KnightXC1

  

  I will agree with most of that. Storm has not developed into what he probably could have. However, teams still have to pay attention to him due to his size. i still think he should at least touch the ball most every time down court in order to focus attention away from someone else.
  
  He does need to go to the ball when they pass it to him since that killed the Knights against Rogers. But I do think it is more important for the guards to step up than the forwards because SFS does rely a lot on the 3 point shot. If they aren't falling Friday, SJ will run away with this one. I know Fockler and Yodzis come to play since they always do so they don't worry me all that much. Goldsmith, Syroka, and Fought must hit some shots and be productive, whether it be scoring or distributing the ball for SFS to have a chance.
• cityleaguewarrior

  SFSFan wrote: I think everyone has seen what relying on outside shooting is doing for SFS - they are battling for the 4th spot in the playoffs... They should be way better working inside - but seem to struggle with a consistent inside game. Sure, Storm can have some outings where he puts up 24 or so, but he also misses at least another 20 on short layups. As a result, SFS relies on 3 point shooting - and all of their guards seem to miss WAY more than they make. Goldsmith had a couple good outings in a row a few weeks back, but then got cold. Focht misses more than he ever makes, but can be streaky. Yodzis' game is a shorter jumper or drive...so that's not going to put him as a leading scorer against SJJ. It'd definitely help if Fockler can be a go for Friday night - not sure of the status on his broken hand...but would be nice to have another big forward available to bang the boards and make some put backs. The only way SFS wins is if Stanley has a good game - mid 20s - if Goldsmith is hot from 3, if Focht learns to pass the ball a little or happens to catch fire on the 3, and if Yodzis has another big body inside to work the boards and drive the lanes...one strong forward isn't going to be enough. SFS is going to have to fire on all cylinders to walk away with a win. Hope it happens - but haven't seen it yet this season...

  I disagree with you. i believe that sfs has a bunch of ball hog guards who need to give stanley the ball more inside. ive been to a few games and each of those games the guards have ran down the floor, look at storm wide open inside, and either throw a horrible pass or chuck up a crazy shot. stanley may miss a few layups, but hes a high school player whose under alot of pressure. i think the only way sfs can win is if they can slow down the ball, give stanley more touches inside, and have a big game out of goldsmith and yodzis.
• cityleaguewarrior

  SFSFan wrote: Syroka is okay - but his decision making has to improve along with his passes. Sometimes he's very sharp, other times, not so much...
  
  Not so sure SFS's only problem is figuring out how to use Storm...fact is, in the last three years, Storm hasn't truly improved a ton. Again, I'm not sure I'd be looking to continue passing to a kid who misses so many short little shots...and last Friday's game, to have only a couple points and be outrebounded by Yodzis on his own team - come on. I think, over time, teammates must lose confidence in who should be their rain maker on the court - and maybe they are limiting his touches because he misses so many? I don't know - but I do know if the kid was more consistent and aggressive underneath, they'd all be feeding him the ball.
  
  The other issue - and some of this is Storm's, not the guards - when they do throw passes to him - he waits for the ball to get to him, versus taking a step forward or trying to jump for it, even a little. Often times, whomever is guarding him - they simply step in front of the pass or jump higher than Stanley jumps, and take the ball away. He never moves to the ball...so it makes it pretty easy for many opponents to guard against some of those passes. But whatever, he's a kid - maybe he'll get a lot better in college...he's got his free ride already!
  
  I hear Fockler is a go for SJJ...so that will definitely help - and not sure the difference will be the guard play - unless Brandon, Ken, and Ben (there, mentioned Syroka!) have lights out shooting... The game isn't going to be won on perimeter shooting - SFS isn't strong enough to win based on that - and that's why they are struggling for 4th place right now. I think the key to this game for SFS is the play of the forwards - both on defense and offense. If Yodzis, RJ, Fockler have strong games - and the guards look to feed them the ball down low or in the lane (which they fail to do quite a bit), then SFS has a shot. Either way - it will be a fun game - always is.

  i'm sure storm missing the passes is because hes not expecting the ball because he never gets it lol! ill admit, he misses some short shots, but those passes your talking about, he shouldnt have to step up to them he's 6'10! the guards need to understand the advantage he has and throw better passes where only he can get it. plain and simple. yes fockler is a go, and he will be a big help on both sides of the ball. im hoping for a big shooting game out of goldsmith to help lift the knights to a win over the titans!
• SFSFan

  Don't disagree about the ball hogging guards at all - both in getting Storm the ball and moving the ball effectively to the forwards. Their first inclination is to shoot, shoot, shoot... They almost seem to lack any court awareness to see the open teammates - and, for whatever reason, they fail to see the forwards wide open in the corners. I think, unfortunately, at least two of the three are looking more to have a big game for themselves...versus doing what's right for the team...definitely more concerned about personal stats and points. And the passes to Storm do lack at times - it's amazing - not rocket science to learn to throw the ball up high where only he should be able to get it. My point was there are other kids on other teams that can jump higher than Storm...and when he doesn't move to the ball - they have the opportunity to go just as high and steal. It happens a lot.
  
  But - every team has their issues...hope SFS can pull it together enough to have a good showing against SJJ.
• vball10set

  the Knights need the win,but IMO--Coach Lowe needs it more
• cityleaguewarrior

  SFSFan wrote: Don't disagree about the ball hogging guards at all - both in getting Storm the ball and moving the ball effectively to the forwards. Their first inclination is to shoot, shoot, shoot... They almost seem to lack any court awareness to see the open teammates - and, for whatever reason, they fail to see the forwards wide open in the corners. I think, unfortunately, at least two of the three are looking more to have a big game for themselves...versus doing what's right for the team...definitely more concerned about personal stats and points. And the passes to Storm do lack at times - it's amazing - not rocket science to learn to throw the ball up high where only he should be able to get it. My point was there are other kids on other teams that can jump higher than Storm...and when he doesn't move to the ball - they have the opportunity to go just as high and steal. It happens a lot.
  
  But - every team has their issues...hope SFS can pull it together enough to have a good showing against SJJ.

  i think they can win. they just gotta play great in all facets of their game.
• W8nC

  St. Johns by 15 easily.
• vball10set

  GO TITANS!!!
• slingshot4ever

  SJJ won 60-58 in OT.
• vball10set

  even though I wanted SJJ to win,I thought Stanley was fouled at the end of OT--that being said,he still needs to make that shot--go STRONG to the hole,Storm!!!
• Swamp Fox

  I need St. Francis to beat a team or two ahead of them and I'm feeling pretty good about my Final Four picks. I was really pulling for the Knights the other night. That would have been perfect. Oh well!
• KnightXC1

  

  Was at the game but after seeing the replay this morning, Storm got hacked big time on that final play and there is no doubt about it. Terrible missed call at the end of a great game. Storm made a good move and had a good luck but Loving drilled him on the arm. Feel so bad for the Knights as they played a tremendous game last night.
• ross ford81

  Do you think Storm may have traveled on that last play? Just asking.
• KnightXC1

  

  No, I don't think he traveled. Watched that play multiple times this morning and it was fine outside of him getting hacked.
• D Bialorucki

  The officating in the league has to be addressed. League full of guys who can't keep up anymore. The missed last call was a joke...
• Ollie Williams

  KnightXC1 wrote: No, I don't think he traveled. Watched that play multiple times this morning and it was fine outside of him getting hacked.

  What about the no call on Springs' game winning shot??? It should have been an and 1. Stanley got a lot of the body trying to block that shot. Plus no one would be talking about any of this if SJJ didn't miss 15 free throws.