Ask the Ref

• BlueDevil11

  

  ernest_t_bass wrote:

  BlueDevil11 wrote: ernest, i asked another ref about that call, and he said that free throws should have been shot in that situation.
  That means that 3 refs say the call was wrong, and 2 say it was the correct call.

  You are right, the free throws should have been awarded, b/c there was no team possession. What did the refs actually call?
  
  If the refs actually awarded free throws (the correct call) then I hope you're not pinning me as one of the ones that got it wrong!

  I don't know who is right and who is wrong. What I meant was that 3 refs disagreed with the call, while 2 refs agreed with the call. The refs called a charge and then gave the team 2 free throws.
• BlueDevil11

  

  HSBBR
  What is your opinion on my question since you are a ref?
  It is explained in post #22.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  BlueDevil11 wrote:The refs called a charge and then gave the team 2 free throws.

  It is not a charge, but a "push" for a common foul. I'm sure what happened was the ref put his hand behind his head, signaling an offensive foul... a common mistake. As long as the ball was still at the disposal of the thrower, the free throws should have been awarded. This was NOT an illegal screen.
• BlueDevil11

  

  Does it matter if the ball is in motion or if it is still in the possession of the person taking the ball out?
  I can't remember if the ball had already been thrown or not, just wondered if it made any difference.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  Possession is not gained until it is inbounded.
• BlueDevil11

  

  Do you have the rule from the rule book so that I can read it?
  Not that I don't believe you, I just want to see the rule explained in the rulebook.
• karen lotz

  

  I remember something similar to this play in college basketball. I think Bob Knight drew something up when he was still at Indiana, was down by 2 with 1 second left and had ball out under the opponents basket. IU had someone setting a screen at halfcourt and then sent someone on a fly pattern, while the ball was in the air the defender was in a full sprint and plowed over the screener. They got 2 FTs and sent to OT.
• HSBBR

  BlueDevil11 wrote: HSBBR
  What is your opinion on my question since you are a ref?
  It is explained in post #22.

  Blue Devil,
  
  Rule 4-12-6 states "Neither team control nor player control exists during a dead ball, throw in, a jump ball or when the ball is in flight during a try or tap for goal."
  
  The throw in would end when the passed ball is legally touched by another player in bounds or out of bounds (except 7-5-7) or when the throw in team commits a throw-in violation.
  
  In your case, the throw in was not completed so free throws should have been awarded.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  Thanks HSBBR. I have rule book in hand, but now can put it down
• BlueDevil11

  

  Thanks HSBBR, but I don't understand one thing. If neither team had possession, then why did team B get to shoot free throws?
• HSBBR

  BlueDevil11 wrote: Thanks HSBBR, but I don't understand one thing. If neither team had possession, then why did team B get to shoot free throws?

  Blue Devil,
  
  The foul committed by "A" was a common foul. The penalty for common fouls is ball out of bounds to the non-fouling team before the bonus is in effect. Since this was team "A" 10+ foul, the bonus is in effect, so the penalty becomes two free throws for team "B".
  
  The fact that neither team had "possession" (by rule), is irrelevant in this situation. The ball was live (at the disposal of team "A" for the throw in) when the foul was committed, so it is a common foul.
  
  If the throw in had been completed and team "A" had gained control/possession of the ball and then A1 pushed B1, we would then have a team control foul on A1 (assuming he/she didn't have the ball) with team "B" awarded the ball for a throw in at a spot nearest the foul. Both team control and player control fouls are penalized by awarding the non-fouling team a throw-in at a spot nearest the foul. This was a rule change that went into effect several years ago (prior to the 2005-06 season?).
• BlueDevil11

  

  Thanks, I understand that explanation better than I understood explanations that I had heard previously.
• ricola

  

  ross ford81 wrote: Strange discussion about traveling. Some say they call it all the time while others say it never gets called. I say traveling is called more often than it happens. Too many refs are watching the ball, head, shoulders, etc. and not the feet. Also, big steps do not count more than small ones, do they? And the jump stop is so inconsistently called (easy for refs to call it when many people sitting in the stands think its traveling). Lots of unsual aspects to this overall subject, perhaps my favorite: Player A drives into the lane and attempts a shot and shoots an airball. Player A quickly rushes toward the basket and catches his own airball and shoots again and scores. How many people think this is a travel? It's not. Some fans go crazy when this happens.

  agree wholeheartedly. Too often if something doesn't "look" quite right, traveling will be called when I would bet, more often than not, if one were to replay it at slow motion it would be legal.