The Term "Sell Out"

• Nate

  After reading the Lady GaGa thread, this sparked some discussion on the term of "sell out"/"selling out".
  
  Isn't the point of joining a band or becoming a musician to do it and hopefully become successful enough to make it your occupation?
  
  It would literally be like telling Lebron and Kobe to stick to playing at the local park and not play in the NBA.
  
  
  Seriously, calling someone a sell-out is lame.
• Laley23

  

  I think the difference is when you are making big money doing what your doing and then completely changing the style to make a little bit more, while also leaving people behind.
  
  My best example is Rob Thomas of Matchbox 20. They were making millions, but Thomas decided to go solo (and pop instead of alternative rock) and left his band in the dust. He is making more, but he is a sell-out.
• Nate

  Totally agree with it along those lines.
• Upper90

  There's some instances, musically, where it fits. (BLACK EYED PEAS)...but, it's mostly an overused term.
  
  Well, this post looks ridiculous now that Laley pretty much made this point as I was ever so slowly typing it.
• Nate

  Upper90 wrote: There's some instances, musically, where it fits. (BLACK EYED PEAS)...but, it's mostly an overused term.
  
  Well, this post looks ridiculous now that Laley pretty much made this point as I was ever so slowly typing it.

  You are the MVP, you can get away with it.
• gut

  Laley23 wrote: My best example is Rob Thomas of Matchbox 20. They were making millions, but Thomas decided to go solo (and pop instead of alternative rock) and left his band in the dust. He is making more, but he is a sell-out.

  I agree with the genearl premise. Not speaking of Rob Thomas in particular (I don't know the whole story), but just doing what he did doesn't make someone a sell out. He may be perceived that way, but some legitimately do want to sometimes try something different.
• Con_Alma

  It's as "lame" as the term "overrated" being used on someone/something that isn't even rated.
• Timber

  Maybe the change is not about the money... Just maybe they have changed/progressed their music to a different vibe. It does not make them a sell out just because the rest of the band does not want to make the same journey musically. Maybe the group itself... changes their style to keep from being labeled as a "type X band." Many people do not want to remain in the same genre an entire career... they want to grow musically. It really tends to piss fans off at times, and I have been included in this category. Fans do not like change.
• SQ_Crazies

  

  Sell out is such a lame phrase. Most of the people I hear say it, also including myself, would sell out too.
• Laley23

  

  I agree with most. Most people who use the term sell-out are the ones that never had that opportunity.
• Upper90

  There's degrees of it, though.
  
  I wouldn't compromise my art to make a larger profit, simple as that. For me, I'd have a hard time living with myself.
  
  But, if I can stay true to my work, and take an opportunity that will further it, well...yeah, of course.
• Scarlet_Buckeye

  

  There is a difference between "doing what you did that got you there" and "switching things up becomes someone asks you to."
• SQ_Crazies

  

  I remember when people called John Mayer a sell out. Look what he did, he sold out to get to the top--it worked, he got rich and now he does what he wants and makes better music anyways.
  
  I'd sell out in a heartbeat. Why the hell would you not want to make money on what you're good at? Wasted talent is awful.
• BORIStheCrusher

  

  SQ_Crazies wrote: I'd sell out in a heartbeat. Why the hell would you not want to make money on what you're good at? Wasted talent is awful.

  99% of the people who call others sell outs, would "sell out" themselves if they had the opportunity. It's easy to say you'd do something when you know you'll never get a chance. I agree, depending on my career and situation, I'd most likely do the same.
• tcarrier32

  

  Upper90 wrote: There's degrees of it, though.
  
  I wouldn't compromise my art to make a larger profit, simple as that. For me, I'd have a hard time living with myself.
  
  But, if I can stay true to my work, and take an opportunity that will further it, well...yeah, of course.

  there are circumstances when you would. everyone has a price.
  
  sellout.
• Upper90

  I don't think that there are.
  
  Honestly, if I had to change my beliefs, passions, or art....there's no price for that.
  
  Especially when there are ways to NOT go that route and be successful. There's tons of people who have proven that they don't have a price, especially musically....just off top, look at Ani DiFranco.
• Red_Skin_Pride

  

  Laley23 wrote: I think the difference is when you are making big money doing what your doing and then completely changing the style to make a little bit more, while also leaving people behind.
  
  My best example is Rob Thomas of Matchbox 20. They were making millions, but Thomas decided to go solo (and pop instead of alternative rock) and left his band in the dust. He is making more, but he is a sell-out.

  I can see where you're coming from, but I heard through several sources that some of his bandmates were having a dispute/not very happy with their contract, or each other, and they were scheduled to make a new album pretty soon...long story short, the album got put on hold, Thomas was tired of waiting, and said well eff you guys, I'll make my own album. It was a big success, so he made a follow up to it released earlier this year. However, in between his two solo albums, Matchbox Twenty did release "Exile on Mainstream". It didn't have very many songs (7?) but that was because it had been on hold for so damn long that they just wanted to get it out. I haven't heard if any reconcilliation has been made between band/label/bandmembers amongst each other or if there will be another CD anytime soon...but you can't blame a guy who is an artist by profession, for wanting to keep making music...even if some of the guys in his band can't quit bickering amongst themselves or with their record label long enough to do it. Plus, Thomas was given creative license to do almost whatever he wanted with his solo albums (and his first one was GREAT. The one this year was also solid, just not as many good songs as the first).
• Laley23

  

  Ok, I just sort of pulled Thomas out of a hat because I knew the band was pissed at him for leaving. I didnt really know WHY he left, but if thats true than I dont blame him. He did change his style though because being alternative rock when your solo is damn near impossible. Thats where people get sell-out from him. But if your story is true he really had no other option.
• Red_Skin_Pride

  

  Laley23 wrote: Ok, I just sort of pulled Thomas out of a hat because I knew the band was pissed at him for leaving. I didnt really know WHY he left, but if thats true than I dont blame him. He did change his style though because being alternative rock when your solo is damn near impossible. Thats where people get sell-out from him. But if your story is true he really had no other option.

  Well, that's the closest rendition to what the real truth probably is, that we are going to get lol. You never really know unless you're in the band. And as I said, I can see why a lot of people feel that way, and it isn't unjustified. He is just one of my favorite artists, and I think he's going to famous for quite some time if he keeps doing what he wants and being allowed to use his creativity on his records. I personally like the alt rock thing best for his voice, but as you said that's almost suicide; so I think pop (or his version of it) is where he'll be for at least some time now.
• GOONx19

  

  Remember when Green Day was creative?
• SQ_Crazies

  

  GOONx19 wrote: Remember when Green Day was creative?

  No. But I remember when Green Day sucked from the beginning.
• DESCENTdmc

  i dont see Green Day a musical sell out, appearence wise, definately but i think they just had progression in music as they got older. however i give them no respect for trying to look the part of what is cool and hip these days.