Modifications in School

• ernest_t_bass

  

  Educational law states that IEP children can (and sometimes should... mandated) have modifications to assignments and tests. Why? I mean, I understand what they are trying to do, but how does it help? How does it help that IEP student to receive the same relative grade as the "smartest" kid in the class? Now, I know that a lot of that falls on the teacher, and perhaps the modifications are making it too easy, but still. Kids aren't allowed to fail anymore.
  
  Does your boss pat you on the back when you do something stupid and let you do it over until you get it right? NO! So why do we let this happen in schools?
  
  /Rant
• I Wear Pants

  Kids are allowed to fail. Haven't you seen the graduation and grade statistics?
• cbus4life

  ^
  
  I don't understand where this whole idea that no one is allowed to fail comes from.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  The idea comes from everything being based on test scores. Test scores can't be bad, graduation rate can't be bad, so we don't let them fail.
• cbus4life

  But many do fail...
• ernest_t_bass

  

  I guess it depends on the district. Yes, many inner city kids fail, and the inner city institutions give education a bad name. But go to a rural school. I've just seen so many things from the inside where ANYTHING will be done to make sure these kids graduate. Why not give EVERYONE the opportunity to a hand out?
• Fab4Runner

  

  My brother had modified tests while in school. I don't think it was unfair to the other kids. He wasn't able to read the question and comprehend it and then write an answer in the alloted time. He was either given more time or had and aide to read him the question and/or record his answer. He had a learning disability and whether or not anyone thinks it was legit...it was. He knew the material, it was just a matter of being able to give an answer.
  
  And kids are and should be allowed to fail if/when they are given the opportunity to succeed and do not take it.
• Gblock

  Fab4Runner wrote: My brother had modified tests while in school. I don't think it was unfair to the other kids. He wasn't able to read the question and comprehend it and then write an answer in the alloted time. He was either given more time or had and aide to read him the question and/or record his answer. He had a learning disability and whether or not anyone thinks it was legit...it was. He knew the material, it was just a matter of being able to give an answer.
  
  And kids are and should be allowed to fail if/when they are given the opportunity to succeed and do not take it.

  i teach special ed and thats a good answer
• Gblock

  you also have to understand the difference between accomodations and modifications....accomodations allow for calculators more time etc....modifications is more of changing the curriculum
• ernest_t_bass

  

  Yes, I'm talking about modifications, not accommodations.
• fan_from_texas

  Fab4Runner wrote: My brother had modified tests while in school. I don't think it was unfair to the other kids. He wasn't able to read the question and comprehend it and then write an answer in the alloted time. He was either given more time or had and aide to read him the question and/or record his answer. He had a learning disability and whether or not anyone thinks it was legit...it was. He knew the material, it was just a matter of being able to give an answer.
  
  And kids are and should be allowed to fail if/when they are given the opportunity to succeed and do not take it.

  Interesting post. My brother was also IEP, and things were modified in such a way that he once made the honor roll. Now, I love(d) him dearly, but it seems to me to be a little misleading for a school to give Bs to someone who is, well, not very smart. It makes grades less meaningful if we attempt to handicap it so that anyone who puts in the effort can get a decent grade, now matter how disabled they are. I tend to think that grades should measure results, not effort, even if that means addressing the harsh reality that certain people aren't cut out for "success" (however we want to define that) in life. At the same time, there are many skills that correlate with "success" that don't show up in a GPA, and I agree that many wildly successful people didn't necessarily knock the ball out of the park in middle school. But what is GPA if not a measure of their ability to perform certain standardized tasks in standardized ways under standardized conditions?
• ernest_t_bass

  

  fan_from_texas wrote:

  Fab4Runner wrote: My brother had modified tests while in school. I don't think it was unfair to the other kids. He wasn't able to read the question and comprehend it and then write an answer in the alloted time. He was either given more time or had and aide to read him the question and/or record his answer. He had a learning disability and whether or not anyone thinks it was legit...it was. He knew the material, it was just a matter of being able to give an answer.
  
  And kids are and should be allowed to fail if/when they are given the opportunity to succeed and do not take it.

  Interesting post. My brother was also IEP, and things were modified in such a way that he once made the honor roll. Now, I love(d) him dearly, but it seems to me to be a little misleading for a school to give Bs to someone who is, well, not very smart. It makes grades less meaningful if we attempt to handicap it so that anyone who puts in the effort can get a decent grade, now matter how disabled they are. I tend to think that grades should measure results, not effort, even if that means addressing the harsh reality that certain people aren't cut out for "success" (however we want to define that) in life. At the same time, there are many skills that correlate with "success" that don't show up in a GPA, and I agree that many wildly successful people didn't necessarily knock the ball out of the park in middle school. But what is GPA if not a measure of their ability to perform certain standardized tasks in standardized ways under standardized conditions?

  
  Very well said.
• Sonofanump

  Unless it is reading or writing, said student is only being tested on that subject matter and not being penalized for student's learning disability. The student still needs to learn the matter. (acc)
  
  Some on IEPs have IQs above 100, some near 130. It could be a specific disability that causes them unable to learn the subject matter in the conventional way.
  
  Now for some, the basic goal of the special needs instructor is to get them prepared for basic life as best they can and hopefully they can be a contributing member of society. (mod)
• elbuckeye28

  ernest_t_bass wrote: Educational law states that IEP children can (and sometimes should... mandated) have modifications to assignments and tests. Why? I mean, I understand what they are trying to do, but how does it help? How does it help that IEP student to receive the same relative grade as the "smartest" kid in the class? Now, I know that a lot of that falls on the teacher, and perhaps the modifications are making it too easy, but still. Kids aren't allowed to fail anymore.
  
  Does your boss pat you on the back when you do something stupid and let you do it over until you get it right? NO! So why do we let this happen in schools?
  
  /Rant

  I don't think that this is a fair comparison. Students, by law, have to attend school. There is also very little choice on which schools to attend. Comparing that to working, where we have considerable choices on where to work, in what field, and in what capacity, is not really realistic.
  
  Besides, major modifications are usually reserved for students with more severe disabilities (CD, Autism, Multiple Disabilities). Most students on IEP's have small modifications, and are most likely to have accommodations instead.
• elbuckeye28

  Sonofanump wrote: Unless it is reading or writing, said student is only being tested on that subject matter and not being penalized for student's learning disability. The student still needs to learn the matter. (acc)
  
  Some on IEPs have IQs above 100, some near 130. It could be a specific disability that causes them unable to learn the subject matter in the conventional way.
  
  Now for some, the basic goal of the special needs instructor is to get them prepared for basic life as best they can and hopefully they can be a contributing member of society. (mod)

  Exactly. While most of us were either getting prepared for college or getting prepared to enter the workforce, some students are going to school to learn daily living needs. Education is not just about learning to read, write, and do math. For some it is a time to learn some of the basic skills that we take for granted. Besides, is it really fair to expect a student with severe Autism, who may never be able to live on his or her own, to be held to the same standard as those that are getting ready to head off to college?
• Cat Food Flambe'

  

  My daughter was a IEP student - like Fab said, the idea was to teach her how to succeed - and an IEP is supposed to identify what each student needs to do just that.
  
  We were very fortunate to get a dedicated IEP instructor who help her devise certain study methods and a really weird way of taking notes that worked perfectly for her.
  
  She has a good full-time job now, and is two quarters away from graduation at TOSU with a psychology degree.
• June18

  If you are a retard, you should know that you are a retard. You shouldn't get special treatment. IEPs are the biggest scam in the world. If you are going to school to learn "the basics of life" you probably should be going to a special school. Public schools should prepare you for college. You can't do anything in life without a college degree.
• bLuE_71

  June18 I really hope you are kidding............
• cbus4life

  Well said, CCRunner.
  
  June18...you're the GOAT douche.