When is enough ………… enough Haiti

• FatHobbit

  

  ManO'War wrote: Heck, Haiti is probably in better shape than the U.S.

  if you say so
• cbus4life

  ManO'War wrote: It would be one thing if America's streets were paved in gold and we had extra money just laying around collecting dust, but in our current state it is foolish to give any tax payer money to anyone.
  
  It is like a family that is in debt up to it's eyeballs and filing for bankruptcy, charging money on their Visa card to help out their neighbor.
  
  Heck, Haiti is probably in better shape than the U.S. They don't have anything, but at least they don't owe anyone either.

  ROFL.
  
  Our current state? Was our capital just hit by an earthquake, thousands dead and lacking the infrastructure to rebuild and provide basic necessities of life to those who have survived?
  
  We want to be a world "superpower," it is our responsibility to help in certain humanitarian causes, where we have the ability to do so.
  
  This is one of those cases.
  
  I know it isn't always feasible to help, or send a large amount of aid, but this is one of those cases where we absolutely should be.
  
  And, it isn't just money that will make the difference. It is the people there, right now, who have come from the United States, who are doing a world of good. And many organizations will stay, helping with the actual reconstruction.
  
  I know that there are concerns about the money, at this point, but i think even the corrupt government lacks the ability right now to embezzle/steal the money. With the amount and variety of foreign aid pouring in, i have faith that it will be used as well as one could expect.
• iclfan2

  

  BoatShoes wrote:

  krazie45 wrote: If people want to privately donate to Haiti then the money can keep on going there as long as people let it as far as I'm concerned. However, I agree that taxpayer money should be going to better places. I don't recall Haiti sending relief to New Orleans

  What might be some more urgent, moral and better places to spend taxpayer money?

  Appalachia. Inner cities. Americans. I agree Haiti should get some relief, but there is a point where the amount of money they get is ridiculous. Especially with a corrupt government running the show over there.
• ManO'War

  

  I mean in a general sense.
  
  I would rather be a homeless man with no debt, than a man living in a big fancy house that owes so much he will never be able to come close to paying it back. At least the homeless man still has the hope of someday building up his wealth.
  
  Haiti is going to be rebuilt on someone else's dime, and in 20 years we will be hearing stories about how Haiti is doing well....what will those stories say about the United States at that time?
• iclfan2

  

  ManO'War wrote: Haiti is going to be rebuilt on someone else's dime, and in 20 years we will be hearing stories about how Haiti is doing well.

  No we won't. They will be living in poverty again. There country has a chance to be like the DR, and travelled too, but they didn't. Getting hit by an earthquaker and getting tons of money isn't going to change it.
• BoatShoes

  So...suppose I have a neighboring apartment complex...and it's say a poorly maintained housing complex....most of the resident's are poor and have little income and are in effect living across a political boundary...say they live in East Cleveland but I live in Cleveland. I have a huge mansion, large amounts of assets but I also have a large amount of liabilities that I need to start getting under control....if an earthquake happens and those destitute neighbors are trapped and dying and starving underneath collapsed rubble....I'm not going to run up some more on my liabilities to help them???
  
  Is this how people really think in emergencies...instead of helping their fellow man they're concerned with their credit score???? It doesn't seem like that fits with our experience of the world and how humans act towards other humans in emergency situations.
  
  Americans die from diseases that stem from gluttony and affluence...We're so well off that if the rest of the world ate like us we would need three earth's to produce that much food....most Americans live in and experience more comfort than Henry the VIII did when living in the Palace of Versailles. Heck, even before the earthquake, Haitians had to wash their cloths in sewage. If people think the U.S. large debt, although the most pressing problem facing the Union, is bad, they really need to get some perspective on life as it pales in comparison to what the people of Haiti are facing. Normally, I feel as if I'm not so dismissive of other views on here...but, perhaps even if you don't care about haitians...at least admit that....just say it...I don't care if they're dying, trapped under rubble and have nothing to eat because I have to focus on being able to afford that vacation to Disney Land....just don't say we have bigger problems because that is, from any reasonable view, completely false.
  
  
  The U.S' Gross National Income for 2008, was 14.3 trillion dollars. We could cut that in half and put that half of it toward our Debt that we've carelessly racked up unnecessarily and STILL have more national income than the next richest country by 3 trillion dollars, Japan; (not counting the European Union as a whole). So realistically, if we really wanted to get serious about paying our national debt as a whole....we could pull it off by tightening our belts for two years....maybe we could try eating like most of the world will do for their whole lives for a year or two...
  
  I REALIZE I'M GROSSLY OVERSIMPLIFYING...please, you don't have to point that out....but my under lying point that I'm trying to hammer home...is that what's going on in Haiti, and realistically what has been going on there is way more pressing than anything going on in the ole U.S.A. You don't want to help them...fine...but don't say we've got bigger problems because that ain't true son.
• goosebumps

  

  I haven't been on this forum for a long time... What happened? I agree with Boat Shoes!!! :huh:
  
  Just gave around 80 dollars in change to my school for Haiti Relief. Was planning on taking it to the coinstar but figured they needed it more than I did. I'm out a new game for the Wii and a night on the town... big whoop.
  
  I'm as conservative as they come, but have no objection to helping this country out.
• dwccrew

  

  BoatShoes wrote:

  krazie45 wrote: If people want to privately donate to Haiti then the money can keep on going there as long as people let it as far as I'm concerned. However, I agree that taxpayer money should be going to better places. I don't recall Haiti sending relief to New Orleans

  What might be some more urgent, moral and better places to spend taxpayer money?

  I'd say our homeless in this country, our orphans in this country and the sick in this country. And I mean this stictly on the taxpayer's dime; private donations are great and will continue to happen.
  

  cbus4life wrote:

  ManO'War wrote: It would be one thing if America's streets were paved in gold and we had extra money just laying around collecting dust, but in our current state it is foolish to give any tax payer money to anyone.
  
  It is like a family that is in debt up to it's eyeballs and filing for bankruptcy, charging money on their Visa card to help out their neighbor.
  
  Heck, Haiti is probably in better shape than the U.S. They don't have anything, but at least they don't owe anyone either.

  ROFL.
  
  Our current state? Was our capital just hit by an earthquake, thousands dead and lacking the infrastructure to rebuild and provide basic necessities of life to those who have survived?
  
  We want to be a world "superpower," it is our responsibility to help in certain humanitarian causes, where we have the ability to do so.
  
  This is one of those cases.
  
  I know it isn't always feasible to help, or send a large amount of aid, but this is one of those cases where we absolutely should be.
  
  And, it isn't just money that will make the difference. It is the people there, right now, who have come from the United States, who are doing a world of good. And many organizations will stay, helping with the actual reconstruction.
  
  I know that there are concerns about the money, at this point, but i think even the corrupt government lacks the ability right now to embezzle/steal the money. With the amount and variety of foreign aid pouring in, i have faith that it will be used as well as one could expect.

  I believe that everything you just said is correct; however, the S government shouldn't (and really doesn't need to) donate money. The only thing we could really do that I wouldn't have a problem with is sending the military to help organize donations by private organizations.
  
  We should send money as citizens, not as a government IMO.
  

  ManO'War wrote: I mean in a general sense.
  
  I would rather be a homeless man with no debt, than a man living in a big fancy house that owes so much he will never be able to come close to paying it back. At least the homeless man still has the hope of someday building up his wealth.
  
  Haiti is going to be rebuilt on someone else's dime, and in 20 years we will be hearing stories about how Haiti is doing well....what will those stories say about the United States at that time?

  Ummmm, I'd rather live in the house with the debt than be homeless. At least I'd have a place to stay at that time. And who is to say the man in the big fancy house still can't dream of regaining wealth, just as the homeless man is dreaming of gaining his wealth. I'd say the guy in the house at least has the know how of gaining wealth moreso than a homeless guy, but to each their own.
  

  goosebumps wrote: I haven't been on this forum for a long time... What happened? I agree with Boat Shoes!!! :huh:
  
  Just gave around 80 dollars in change to my school for Haiti Relief. Was planning on taking it to the coinstar but figured they needed it more than I did. I'm out a new game for the Wii and a night on the town... big whoop.
  
  I'm as conservative as they come, but have no objection to helping this country out.

  This post is a perfect example of how many people in this country think. We, as a people, are very generous (more than some would like to give credit) and private donations will continue to go to Haiti. The government should not be giving any money. A government shouldn't have any emotions i.e. compassion, greed, etc.
  
  Leave it to the people to donate, the government should worry about how it is ruining this country before trying to stabilize another country.
• krazie45

  

  Look, I'm all for helping Haiti. I think the Red Cross and other organizations are doing a great job getting people to donate to the Haitian relief cause and I think people should (I've even donated). What I don't think is that the government should be involved. Let private organizations handle it but the government needs to focus its resources on its own country. Their are thousands of poor, destitute people in this country and that's where the government's taxpayer money should be going. If everyone wants to make donations privately to Haiti then that's wonderful because they do need the help.
• ManO'War

  

  I guess I just don't like the idea of having insurmountable debt. I have no debt in my personal life, and I don't agree with spending money I don't have. A country should be ran the same way. But hey, the mentality of people now a days is that they can just file bankruptcy and everything is fine!
  
  I don't begrudge anyone of giving their private money to any charity they want, but US tax money should not be used on any country.
  
  BTW, why wouldn't someone donate their coinstar change to people that actually need help in our country?? Is suffering in another country somehow greater than suffering here?
• dwccrew

  

  ManO'War wrote: I don't begrudge anyone of giving their private money to any charity they want, but US tax money should not be used on any country.

  Why do you make this statement......
  

  ManO'War wrote: BTW, why wouldn't someone donate their coinstar change to people that actually need help in our country?? Is suffering in another country somehow greater than suffering here?

  And then ask this question? People can donate their money to whatever charity they choose, whether it be domestic or foreign. Suffering is suffering. What people personally believe is the greater suffering and choose to donate to is their business.
  
  Personally, I generally donate to domestic causes, but on occassion will donate to foreign causes as well.