Christian (Believers) Huddlers...

• ernest_t_bass

  

  Before I start this thread, I ask that those of you who are not believers, and couldn't care less about this topic please:
  -Refrain from turning this into a religious debate.
  -Refrain from insulting the beliefs mentioned here.
  -Refrain from insulting huddlers for their beliefs.
  -Refrain from "thread-shitting."
  -If you choose to do any of the following, it just goes to show your childishness.
  
  Now that I have said that, I know that people will still do the above, but I had to mention it anyway.
  
  To fellow believers, Christians, whatever. In your day-to-day (spiritual) life, what is the toughest part of living that life? What do you find that challenges your own personal beliefs most? What brings you the most "trouble" in your spiritual life?
  
  For me, personally, it is "what if I'm wrong?" There are so many different "religions" out there, and each one preaches that they are the right one. Which one is right? What if I'm wrong?
  
  I don't consider myself a religious person. I was raised non-denominational, but I'd consider myself a baptist.
  
  What troubles you the most?
• 2trap_4ever

  I believe the,"what if I'm wrong" question comes and goes in everyone's life, believers or not. For me it's just doing the right things, I was raised Baptist but due to my church I feel they have left me, they see things differetnly than I do. Does that make me a back person, no at least not in my mind. I believe that our God is a loving God and he understands that we can't be Christ like 24 hours a day, but as long as you pray to him and ask for forgiveness then all is well.
  
  I also believe(thanks to my church) that I can get just as much out of my Bible sitting at home, as long as my family is with me and we are sharing in the Bible and praying to God and giving our time to him then we ourselves are a church, it says so much in the Bible. The last thing is the wickedness in our community, it is hard to live a Christian life when you so many people against you,but you will have this in any area of the country in todays world.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  Another for me is the "why do good people, who don't believe, go to hell?"
  
  - If I go my entire life, living a good life, but never hear about Christ, do I go to hell?
  - If I live that same EXACT life, but I hear about and REJECT Christ, do I go to hell?
  - If I live that same EXACT life, but I hear about and ACCEPT Christ, do I then go to heaven?
  
  In all three scenarios, the life lived is the EXACT same.
  
  That, for me, as a TOUGH one.
• cbus4life

  ernest_t_bass wrote: Another for me is the "why do good people, who don't believe, go to hell?"
  
  - If I go my entire life, living a good life, but never hear about Christ, do I go to hell?
  - If I live that same EXACT life, but I hear about and REJECT Christ, do I go to hell?
  - If I live that same EXACT life, but I hear about and ACCEPT Christ, do I then go to heaven?
  
  In all three scenarios, the life lived is the EXACT same.
  
  That, for me, as a TOUGH one.

  Agreed, Ernest.
  
  This one has destroyed my "belief," essentially, because it bothers the hell out of me and i've yet to get an answer to it that makes any sense whatsoever.
  
  I want to know why some of my best friends, some of the most wonderful human beings i've ever interacted with, apparently won't be going to heaven because they're not Christian.
• 2trap_4ever

  They answer to the above post is this,,,In order to get into heaven you have to believe that there is one true God and he is the creator and that his son died on the cross for your sins and rose again to be with his father.
  
  "No man will make it to heaven on good works alone", I believe that is what the Bible says(or it is something close to that)
• eersandbeers

  cbus4life wrote:

  ernest_t_bass wrote: Another for me is the "why do good people, who don't believe, go to hell?"
  
  - If I go my entire life, living a good life, but never hear about Christ, do I go to hell?
  - If I live that same EXACT life, but I hear about and REJECT Christ, do I go to hell?
  - If I live that same EXACT life, but I hear about and ACCEPT Christ, do I then go to heaven?
  
  In all three scenarios, the life lived is the EXACT same.
  
  That, for me, as a TOUGH one.

  Agreed, Ernest.
  
  This one has destroyed my "belief," essentially, because it bothers the hell out of me and i've yet to get an answer to it that makes any sense whatsoever.
  
  I want to know why some of my best friends, some of the most wonderful human beings i've ever interacted with, apparently won't be going to heaven because they're not Christian.

  
  I actually think this is why many people are turning away from Christianity and moving into their own spirituality.
  
  But if you are a Christian, the only way to Heaven is through Jesus. So to answer the original question, you won't be going to Heaven unless you put your belief in Jesus.
  
  There is no way to tell if one religion is the correct over the others. All are based on faith and not any type of measurable evidence so it is all up to what you believe.
  
  
  I think Gandhi said it best when he wrote, "Religions are different roads converging to the same point. What does it matter that we take different road, so long as we reach the same goal. Wherein is the cause for quarrelling?"
• cbus4life

  I like that quote, Eeers.
  
  I liked what my friend told me, before i moved away, "it is a shame that we'll be going to two different heavens." At least he believed that we'll both be "rewarded" in the afterlife for living a good life here in earth.
  
  And, also, i am also moving into my own, individual type of spirituality and away from Christianity as a whole.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  2trap_4ever wrote: They answer to the above post is this,,,In order to get into heaven you have to believe that there is one true God and he is the creator and that his son died on the cross for your sins and rose again to be with his father.
  
  "No man will make it to heaven on good works alone", I believe that is what the Bible says(or it is something close to that)

  Yes, I understand what the bible says, but I just don't get the scenario. In each of the examples, the life is lived the EXACT same way. EXACT. The ONLY difference is that in the one example, the person has accepted Christ.
  
  It's just something that has been bothering me a lot lately.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  Ephesians 2:8-10 (New International Version)
  
  8For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9not by works, so that no one can boast. 10For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
• Con_Alma

  cbus4life wrote:...
  
  I want to know why some of my best friends, some of the most wonderful human beings i've ever interacted with, apparently won't be going to heaven because they're not Christian.

  
  What makes you think they would want to be there? Do you really want them there if they don't want to be??
  
  If heaven is an eternal spiritual state of being in the presence of God and His love and hell is a state of not being in His presence why is this such a bad thing if your friends go to hell when they don't believe in the birth, death and resurrection of Jesus Christ?
• cbus4life

  Well, i would imagine they wouldn't want to suffer eternal damnation.
  
  So, because they happened to grow up Muslim, they'll be spending eternity in hell?
  
  Or do they go to the Muslim version of "paradise?"
  
  Or are they just screwed, despite being wonderful people, and acting in a "Christ-like" manner that any true Christian would take pride in.
• Con_Alma

  Eternal damnation in the eyes of a Christian is being without the Creator. That's not very damning to
  
  People don't "happen" to be Muslim. Don't they choose to be? If they do they believe they will be eternally in bliss so you have nothing to worry about.
  
  The other side of the coin is that you when/if you are in heaven you won't care who else is/is not there/ The pure peaceful bliss and love you will be feeling coming from the Father will be yor focus not others.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  This is turning into a debate, which I didn't want it to. Can we go back to the original question, please? There are other threads out there, where there is debate.
  
  My purpose in creating this thread, was to share my troubles, as a Christian, and hopefully get some Christian insight, and shared troubles from other Christian brothers/sisters. I am not asking or trying to be right, nor am I looking for the right answer.
  
  So...
  
  To fellow believers, Christians, whatever. In your day-to-day (spiritual) life, what is the toughest part of living that life? What do you find that challenges your own personal beliefs most? What brings you the most "trouble" in your spiritual life?
• Con_Alma

  Didn't think I was debating here at all. When someone posts "I want to know" it is often received as an invitation or solicitation for views and inputs. I offered such.
  
  Topics tend to mature and expand from the original ideas and points. It happens all the time and has created some of the best threads. I'll try and comply with your request, however and stay on point. Sometimes a topic can stray too quickly so I'll do my part in trying to keep that from happening.
  
  In my day to day spiritual life the toughest part is maintaining a balanced life that is entirely centered around my beliefs and core convictions. Then again I once read that I was imperfect and that was to be expected but not accepted.
  
  Challenges to my beliefs are a result of my own laziness and lack of ongoing effort to strengthen my relationship with our Creator.
  
  "Trouble" is brought by the same.
• I Wear Pants

  ernest_t_bass wrote: Another for me is the "why do good people, who don't believe, go to hell?"
  
  - If I go my entire life, living a good life, but never hear about Christ, do I go to hell?
  - If I live that same EXACT life, but I hear about and REJECT Christ, do I go to hell?
  - If I live that same EXACT life, but I hear about and ACCEPT Christ, do I then go to heaven?
  
  In all three scenarios, the life lived is the EXACT same.
  
  That, for me, as a TOUGH one.

  That is a tough one and one that I don't pretend to have the answer for.
  
  I will say that if there was a person who lived a good life and had never heard of god or of Jesus and when he died he was asked if he accepts Christ as his savior and replies "no" in honesty. If that man is damned to hell then god is an asshole.
  
  Quoting the "you don't get to heaven through good works alone" thing doesn't explain that. The scenario Ernest posted goes against every meaning of what is right and fair that we've been taught.
  
  Probably one of the things I struggle the most with as well.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  Con_Alma wrote: Didn't think I was debating here at all.

  I don't remember calling you out, saying that you were.
• Con_Alma

  ...nor did I suggest you were specifically calling me out but rather after reading your comments about the thread turning into a debate I was choosing to pre-empt any possibility that my offerings might be considered debating another's.
  
  I did, however, refer to you later in my post with the words, "your request". Sorry if I was confusing in my wording. I'll be interested in reading others responses to your questions. It could be a good thread. Thanks for starting it.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  ^^^
  I really don't know why this is all been going through my head lately. Probably b/c of the texts I have been choosing to read.
  
  I feel like I am on the edge of some existentialist melt-down, or something.
• Con_Alma

  If you find the answers to your questions it could lead to a solidification of your beliefs. Isn't that ultimately what you are seeking...not matter what those beliefs are?
• ernest_t_bass

  

  I don't think I'll ever find the "answers" to my questions, which is where the whole "faith" thing comes in, with Christ. No one will have the answers until we meet our creator... at least we HOPE he'll fill us in!
• Con_Alma

  You could be right but I hope you keep looking.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  Wouldn't that be some cruel joke if God didn't give us the answers in heaven? Or, if he said that there never really were "answers."
  
  The reason I don't know if I will find my answers is b/c I am not too sure how hard I am actually looking. These things perplex me, but I'm not sure if I am looking in the right places to find these answers.
  
  Perhaps I should pick up the bible? I think I should.
• pmoney25

  

  This is what I posted in the other thread on Serious Business forum
  
  For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness, and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus. (Romans 2:14-16)
  
  It is also mentioned by Paul that those who follow the law will be judged by the law and that God judges all people righteously. I believe it also says those that never heard of the law will be judged by the law that God has placed in their hearts.
  
  So I take this as if you follow the spirit/laws of Jesus Christ, you can enter into heaven without knowing his name. I think we are judged on what we know and how we act on it. So if you know about Jesus and fail to accept his as your savior, then you will go to Hell.
  
  Also for this whole thing to work, God does give us all the law in our heart and our conscience and it is that reason if we disobey that we will be punished.
  
  It is just like having children or employees at your job, if you tell them the law, make sure they understand the law, follow up with them and they still break the law, they deserved to be punished.
• ernest_t_bass

  

  Thank you, PMoney. I remember reading it over there.
• cbus4life

  Con_Alma wrote: Eternal damnation in the eyes of a Christian is being without the Creator. That's not very damning to
  
  People don't "happen" to be Muslim. Don't they choose to be? If they do they believe they will be eternally in bliss so you have nothing to worry about.
  
  The other side of the coin is that you when/if you are in heaven you won't care who else is/is not there/ The pure peaceful bliss and love you will be feeling coming from the Father will be yor focus not others.

  Thanks for the response.
  
  So, in the bolded section, are you saying that their is a possibility that there is more than one afterlife, depending on your belief structure, and that everyone ends up in some sort of eternal "bliss" if they live a life according to their particular religion. Honest question.