2012-2021 Budget

• BGFalcons82

  

  gut;838116 wrote:that number is far scarier if we can't keep getting cheap interest rates from foreign buyers of US treasuries. Between the added debt and increased interest rates, we could easily see that debt service soar to $600-$800B, and then what? The less we cut now, the more will have to be cut later. And you think that would get both parties to the table. That's why if they had real interest in their pet entitlements now they would prioritize to protect those in the future.

  
  That is exactly correct. The interest payments to the debt service holders are at all-time lows. How much longer can this go on? It will continue as long as the dollar continues it's devaluation by the Fed buying them by the hundreds of billions and raising the prices of commodities for EVERYONE. A hidden tax on all Americans...but that's another thread.
  
  You are spot-on to notice that we could be reaching the $1,000,000,000,000 level in yearly debt service should the interest rates return to normal historical levels. Then...all this current chit chat about $2 trillion and $4 trillion cuts will be microscopic. This monster is getting bigger by the day and raising taxes on the evil rotten scumbag rich is akin to peeing in the ocean and seeing how far the water level rises.
• gut

  Seriously. These guys must go to sleep at night patting themsleves on the back for approving another handout with absolutely no concern for wrecking the financial future of this country, not to mention jeopardizing the sustainability of that very handout they're so proud of.
• believer

  

  BGFalcons82;838134 wrote:Then...all this current chit chat about $2 trillion and $4 trillion cuts will be microscopic. This monster is getting bigger by the day and raising taxes on the evil rotten scumbag rich is akin to peeing in the ocean and seeing how far the water level rises.

  The socialist power-base specializes in appealing to the least common denominator to attract the masses (IE: votes) to retain that power even if it means destroying the very economic system that underwrote their rise to power.
  
  This has been going on for nearly a century, hence the size of the monster.
  
  What I don't understand is how the socialists plan to finance their utopia once the monster has finally gobbled up the remaining vestiges of true wealth production.
• revgat

  believer;838666 wrote:The socialist power-base specializes in appealing to the least common denominator to attract the masses (IE: votes) to retain that power even if it means destroying the very economic system that underwrote their rise to power.
  
  This has been going on for nearly a century, hence the size of the monster.
  
  What I don't understand is how the socialists plan to finance their utopia once the monster has finally gobbled up the remaining vestiges of true wealth production.

  
  
  I hope this was a joke, otherwise, you are a lost cause.
• believer

  

  revgat;838696 wrote:I hope this was a joke, otherwise, you are a lost cause.

  Anyone who believes socialism is the answer to our economic ills is not only a lost cause but a complete moron.
• jhay78

  

  believer;838666 wrote:The socialist power-base specializes in appealing to the least common denominator to attract the masses (IE: votes) to retain that power even if it means destroying the very economic system that underwrote their rise to power.
  
  This has been going on for nearly a century, hence the size of the monster.
  
  What I don't understand is how the socialists plan to finance their utopia once the monster has finally gobbled up the remaining vestiges of true wealth production.

  Margaret Thatcher had that figured out about 30 years ago: "The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money." We're in the red $14.3 Trillion and Democrats think they have a God-given birthright to even more of other people's money.
  
  Mark Steyn smashed one out of the park recently:
  http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/272560/planless-dems-mark-steyn?page=1
  

  Obama has done his best to pretend to take them seriously. He claimed to have a $4 trillion deficit-reduction plan. The court eunuchs of the press corps were impressed, and went off to file pieces hailing the president as “the grown-up in the room.” There is, in fact, no plan. No plan at all. No plan whatsoever, either for a deficit reduction of $4 trillion or $4.73. As is the way in Washington, merely announcing that he had a plan absolved him of the need to have one. So the president’s staff got out the extra-wide teleprompter and wrote a really large number on it, and simply by reading out the really large number the president was deemed to have produced a serious blueprint for trillions of dollars in savings. For his next trick, he’ll walk out on to the stage of Carnegie Hall, announce that he’s going to play Haydn’s Cello Concerto No. 2, and, even though there’s no cello in sight and Obama immediately climbs back in his golf cart to head for the links, music critics will hail it as one of the most moving performances they’ve ever heard.

  And this gem:
  

  It seems reasonable to conclude from the planlessness and budgetlessness of the Obama/Reid Democrats that their only plan is to carry on spending without limit. Otherwise, someone somewhere would surely have written something down on a piece of paper by now. But no, apparently the Department of Writing Down Plans is the only federal expense the president is willing to cut. You begin to see why the Europeans are a little miffed. They’re passing austerity budgets so austere they’ve spawned an instant anti-austerity movement rioting in the street — and yet they’re still getting downgraded by the ratings agencies. In Washington, by contrast, the ruling party of the Brokest Nation in History has no spending plan other than to plan to spend even more — and nobody’s downgrading them.
  
  Well, don’t worry. It’s coming. The domestic media coverage of this story has been almost laughably fraudulent: To the court eunuchs, a failure to raise the debt ceiling by a couple of trillion would signal to the world that American government was embarrassingly dysfunctional. In reality, raising the debt ceiling by a couple of trillion without any spending cuts would confirm to the world that American government is terminally dysfunctional.

  The rest of the world has to be laughing hysterically at us right now.
• believer

  

  jhay78;839427 wrote:The rest of the world has to be laughing hysterically at us right now.

  NAW...they're too busy trying to fix their own socialist utopian messes.
• Footwedge

  jhay78;839427 wrote:Margaret Thatcher had that figured out about 30 years ago: "The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money." We're in the red $14.3 Trillion and Democrats think they have a God-given birthright to even more of other people's money.
  
  Mark Steyn smashed one out of the park recently:
  http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/272560/planless-dems-mark-steyn?page=1
  
  
  
  And this gem:
  
  
  
  The rest of the world has to be laughing hysterically at us right now.

  I read Steyn's article. Interesting that he lambasted Reid Pelosi and Obama for "having no plan." Yet, over those 2 pages, nary one specific from Steyn regarding his plan...or more specifically, what he would cut. I'm in Boehner's corner big time on the issue at hand. However, it would be kind of nice if they would spell out where the cuts would come from. They don't...and they won't...because just like the other party, there's an election to be won down the road.
• Footwedge

  jhay78;839427 wrote:Margaret Thatcher had that figured out about 30 years ago: "The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money." We're in the red $14.3 Trillion and Democrats think they have a God-given birthright to even more of other people's money.
  
  Mark Steyn smashed one out of the park recently:
  http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/272560/planless-dems-mark-steyn?page=1
  
  
  
  And this gem:
  
  
  
  The rest of the world has to be laughing hysterically at us right now.

  Ah yes...Mark Steyn.....another neoconservative that loves war.....never served a day, (typical of the NR...Horowitz, Lowry, Goldberg and the whole gang) and a guy who somehow thinks Islam and Sharia law will someday rule our country. What a guy!
  
  I read his whole article....and what is the norm for him....not one peep on what exactly he would cut....as in specifics. One thing is certain though, Steyn and his cohorts at the NR would never subscribe to cutting anything here....
  
  http://old.news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110723/pl_nm/us_usa_afghanistan_waste
• Manhattan Buckeye

  Mark Steyn isn't POTUS Footie, and this comment from the article is spot on:
  
  "Obama has done his best to pretend to take them seriously. He claimed to have a $4 trillion deficit-reduction plan. The court eunuchs of the press corps were impressed, and went off to file pieces hailing the president as “the grown-up in the room.” There is, in fact, no plan"
  
  When Steyn runs for POTUS you can criticize him for his lack of vision, until now we have the "whatever he is" in office now, and he's a poor, poor leader.
• coyotes22

  

  Manhattan Buckeye;840302 wrote:Mark Steyn isn't POTUS Footie, and this comment from the article is spot on:
  
  "Obama has done his best to pretend to take them seriously. He claimed to have a $4 trillion deficit-reduction plan. The court eunuchs of the press corps were impressed, and went off to file pieces hailing the president as “the grown-up in the room.” There is, in fact, no plan"
  
  When Steyn runs for POTUS you can criticize him for his lack of vision, until now we have the "whatever he is" in office now, and he's a poor, poor leader.

  No, he has trillions! We are the poor ones.
  
  
• Manhattan Buckeye

  He's out Cartering Jimmy Carter - he's a lousy POTUS. We're all suffering.
• coyotes22

  

  I hear that there is $40 billion in GDP, that we are sitting on, in untapped energy resources. Due to not processing, or slowly processing, drilling approvals. And over 236,000 jobs.
  
  There is your answer to the unemployment, and income revenue. No need to raise taxes. JUST LET US DRILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  
  Instead, we allow other countries to drill, and then send THEM OUR money!! What is so hard to understand about this?!?!?!?
• gut

  $40B in increased GDP? The taxes on that would barely cover Obama's vacations and golf outings.
• coyotes22

  

  gut;840528 wrote:$40B in increased GDP? The taxes on that would barely cover Obama's vacations and golf outings.

  
  Well,,,,,,,
• coyotes22

  

  Always trying to make it "fair":
  

  That’s where things stand. President Obama is demanding the GOP violate their non-negotiable pledge on taxes so that he can fulfill his pledge to reform entitlements. The President repeatedly called this a “fair deal” yesterday. Well, it certainly is fair to him.

  http://hotair.com/archives/2011/07/24/obamas-fair-deal-violate-your-tax-pledge-so-i-can-keep-my-pledge-to-reform-entitlements/
• derek bomar

  

  this whole thing is gross
• coyotes22

  

  Instead of worrying about creating new "Legislative Body's" just cut a damn deal!
  
  http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/23/super-congress-debt-ceiling_n_907887.html
• gut

  coyotes22;840728 wrote:Instead of worrying about creating new "Legislative Body's" just cut a damn deal!
  
  http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/23/super-congress-debt-ceiling_n_907887.html

  Wow. Let's set their goal at something reasonable like....NOTHING, since that's what they are likely to accomplish.
  
  It may also be time to start with SPECIFIC funding for entitlements and other spending. When you pass a new entitlement, you earmark the tax that's going to pay for it. When that tax inevitably falls short of budget, then you cut your budget you don't go pilfer another program. Entitlements are really hard to cut, and what's gotten us to this point are unrealistic assumptions in growth and efficiency leaving programs underfunded across the board. Obamakare I'm sure is a disaster in the making. But SS and Medicare is a great example - ignoring the damage done by raiding that surplus over the years, you've got taxes earmarked for it so either you raise those SPECIFIC taxes or you cut the benefits (and the ideal solution is probably a combination of both). And the best part is it would end this ridiculous partisan gridlock, because instead of seeing who plays the shell game the best there would be only two options to consider as opposed to arguing over who you can soak and who you can fool to keep kicking the can down the road.
• coyotes22

  

  Its this type of thinking that is killing America.
  

  “The current, so-called ‘debt crisis’ has been completely manufactured by House Republicans attempting to advance an extremist agenda. This should be a simple vote to allow the US Treasury to fund all of the programs and obligations of the entire federal government that are already in the law,” said Rep. Lee in a statement handed out to reporters before a Democratic press conference on jobs at the Capitol.

  http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/democratic-rep-debt-crisis-has-been-manu
• coyotes22

  

  Now who is acting like a child?
  

  The Speaker, Sen. Reid and Sen. McConnell all agreed on the general framework of a two-part plan. A short-term increase (with cuts greater than the increase), combined with a committee to find long-term savings before the rest of the increase would be considered. Sen. Reid took the bipartisan plan to the White House and the President said no.”

  *taken from the tea party patriots facebook page*
• coyotes22

  

  $8 Billion in loses, yes cut the USPS out of the budget, please.
  
  http://www.huffingtonpost.com/huff-wires/20110725/us-postal-problems/
  
  The Government cant manage a simple thing like processing and delivering mail, yet, they think they will be able to manage health care? Give me a break!
  Privatize the USPS, and cut loose this black hole of tax payer money.
• gut

  The internet/email is eating the USPS' lunch. Any company that had to be run profitably would make the necessary adjustments. 90% of my mail is junk mail, anyway, that goes right to the trash because I do almost everything (everything that I can) electronically these days.
• Con_Alma

  coyotes22;841396 wrote:...
  Privatize the USPS, and cut loose this black hole of tax payer money.

  I've got no problem with privatizing them but the feds have pulled money out of the postal Service for many years. Pay those IOUs first and then cut them loose.
• QuakerOats

  barack obama -- about to preside over the first US credit downgrade ........ change we can believe in .......
  
  
  
  Prepare for U.S. Downgrade: Wall Street
  
  By Shanthi Bharatwaj 07/25/11 -
  
  Analysts from the largest Wall Street banks warned Monday that the U.S. could face a downgrade even if an agreement to raise the debt ceiling is reached, unless the plan makes ambitious and credible cuts to the deficit.
  
  More on Economy
  Senate Democrats: No New TaxesBoehner Prepares to Move on Debt LimitDebt-Ceiling Drama Tops Marquee in Coming WeekMarket Activity
  Citigroup Inc| C DOWNBank of America Corporation| BAC DOWNMarkets have for months believed that policymakers will reach an agreement over deficit reduction and avoid default. But with policymakers still at an impasse over the debt debate a week away from the deadline, investors are weary of rosy headlines.
  
  That means policymakers will no longer have the luxury of debating without pressure from the markets according to Citigroup(C_) economist Steven Weiting. "A confidence building agreement might be reached at any time. Perhaps continued very late bickering should have been expected," he wrote in a note." But markets should be focused on a likely sovereign ratings downgrade on all but the most ambitious of fiscal consolidation agreements. Policymakers' press comments increasingly suggest this is out of reach in the near term."
  
  He expects a ratings downgrade to come as soon as an agreement is reached- "unless the most ambitious of bi-partisan plans is revived."
  
  Weiting also expects the budget acrimony to continue for some time to come. "With demographic and entitlement cost realities ignored by the extremes on both sides of the political spectrum, like the red ink, agonizing budget debates will still loom as far as the eye can see once the 2011 debt ceiling debate is resolved."
  
  Martin Mauro, fixed income strategist at Bank of America Merrill Lynch (BAC_) expects Congress to raise the debt ceiling by August 2 but will arrive at the debt reduction package in two stages, which could lead to downgrades in the municipal market and maybe an S&P downgrade to U.S. Treasury debt by the end of the year.
  
  He also expects a ratings downgrade for Treasury debt would translate to a similar downgrade for municipal pre-refunded debt and the debt of Fannie Mae(FNMA.OB)and Freddie Mac(FMCC.OB).
  
  "We recommend that investors position for a short-term agreement that will likely avoid default, yet not resolve the long-term debt challenges. This outcome would likely lead to a downgrade of Treasury debt by S&P and perhaps other rating agencies," the analyst wrote in a note. However the analyst does not view more extreme scenarios-Treasury default or prolonged period of debt prioritization as very likely.
  
  http://www.thestreet.com/story/11197565/1/prepare-for-us-downgrade-wall-street.html?puc=msn&cm_ven=msn